thogaa Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 I need cheering up guys Decided to make a list of my purchases for the past six months: PAM 47mm Submersible AR scratched from inside No fix Rolex vintage sun ETA Bezel insert wasn't on when received Fixed locally UPO Planet Ocean 45mm Bracelet fell apart Returned Rolex Vintage GMT Jubilee bracelet Crown + stem fell out Tossed in bin Graham Chronofighter Oversize Diver Crown fell off Fixed locally PAM 250 SS Luminor Daylight 7750 Crown guard doesn't shut tight Tossed in bin Blue ceramic SS Rolex Submariner ETA Date not functioning Returned Breitling Montbrillant Legende Lug screw broke and fell out Waiting for parts 4 months AP Roo RG Rubberclad $558 Minutes hand stained Awaiting parts Blacksteel Limited Ed Super Avenger PVD/RU Blk 7750 movement seized Returned Skyland Avenger Chrono Black/Rubber movement seized Returned Super Avenger SS Black movement seized, bezel ring cannot turn Returned Super Avenger SS Rubber Dial with fingerprints, cleaned Breitling avenger seawolf yellow dial Ocean diver strap w/o pins Fixed locally IWC Big Pilot working PR power reserve 45 minutes then seizes Returned AP ROO Black Themes ultimate sec@12 Broken bracelet + missing screw Waited 34 days for parts Rolex DSSD Recieved V3 paid for V5 Returned Skyland Avenger PVD Limited ed Repaired watch came back with same fault Returned AP ROO Silver Themes ultimate sec@12 returned. Seconds hand jitter Returned Deepsea 3135 316f Rotor and bridge part fell off Fixed locally Deepsea 3135 316f PVD Rotor fell off Fixed locally AP Roo Safari secs@12 Seconds hand hacking Must fix locally Daytona 2008 Design SS/SS White Num A-7750 Seconds hand moves +2 secs Returned PAM341 60mm Seized by Customs Lost Rolex Deepsea DSSD reship Seized by Customs Lost PAM 60mm reship Seized by Customs Lost Omega seamaster 300 vintage Worked for 1 day - rotor fell off Fixed locally Rolex 6538 MBW ETA $400 Wrong case wrong lugs wrong bezel insert ETZ shut down It's not all bad: I present to you - the watches that worked out of the box: Breitling avenger seawolf Watch OK Rolex super seadweller Watch OK Rolex white seadweller vintage Watch OK Breitling SuperOcean Heritage SS Black RB Watch OK Rolex Anni GMT SS Black Asia 3186 V serials Watch OK Pam341 BLACK 60MM OVERSIZE Watch OK Royal Oak Offshore sec@12Rubberclad w/ leatherstrap Watch OK Breitling SuperOcean Heritage + mesh band Watch OK Superocean Steelfish SS/RU Blue/Brown leather strap Watch OK Breitling skyland avenger SS/Leather Watch OK Tag Heuer Aqua Racer 500m blue SS Watch OK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 I would be unhappy as well. My question is what dealer or dealers did they come from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 (edited) No. I had one PAM 105 which wasn't water resistant out of the box, the dealer replaced it, and the replacement was water resistant. The first 111h I ordered(different dealer), the power reserve only lasted a few hours. The dealer exchanged it for an Omega Aqua Terra which I customized as a birthday present for my dad. Oh, and I ordered a Rolex DJ for my wife which had a link fall out the bracelet (different dealer again, but again, the replacement was fine) Other than those incidents, I've always received satisfactory goods [Edit to add] I forgot about the Omega X-33s I received from Silix which weren't really satisfactory, and they also sent me the wrong vintage Sub, but that's the only really negative experiences I've had with stuff. Edited March 27, 2010 by TeeJay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thogaa Posted March 27, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 I would be unhappy as well. My question is what dealer or dealers did they come from? Based on the above here are the numbers ETZ PC TRUSTY WATCHEDEN Bought 3 9 21 6 Perfect 0 3 7 1 Defect 3 6 14 5 My conclusion: If you buy from ETZ you could expect 100% failure Watcheden comes in second at only 83% failure Both PC and trusty offers the best purchase at only 67% failure So IMO from the best dealers here expect 1/3 watches to be perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gran Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 :o :o With that volume of watches I would have considered buying 1 or 2 genuines... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FxrAndy Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 That is a lot of watches you bought! When you say tossed in the bin, that is a shame as most of thoses faults could be sorted with a little time and knowledge or at the works case sold as parts, i notices the vintage GMT and the pam 250 that i am sure i could have fixed for you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbjoer Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 An amazing no of watches there!!! I thought I was a serious case of compulsive rep shopping, but this has beaten me hands down. And I am certain that I would not have persisted if I had had so many problems. As to my experiences, I have had almost no problems with the ones I have bought from my preferred dealer, Mary @ Watchinternational. You should try her. She really does inspect the watches prior to shipment and is a nice person on top of it. But nor have I had issues with timeshop, Hont, Aoobuy or Watcheden, from whom I have also bought watches. You have been very unlucky, I think. Here is a little write-up about a specific experience I had with Watchinternational: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxman Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 To throw away a beautiful rep like the 250 for a little thing like the CG not closing right Im sorry but I just cant understand throwing away a watch with a little nothing of a problem. But It's your money and you of course can do as you wish. Maybe donating those watches to RWG would be better than [censored] canning them. I do wish you better luck In the furture. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deniz21 Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 To throw away a beautiful rep like the 250 for a little thing like the CG not closing right Im sorry but I just cant understand throwing away a watch with a little nothing of a problem. But It's your money and you of course can do as you wish. Maybe donating those watches to RWG would be better than [censored] canning them. I do wish you better luck In the furture. Mike +1 from me, sorry but thats weird man i wish you more luck in the future... i am 50/50 so far, a pam that i recieved from a well known modder, had a totally [censored] up crystal, but this is now at a crystal change (thank you ma hawaian brother) . and a upo that was just perfect. best regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxman Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 +1 from me, sorry but thats weird man i wish you more luck in the future... i am 50/50 so far, a pam that i recieved from a well known modder, had a totally [censored] up crystal, but this is now at a crystal change (thank you ma hawaian brother) . and a upo that was just perfect. best regards Soon Deniz It will be 75/25, the Skyland will be perfect, Im sure of It Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thogaa Posted March 27, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 To throw away a beautiful rep like the 250 for a little thing like the CG not closing right Im sorry but I just cant understand throwing away a watch with a little nothing of a problem. But It's your money and you of course can do as you wish. Maybe donating those watches to RWG would be better than [censored] canning them. I do wish you better luck In the furture. Mike That was a pre-RWG experience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thogaa Posted March 27, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 :o :o With that volume of watches I would have considered buying 1 or 2 genuines... Who says I didn't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxman Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 That was a pre-RWG experience Fair enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiker01 Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 Based on the above here are the numbers ETZ PC TRUSTY WATCHEDEN Bought 3 9 21 6 Perfect 0 3 7 1 Defect 3 6 14 5 My conclusion: If you buy from ETZ you could expect 100% failure Watcheden comes in second at only 83% failure Both PC and trusty offers the best purchase at only 67% failure So IMO from the best dealers here expect 1/3 watches to be perfect. That is not a good rate at all on our side ...........the buyers! 67% is like saying 7 out of 10 is going to be bad! That's not good at all......which is sad to say, the same experience I'm having! Yawza!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katerchen Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 :o :o With that volume of watches I would have considered buying 1 or 2 genuines... +1 same thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMK000 Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 I need cheering up guys Decided to make a list of my purchases for the past six months: PAM 47mm Submersible AR scratched from inside No fix Rolex vintage sun ETA Bezel insert wasn't on when received Fixed locally UPO Planet Ocean 45mm Bracelet fell apart Returned Rolex Vintage GMT Jubilee bracelet Crown + stem fell out Tossed in bin Graham Chronofighter Oversize Diver Crown fell off Fixed locally PAM 250 SS Luminor Daylight 7750 Crown guard doesn't shut tight Tossed in bin Blue ceramic SS Rolex Submariner ETA Date not functioning Returned Breitling Montbrillant Legende Lug screw broke and fell out Waiting for parts 4 months AP Roo RG Rubberclad $558 Minutes hand stained Awaiting parts Blacksteel Limited Ed Super Avenger PVD/RU Blk 7750 movement seized Returned Skyland Avenger Chrono Black/Rubber movement seized Returned Super Avenger SS Black movement seized, bezel ring cannot turn Returned Super Avenger SS Rubber Dial with fingerprints, cleaned Breitling avenger seawolf yellow dial Ocean diver strap w/o pins Fixed locally IWC Big Pilot working PR power reserve 45 minutes then seizes Returned AP ROO Black Themes ultimate sec@12 Broken bracelet + missing screw Waited 34 days for parts Rolex DSSD Recieved V3 paid for V5 Returned Skyland Avenger PVD Limited ed Repaired watch came back with same fault Returned AP ROO Silver Themes ultimate sec@12 returned. Seconds hand jitter Returned Deepsea 3135 316f Rotor and bridge part fell off Fixed locally Deepsea 3135 316f PVD Rotor fell off Fixed locally AP Roo Safari secs@12 Seconds hand hacking Must fix locally Daytona 2008 Design SS/SS White Num A-7750 Seconds hand moves +2 secs Returned PAM341 60mm Seized by Customs Lost Rolex Deepsea DSSD reship Seized by Customs Lost PAM 60mm reship Seized by Customs Lost Omega seamaster 300 vintage Worked for 1 day - rotor fell off Fixed locally Rolex 6538 MBW ETA $400 Wrong case wrong lugs wrong bezel insert ETZ shut down It's not all bad: I present to you - the watches that worked out of the box: Breitling avenger seawolf Watch OK Rolex super seadweller Watch OK Rolex white seadweller vintage Watch OK Breitling SuperOcean Heritage SS Black RB Watch OK Rolex Anni GMT SS Black Asia 3186 V serials Watch OK Pam341 BLACK 60MM OVERSIZE Watch OK Royal Oak Offshore sec@12Rubberclad w/ leatherstrap Watch OK Breitling SuperOcean Heritage + mesh band Watch OK Superocean Steelfish SS/RU Blue/Brown leather strap Watch OK Breitling skyland avenger SS/Leather Watch OK Tag Heuer Aqua Racer 500m blue SS Watch OK :black_eye: My bad quality / defective rep rate was 2 out of 5 ... but yours is the opposite Any way , Quality Control was never present in reps and it never will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thogaa Posted March 27, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 I don't get why the dealers still dropships when they could avoid almost any of the issues I have had by simply inspecting the watch before shipping it half way round the earth. What triggers me is when I pay the cost of returning the watch for exchange and the exchange getting seized by customs. So I loose both the watch and the money. Great! They should do little or no QC of cheap reps and EVERY single high end rep should be tested. How can they ship out a POS watch having charged half a grand or more? Anyway spring is comming so I will do a spring clean of my sock drawer and hand some of the watches over to the Forum. - All of my AP's are off to Francisco to be modded and serviced. I accept that there are a few lemons to be had when buying from our Asian friends - and this thread is most of all to share the experience and get you to stay alert. I am truly happy with the ones that actually work and I'm sure when proper service and TLC have been applied to the rest of the keepers they will be cherished just as much as my gens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff g Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 Used to be that you bought watches from a dealer who gave a [censored]. For the most part in the past few years that attitude from many of our recommended dealers has become a thing of the past. My feeling is that the main reason for this is because the rep market has exploded. Many of our 'trusted' dealers have so many orders that it has become impossible for most of them to have any kind of quality control. MOST dealers are drop shippers, and NEVER see, much less' inspect the product they sell. What can we expect? Additionally, in the not so distant past most of the finest reps were made in Taiwan, not 'China'. These days few if any reps are made in TW. That being the case, it is just another reason that so many of the current reps available are not well made. Some are of course, but most are not. Buy from the dealer who does not drop ship and you will get a much better quality product, period. 5 or 6 years ago MANY reps were wearable (Not perfect mind you) but definitely wearable, out of the box. That is no longer the case. Many of us who used to be collectors are now sending the watches we care about out for modding, as well as servicing, in order to bring today's product up to par. I will say that the last two 300.00 reps I have purchased have been CRAP. IMO actually unwearable. Garbage. It has not always been the case with a rep that cost that amount of money. In fact 5 or 6 years ago many 100.00 to 300.00 reps were GREAT watches quality wise. Find a dealer who guarantees his product. And even more important, a dealer who actually gives a [censored] about what he sells. Sending a watch back to China to be fixed, much less replaced (with something that is equally bad) is an effort in futility. Recently I purchased my first rep in over a year...after receiving it I contacted my dealer, complained about the quality, and was told, oh well try again next time perhaps the next will be better. After spending over 200.00 for it (non eta), I GAVE the watch away for parts. Most probably I will never buy another rep, certainly not from ANY of the China dropshippers who frequent our rep forums. Waaaaaa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxman Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 Used to be that you bought watches from a dealer who gave a [censored]. For the most part in the past few years that attitude from many of our recommended dealers has become a thing of the past. My feeling is that the main reason for this is because the rep market has exploded. Many of our 'trusted' dealers have so many orders that it has become impossible for most of them to have any kind of quality control. MOST dealers are drop shippers, and NEVER see, much less' inspect the product they sell. What can we expect? Additionally, in the not so distant past most of the finest reps were made in Taiwan, not 'China'. These days few if any reps are made in TW. That being the case, it is just another reason that so many of the current reps available are not well made. Some are of course, but most are not. Buy from the dealer who does not drop ship and you will get a much better quality product, period. 5 or 6 years ago MANY reps were wearable (Not perfect mind you) but definitely wearable, out of the box. That is no longer the case. Many of us who used to be collectors are now sending the watches we care about out for modding, as well as servicing, in order to bring today's product up to par. I will say that the last two 300.00 reps I have purchased have been CRAP. IMO actually unwearable. Garbage. It has not always been the case with a rep that cost that amount of money. In fact 5 or 6 years ago many 100.00 to 300.00 reps were GREAT watches quality wise. Find a dealer who guarantees his product. And even more important, a dealer who actually gives a [censored] about what he sells. Sending a watch back to China to be fixed, much less replaced (with something that is equally bad) is an effort in futility. Recently I purchased my first rep in over a year...after receiving it I contacted my dealer, complained about the quality, and was told, oh well try again next time perhaps the next will be better. After spending over 200.00 for it (non eta), I GAVE the watch away for parts. Most probably I will never buy another rep, certainly not from ANY of the China dropshippers who frequent our rep forums. Waaaaaa. Dam Jeff only the last 300 reps? Im sure you can do better than that. Dont be so dam cheep, maybe If you would buy a few reps once in a while you would have a better experence, cheep bestard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WatchnRoll Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 I remember the words of the infamous Eddie Lee... "Rep is rep" Meaning, you buy a rep and you take the risk of failure. I personally would never buy that many reps and repeatedly have these issues. I own a few reps, one Gen and that's it. Reps will fail...it's just a matter of time. They are made in the worst conditions by people who don't give a crap...it's a risk of who built it for you and if they even cared if it works right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gran Posted March 27, 2010 Report Share Posted March 27, 2010 I remember the words of the infamous Eddie Lee... "Rep is rep" Meaning, you buy a rep and you take the risk of failure. I personally would never buy that many reps and repeatedly have these issues. I own a few reps, one Gen and that's it. Reps will fail...it's just a matter of time. They are made in the worst conditions by people who don't give a crap...it's a risk of who built it for you and if they even cared if it works right. how cynical I dont wanna hear this.....lets hope they care I care Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted March 28, 2010 Report Share Posted March 28, 2010 I don't get why the dealers still dropships when they could avoid almost any of the issues I have had by simply inspecting the watch before shipping it half way round the earth. They should do little or no QC of cheap reps and EVERY single high end rep should be tested. How can they ship out a POS watch having charged half a grand or more? You might find buying cheaper reps more satisfactory than you think, ie less money down the crapper if things don't go to plan... CQout.com might not always offer the SuperReps, but the 'three strikes' policy is solid, even Tonyxkf aka WatchEden got struck out there because of buyers with unrealistic expectations complaining about the product or some minor glitch in the transaction, which forum members would understand and accept as 'part of the course' for our hobby. How many of the forum trusted dealers would still be selling here if the forum operated a 'three strikes' policy? I guess at the end of the day, it depends on just how important it is to you that the rep be 100% accurate to the gen watch out of the box... If I recall, Freddy's vintage GMT was built on a low-profile vintage Sub case from Silix, the exact same case as the current '6200 project' I'm wearing... It's just a matter of working with what's available at the best value for money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted March 28, 2010 Report Share Posted March 28, 2010 how cynical I dont wanna hear this.....lets hope they care I care Cynical, but likely very accurate... Caring is sometimes having to take the 'raw materials' of the out of the box rep, and having to finish the job The builders might not care, but we do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronin Posted March 29, 2010 Report Share Posted March 29, 2010 PAM341 60mm Seized by Customs Lost Rolex Deepsea DSSD reship Seized by Customs Lost PAM 60mm reship Seized by Customs Lost Yikes! At this rate, I wonder if you have "burned" your current address...??? 5 or 6 years ago MANY reps were wearable (Not perfect mind you) but definitely wearable, out of the box. That is no longer the case. Many of us who used to be collectors are now sending the watches we care about out for modding, as well as servicing, in order to bring today's product up to par. I will say that the last two 300.00 reps I have purchased have been CRAP. IMO actually unwearable. Garbage. It has not always been the case with a rep that cost that amount of money. In fact 5 or 6 years ago many 100.00 to 300.00 reps were GREAT watches quality wise. I just had a conversation with a friend who travels to Asia regularly, and buys the cheap "Canal Street" quality reps in the sub-$20 range. He thinks I am crazy for paying our prices. His $20 watches all 21J surprisingly have a pretty good track record-- cosmetics aside. Sad thing, and I have noticed this trend as well, my 13 and 26 year old "CN" reps are STILL running while some of the newer items REQUIRE immediate attention and service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star69 Posted March 29, 2010 Report Share Posted March 29, 2010 well well well - reps may be getting visually better ... the quality goes down one of the reason i stopped buying reps - think about the nice genuine watches you could have bought with your hard earned money but on the other hand you made some asian cocksuckers that call themself dealers very very happy cheers, Frank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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