Yet Another Pictorial of the Cartel 111J and 177L.. lotsa pics

[burnz]

EMS came through just in time for christmas

was a little worried about the shipping delays during the festive season, but i guess it helps being in Asia and relatively close to China.

anyway, the pros and cons on these latest 111J and 177L have been well documented and fiercely debated over, so i shall not go into that.

all i want to say is that being an owner of a number of PAM gens currently, i'm absolutely amazed at the quality of these latest reps, especially the 177L. and honestly for the money they're asking for, it's a no brainer. they are extremely good out of the box, very decent lume, though the more nitpicky ones will always find something to mod/improve. but for the general population, i'd just say change out the rep strap and put on a quality pair of shoes and you're good to go.

i'd probably wear these for a while, before cannabalising some of the parts for future projects. might even pick up a couple more of these just for the caseset since it sure is a pretty damn good caseset.

anyway, on to the pics... hope you like them

[Ztech]

Awesome! I think I'm going to have to pull the trigger on one of these. Enjoy them in good health and Merry Christmas!

[krpster]

Very nice indeed. That 177 looks amazing!

[TK471]

I think I'm going to have to pull the trigger on that 177. It's just too perfect a beater to pass up. It's not perfection, but at less than 300? NO BRAINER. Thanks for sharing your pics.

[StormTooper4]

Your Pictures are the mutts nuts, seriously. Every other set I've seen have shown the font to be white (again) but yours just capture it right. Thanks for sharing

ST4

[burnz]

thanks guys. glad the pics were useful.

yes, at the $200 price point, the 177L is seriously a no-brainer.

@ST4, yes the font is definitely not white. the gen's font is ivory in color. the 111J rep dial scores a home run in that respect, while 177L's font color is still off.

[TK471]

Overall, which would you say is the better of the two?

[cochese2323]

I pulled the trigger on the 111 on the 16th but mine didn't make it for Christmas.... can't wait to see it though. All these pics make me jealous!

sent from my HTC Evo via Tapatalk

[cib0rgman]

thanks guys. glad the pics were useful.

yes, at the $200 price point, the 177L is seriously a no-brainer.

@ST4, yes the font is definitely not white. the gen's font is ivory in color. the 111J rep dial scores a home run in that respect, while 177L's font color is still off.

Which dealer is this from other dealers sale it for 218 plus shipping

[Racer686]

I pulled the trigger on the 111 on the 16th but mine didn't make it for Christmas.... can't wait to see it though. All these pics make me jealous!

sent from my HTC Evo via Tapatalk

I ordered the 177 on the 20th and just got the QC pix today. Supposedly the Ti Buckle was the hold up (waiting on more of them).

[burnz]

Overall, which would you say is the better of the two?

i would pick the 177L.. just feels more gen-like, though to be fair the 111J is not shabby at all..

Which dealer is this from other dealers sale it for 218 plus shipping

got these from Tony at http://www.asian7750.com

he's selling the 177L at $198 plus shipping.

[Rolexman]

i would pick the 177L.. just feels more gen-like,

First of all thanks for sharing! Based on what would you say makes the 177 more gen-like? Judging form the pics I would say the 111 is the better choise. It has a better finished movement (gen like côtes, engraved OP, and right dagger) beter crown/ tube etc...

[hambone]

Nice pair! They really are good out of the boc Pams for the money. It is a shame we cannot seem to et the swiss movements any more. Even DSN has none.

[pabler]

Hey B,

can you pose some lume shots?

Very nice pair of watches you have here!!!

[MAHLER]

I am in love with the 177L , the rubber strap measures 24/24 or 24/22 ?

[burnz]

Sure will take some Lyme shots tonight once I get home from work.

As for the rubber strap that comes on the 177, I believe it is 24/22, but I'll check and re-confirm later again.

[MAHLER]

As for the rubber strap that comes on the 177, I believe it is 24/22, but I'll check and re-confirm later again.

Thanks !!

[mjmurphy926]

Nice! Yeah, I may need a 177 too...

[aheeeee]

+1

[Rolexman]

My question stands. See #12

[burnz]

My question stands. See #12

matter of personal preference. they each have their pros and cons.

the main flaw of the 177L is in the movement, but in all seriousness, any of us who are experienced enough in this hobby will know that none of the rep movements will stand up to the test (in terms of accuracy to gen), with the exception of Little Hero movement.

the 111J does have a better crown-case gap when CG lever is closed, although the 111J has a noticeably bigger gap between the end of the CG lever (where the CG pin is) and the CG. This is where the 177 is noticeably better.

on the crystal, the 177L does have a better crystal (in terms of clarity and AR coating color), as compared to the 111J.

the lume job is also better and more evenly done on the 177L, whereas on the 111J you will see that the lume on the hands is noticeably weaker than the indices.

why I chose the 177 is mainly due to the superb finish and fitment quality of the Ti caseset. I don't think I've seen a rep Ti PAM caseset that is as well-finished, and comparable to my gen titanium 305.

Even DSN's Ti case finish doesn't match the level of this 177, which has a Ti color shade that is extremely close to gen Ti PAM.

so as you can see, both have their pros and cons. where 111J scores, the 177L makes up for it in other aspects.

[Rolexman]

Thanks very much! Great to hear your observations and motivation. Helps with making a decision!

[professor_yaffle1]

Brilliant review, thanks burnz

The pictures and comparisons make this look so good that I pulled the trigger earlier today and ordered from Andrew, which is quite a big deal for me since a) I was about to list a big chunk of my collection to fund a gen, and I haven't bought from a dealer for over a year (other members yes, but no 'new' watches as such).......suffice to say I'll be counting the days till it arrives

Only question remaining is which strap suits this watch best? I'm pretty sure I'm going to get a dark brown gator with a brushed deployant, but I'm unsure as to whether I should just go for a nice matte antique finish, or JV style?

For those that already have this watch on new shoes, would be great to see some pics....

[deniz21]

im very happy that i have exactly the same strap at home, its a heroic, maybe you like this prof? oh yes thank you very much for this comparsion burnz, great job and pics

btw this is a gen

only thing is i dont have a ti buckle damit

or would it be not much of a difference to a ti buckle?

http://img220.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img05472801012.jpg

Edited December 31, 2010 by deniz21

[professor_yaffle1]

im very happy that i have exactly the same strap at home, its a heroic, maybe you like this prof? oh yes thank you very much for this comparsion burnz, great job and pics

btw this is a gen

only thing is i dont have a ti buckle damit

or would it be not much of a difference to a ti buckle?

http://img220.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img05472801012.jpg

Very nice strap Deniz, but there were a couple of things I couldn't quite determine from the picture - is it the sueded JV style, and what shade of brown is it? It looks sort of mid-brown, like a dark honey tan almost, but it could just be the background or the lighting. Either way it really suits the Ti case, and thanks for the pointer, hadn't cosnidered Heroic, better have a look on Risti and see what there is.

Cheers,

S