ttony0992 Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 sometimes shakedowns are good, factories might buy better, more precise equipment to manufacture products))) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gran Posted March 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 sometimes shakedowns are good, factories might buy better, more precise equipment to manufacture products))) So they were raided for making cheap replicas? PROFESIOAL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
URkuk Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 MY first rep, has to be at least 20 years old. I beat the hell out of this thing. it is OFFICIALL CERTIFIED so it came from the quality factory... It just sits in a drawer but I have to admit all I have to do is touch it and it begins to run... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 I'm not sure if what we are seeing is not the future of Reps. When most of us "old guys" started here and on the old RWG and other forums, China was a totally different country than what it is today. Ten years or so back, there were no international luxury brands to speak of in China. Today, China is one of the biggest and most lucrative markets in the world. The rising middle class, and the wealthy entrepreneurs have totally changed the dynamics. When there was no Rolex in China (Except for reps), the Chinese Government couldn't give a Rats A** about whether or not Rolex SA was upset because there were millions of fake Rolex watches coming out of China. Now, Rolex is well established, and they have some degree of clout with the Government. Just using Rolex as and example, there are now hundreds of Luxury goods producers selling their wares in China. I believe that we will see more and more interest by the authorities in anything they deem counterfeit goods. The Chinese Government makes a lot of money on import duties on luxury items, they don't want to put that in jeopardy. They don't make a thing off reps, except for the bribes to local officials, which doesn't put money in the treasury. I like most of the previous posters, don't think that the rep trade will disappear completely, but if factories are constantly raided, at some point in time the owners will throw in the towel and find something legit to produce. There are lots of ways to stop the flow of goods. If the factories get shut, what happens to the dealers? Suppose your trusted Dealer had and order in for say 200 watches at 150.00 USD each, the factory gets raided, maybe the owner gets arrested or disappears, the dealer may well be out the 30K he paid for the watches. How many of our dealers could survive with a couple of hits like that? Another thing would be a crack down in customs going out of China. It's easy to tell if there is a watch in the package, and not a "toy" as some dealers claim. If they stop and confiscate even 25-30% of the watches going out, it's going to scare the heck out of buyers, especially if the seller won't or can't afford to absorb the customs risks. I know this subject has come up a lot in the past, mostly related to customs problems in the USA and some of the EU countries, but this is a little different, because they are attacking the source. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeKa Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 I don't believe the factories get paid before the watches are handed over to the dealers... Dee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asciwhite Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 I am $560 in the hole with my personal dealer, and cant get a hold of him...... Ill give it another 3 days... In the meantime................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooky driver Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 I am $560 in the hole with my personal dealer, and cant get a hold of him...... Ill give it another 3 days... In the meantime................... Personal dealer? Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adeodatus Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 I am $560 in the hole with my personal dealer, and cant get a hold of him...... Ill give it another 3 days... In the meantime................... Daaaamn.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeKa Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 $485 for me... Dee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asciwhite Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 Personal dealer? Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk Yeah.. He lives in Shanghai. Known him for 5 years now... Always gives me good watches, and if anything goes wrong. Even if i have an accident. I can always ship it back for repairs... Free (Only shipping) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougar1 Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 Great post panerai153, times certainly are a changin', while in the short term there is no doubt all will be back online, it will be very interesting to see how these raids and pressure from the major brands progress over the next few years. We may find the rep game still about in 5 or 10 years time but it could look vastly different to the one we have now. It will be very interesting to see just how much clout the west really has in this and what real changes China will make to it's counterfeiting laws in the future. The government over there might make quite a lot on import duties of luxury items, but with whole regions being dependent on the production and sale of counterfeit items(not just watches) it will take more than a few raids to take the structure down, up to recently it seemed a rather weak attempt to placate western brands while secretly keeping the status quo. It will be an interesting balancing act over the next decade. 10 years time we may have to send over 'mules' from the forum to an obscure Asian country to collect our $1k+ hyperreps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 I have been worried for a while this this hobby was getting far to high profile for our own good. When I started on the original board it was a quiet little hobby with a few web albums for the dealers and western union payment. Today it's online orders with your credit card, tracked shipping and 4 huge forums with tens of thousands of members each. The quality and range of watches has also increased to a degree few would have predicted back when we started. I recall having a Skype chat with Neil (TTK) a few years back and he predicted this would eventually happen. Personally I think the rep market is far from finished but I can't see things staying as they are. It's too high profile and too public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 Ok my people are saying that many small factories and only a few large factories have been raided. They say there is 2 main reasons (1) Yes the genuine brands have put another rocket up the Governments bum, this happens from time to time and then it goes back to business as usual. (2) Once a year the Chinese police have what they call 'Customers Day' (which is now) and although it is called a 'Day' it usually runs between 1 and 2 months and consists of raids and such on replica factories and sellers. During this time replica sellers simply move there work hours to after 6pm. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kramerica2 Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 (edited) Guys, china is changing. There is no doubt that sooner or later those factories will be shut down. If not at the current raid, than later. Regulations in China are becoming strict. Environmental laws for new factories, for example, are now even stricter than those in Europe. Not so far ahead is the day when China would no longer be the cheap mass-production factory of the world, reps included. But no worries. Where there is demand, there will be supply. Other countries would replace China. Sure, it will take some time for them to get it right, and there may be some tough times ahead in our business, but in the end - market demand is always supplied, and we all know the magnitude of that demand. Edited March 26, 2012 by kramerica2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asciwhite Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 Sent a mail to my friend in Shanghai asking him if he where ok, and asking him to send me a mail so I would know if he was allright... Got a a rather tart e-mail today saying "Thank you for your concern, here is tracking no for your order" Id say he is ok *laughs* 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePimp Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 Has anyone had any communication with Joshua in the last few hours? He normally responds pretty quick yet i have had no responce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougar1 Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 Josh probably had his team of little helpers killed during the raids, so that they wouldn't hang him in front of a judge, he'll hire another team of little helpers within a day or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePimp Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 Lets hope so M8........we cant loose a top dealer like PC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas1999 Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 Andrew has been in regular contact with me the last several days regarding my order. It appears to be business as usual for him. I got QC pics and the order shipped this morning. No problems thus far. Of course it hasn't cleared Chinese customs yet... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougar1 Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 He should be fine, probably a little busier than usual trying to sort out what watches can be processed as normal and what ones there may be a delay on new supplies incoming to him, that is if he is affected at all. I'm sure he'll respond soon enough! Edit: got there before me Texas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePimp Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 I have never used Andrew....my only two reps have been with Joshua with no hick ups, so i am somewhat reluctant to change........but hey.....if needs be i will Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougar1 Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 Andrew and Josh have their operations closely knit together, so if Andrew is up and running, Josh is too, but Josh might be Sleeping Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig S Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 Just been talking with the guys at PureTime and it appears that it is the market traders and smaller sellers that have been hit, not the main factories. Good news Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gran Posted March 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 So It is not the end Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 It never is (the end). These things happen, like clockwork, every couple of years & life always returns to normal after the smoke clears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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