maxman Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 No, that is BS, what I pointed out is basic psychology... I'm not saying that all gen owners are snobby elitist assholes, what I'm pointing out, is that those who have such a hatred for reps, are doing so because they feel threatened by it and the threat it represents to the value which they attribute to something. You say the gu driving the fiero is an idiot. Explain to me why he is an idiot. Does the fiero not get him from a to b? Is it not a valid form of transportation? To suggest that only genuine goods are acceptable, and that people who seek replica goods are idiots and losers, is the same as saying that the only way of appreciating art is to own the original painting, and that anything else, screen savers, posters, prints etc, are for losers. Or are they okay because they're licenced reproductions? I doubt daVinci gave anyone permission to re-print the Vetruvian Man or the Mona Lisa, but hey, plenty of people have copies of them world wide. But I guess they're just idiots too... "I doubt DaVinci gave anyone permission to re-print the Vetruvian Man or the Mona Lissa, but hey,plenty of people have copies of them world wide." Excellent point T. Peeps need to kick back and chillax. Mike 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixers_610 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Because they feel others are trying to impersonate the image and prestige of a genuine, without actually earning that right Bingo Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosox Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I have gens and I certainly don't hate reps or their owners. Why? Because I have more reps than gens, and I get a kick knowing that my five Panerais cost me probably $1000 total instead of $35,000-$40,000. But when I'm wearing a gen, there's a kick in knowing the quality of what's on my wrist and yes, that I could afford to buy it. (Plus, I could walk into any jewelry shop in the world and not worry about being called out.) Either way, I'm happy and I don't hate anybody. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legend Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I have gens and I certainly don't hate reps or their owners. Why? Because I have more reps than gens, and I get a kick knowing that my five Panerais cost me probably $1000 total instead of $35,000-$40,000. But when I'm wearing a gen, there's a kick in knowing the quality of what's on my wrist and yes, that I could afford to buy it. (Plus, I could walk into any jewelry shop in the world and not worry about being called out.) Either way, I'm happy and I don't hate anybody. To me, thats a balance and real-world opinion. I share the same feeling. Kudos to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtguk Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alterego Posted August 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Hi fellow members: I have always asked myself why is there such hatred against rep collectors from gen watch owners. Check any gen forum and you'll find many long threads that are full of ugly comments about people like us. I have some hypothesis about this phenomenom which I will share, but I'd like to know first if my perception is true or not. Thank youfor reading my post WELL FELLOWS !!!! I must confess that I never thought my Question would rise so many questions and views of this isue. I think this debate is good data for writing a paper on the topic. So some conclusions about the "significant question" ? 1.- Not all gen owners hate replicas and their owners 2.- Youcan both be really happy 3.- Replica watches have intrinsec as well as extrinsec value 4.- Gen watches have more extrinsec (status marker) than intrinsec value (cost) 5.- So, gen owners have alot more problems acepting rep watches than rep watch owners accepting gen watches I'm sure I'm missing a lot more conclusions than the ones I mention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougar1 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Here is a (small) interesting thread: http://forum.tz-uk.c...ear-your-heroes I think it sums up the fact that quite a lot of Gens can be basically overrated/overpriced in one way or other, and who wants to stump up huge money for something that they quite like, but don't love, and have reservations about it being a 'lifetime' watch. This for me is where reps come in, they serve a fantastic purpose in this regard. How many times have we read on gen forums comments like 'this is the one, definitely, I will never part with this', only to see it posted on the site sales section a month later. Jeez! And anyone acting like they really dont want the gen of the fake they are buying here,is lying to himself as well. Take By-Tor,he finally got to buy the gens he wanted after his days here with reps,where is he now??. Come on guys,cut the bs. I don't think it's that clear that we are all just kidding ourselves and really want that gen. For me I'm happy to buy the gen of a true grail or long time keeper, but I will often take years to know this, I may buy and wear the rep for a long time to know for sure, In some cases I may even buy the gen (used) a few times and sell it a few times before I know a particular watch is a true keeper. There is a lot of lust moments with watches, helped by lots of nice flashy brochure images by the brands, there is also a lot of 'really like but don't love' scenarios, reps are fantastic in this regard. I won't speak for by-tor, but just guessing here and possibly BT came across a time in his life where his priorities were different and he was happy to pick up a select few gens of watches that really were important to him and then continue with other priorities. And this is the sort of thing that we possibly all do at least once or even a few times. I'm into watches at the moment and have quite a bit of time reserved for both gens and reps but I also see more and more time soon needing to be devoted to other more important things. In cases like this it wouldn't bother me in the least to reduce a large collection down to a few 'important' ones. Would they be all gens?, I don't think so, at the moment if I were to do this it would be a mix of gens/frankens/reps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seafoam Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I have a co-worker that has 4 or 5 mid and high end gens (Oris/Breitling). He bought a rep a few years ago. He initially loved the watch and was into the whole rep idea until one of the lume markers fell off his UPO 42mm. A common occurrence with these as with other reps I'm sure. He thought this was unacceptable and said "I'm out" and hasn't been back since. He let one bad watch decide his future of rep buying. Most aren't willing to put up with the possibility or likelihood of any kind of anomaly and probably wouldn't be willing to mod/repair a watch if something does go south. Just MHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougar1 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 (edited) Good point seafoam, I think to really appreciate and see the value in reps, you'd need to either have access to a good watchmaker or learn some basic watchmaking/modding skills over the long haul. The aesthetics can be brilliant only to be let down by shoddy assembly out of the box. As said many times before there is no reason a rep cannot be as good looking and as reliable as the gen counterpart, but getting to this position often requires changing expectations a little. Once we get over this issue, reps are great Markers fall off expensive gens on occasion also Edited August 26, 2012 by cougar1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxman Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I have a co-worker that has 4 or 5 mid and high end gens (Oris/Breitling). He bought a rep a few years ago. He initially loved the watch and was into the whole rep idea until one of the lume markers fell off his UPO 42mm. A common occurrence with these as with other reps I'm sure. He thought this was unacceptable and said "I'm out" and hasn't been back since. He let one bad watch decide his future of rep buying. Most aren't willing to put up with the possibility or likelihood of any kind of anomaly and probably wouldn't be willing to mod/repair a watch if something does go south. Just MHO. I hope nothing happens to one of his gens. I guess he'll have to use his Iphone like everyone else. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave123 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 . You say the guy driving the fiero is an idiot. Explain to me why he is an idiot. Does the fiero not get him from a to b? Is it not a valid form of transportation? To suggest that only genuine goods are acceptable Yes,a Fiero will (maybe) get you from point a to b,so why dress it up as a Ferrari,this is my point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave123 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 I can't speak for everyone here, but I wouldn't want the gen of any of the reps I own. Even if I could afford them (which at the moment I can't) I simply couldn't justify spending that kind of money on such an over-inflated product.... Then why are you here looking to buy a copy of said overly inflated product?,again,this is my point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave123 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Really there is more "hate" from rep owners,then gen owners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legend Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Really there is more "hate" from rep owners,then gen owners. envy and admiration to varying degrees, yes, but hate? unlikely. I happen to own a few gen AP ROOs, and I have the rep of for 2 of the gen models I own. People own reps for different reasons, and for me, it is a matter of trying out the "alternatives" and see the world would end if the rep is secured around my wrist. I would wonder why you are displaying animosity in your reply toward some of the opinions posted here. Owning a watch, in my opinion, is a matter of making a personal decision after going through a consideration of a variety of factors. To each his own I guess. You are definitely entitled to your opinion and I respect that, but lets keep the spirit of discussion gentle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave123 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 I have a co-worker that has 4 or 5 mid and high end gens (Oris/Breitling). He bought a rep a few years ago. He initially loved the watch and was into the whole rep idea until one of the lume markers fell off his UPO 42mm. A common occurrence with these as with other reps I'm sure. He thought this was unacceptable and said "I'm out" and hasn't been back since. He let one bad watch decide his future of rep buying. Most aren't willing to put up with the possibility or likelihood of any kind of anomaly and probably wouldn't be willing to mod/repair a watch if something does go south. Just MHO. Ive owned a hundred reps,all in good fun it was for me but all have flaws,even if i was the only one that knew of them,its the first thing i thought about everytime i looked at them. I always got rid of them due to this,now i just own 2 gens and thats all i need,reps helped me make that gen decision,to me,thats what its all about. Nothing wrong with that opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave123 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 envy and admiration to varying degrees, yes, but hate? unlikely. I happen to own a few gen AP ROOs, and I have the rep of for 2 of the gen models I own. People own reps for different reasons, and for me, it is a matter of trying out the "alternatives" and see the world would end if the rep is secured around my wrist. I would wonder why you are displaying animosity in your reply toward some of the opinions posted here. Owning a watch, in my opinion, is a matter of making a personal decision after going through a consideration of a variety of factors. To each his own I guess. You are definitely entitled to your opinion and I respect that, but lets keep the spirit of discussion gentle. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Yes,a Fiero will (maybe) get you from point a to b,so why dress it up as a Ferrari,this is my point. Why not dress it up as a Ferrari? Car modification is quite a popular hobby. They even have shows on TV about it You haven't explained to me why the guy in a Fiero dressed up as a Ferrari is an idiot... Why wear a diamond-encrusted monstrosity of a watch? It's the exact same point: Different strokes for different folks, and personal freedom of expression... Then why are you here looking to buy a copy of said overly inflated product?,again,this is my point. I thought I'd answered that one pretty clearly above, but to clarify, I like how the product(s) looks, I don't like the overly inflated price tag. I refused to pay it when I could have afforded to and would refuse to pay it if I could afford to again on principle. As mentioned above (and many times over the years) I buy many generic things, from food to clothing rather than paying 'brand prices'. Nothing more than a frugal attitude. If I can buy a near copy of a $5000 watch for less than $50, why would I want to spend the extra $4950? Just so I can say "It's real..." if someone asks? I'd rather someone know I buy fake goods, than know I waste money on genuine ripoffs. As I pointed out above, people the world over collect and display reproductions/prints/screen savers of famous paintings, yet no one thinks that they are losers or lying to themselves I think the real question, given how you clearly think fake anything is for losers, is why are you still here? You claim that people who 'go gen' soon disappear. Why haven't you done the same? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milhouse Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 As has been mentioned, some people just like to add variety to their (gen) collections, without breaking the bank. I know a few people who work for watch retailers, and they aren't averse to reps (as long as there's full disclosure, of course). Many are offended because a rep dilutes the (social) value of their status symbol, and the image they feel it conveys to others. Thought I’m new to the rep game, and will likely have a few frankens in the rotation, my primary issue with reps is that unscrupulous føckholes will try to pass them off as gens - which isn't an issue with reps, per se, rather with unscrupulous føckholes. When it comes to luxury goods, status and branding is a HUGE factor, whether or not it's a conscious purchasing motivator. Also, fter seeing the quality of some reps, compared to gens, I'm looking at the Swiss watch industry in a different light. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icoopernicus Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Also, fter seeing the quality of some reps, compared to gens, I'm looking at the Swiss watch industry in a different light. I'll second that, Why a Rolex needs to cost $8,000 not $1,000 is still beyond me, aside from all the money that is spent to tell everyone that the watch is worth $8,000. A Submariner would be one heck of a $1,000 watch by the way but considering they probably cost about $400 to make, I'd say we're getting hosed to the tune of an approximately 2000% mark up 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Also, after seeing the quality of some reps, compared to gens, I'm looking at the Swiss watch industry in a different light. Roger that. I'm a member of many gen watch fora and one in particular makes great dive watches, and some of their members are here as well. Those watches use simple decorated ETA movements, wrapped up in multiple-thousand dollar gens. The question has been raised over there, what exactly are they getting for their hard earned money? And the replies are subdued at best. I wouldn't say they "hate" reps, but you can't discuss them in the open. To my slow mind, I see a bit of "look over here! look over here as I wave my hand and make an obvious distraction" to get people off the subject of their overpriced "Swiss" watches. Interestingly, a discussion a couple years ago asked about components being made in China, then assembled in Switzerland, and whether then that is truly a "swiss watch". I was surprised to see that discussion stick around awhile. There were a lot of crickets chirping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 I'll second that, Why a Rolex needs to cost $8,000 not $1,000 is still beyond me Someone here once said "a Submariner is the world's finest $500 watch". That's exactly right, in my book. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Roger that. I'm a member of many gen watch fora and one in particular makes great dive watches, and some of their members are here as well. Those watches use simple decorated ETA movements, wrapped up in multiple-thousand dollar gens. The question has been raised over there, what exactly are they getting for their hard earned money? And the replies are subdued at best. I wouldn't say they "hate" reps, but you can't discuss them in the open. To my slow mind, I see a bit of "look over here! look over here as I wave my hand and make an obvious distraction" to get people off the subject of their overpriced "Swiss" watches. Interestingly, a discussion a couple years ago asked about components being made in China, then assembled in Switzerland, and whether then that is truly a "swiss watch". I was surprised to see that discussion stick around awhile. There were a lot of crickets chirping. I think a few years ago, They changed the rules to increase the 'percentage of assembly in Switzerland' required, compared to the previous rate which I believe was 50%, but all the time the parts are being produced in China to cut costs, it wouldn't matter if 100% Swiss assembly was required, in my mind, it would still be a ripoff due to the origin of the parts. At least reps are 'from the source' I was watching American Gangster the other day, and the Blue Magic, and the "Twice as good but half the price" kind of rung true to reps, but of course, they can't truly be considered 'twice as good', but it got me to thinking, if Rolex were to release a China Made line in addition to or even instead of their Swiss Made schtick, I bet they would get so many additional sales (from cheapskates/poor bastards like me) that they would probably not lose much, if any of their precious profits from their over-inflated bling range Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougar1 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Hoho, Bonesey has opened a can of worms on Page 2, but then again, this gen forum is a little more forgiving than some, although there are a few pitbulls who will mark him for life on there after that. Still interesting discussion on the JLc http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.php?232059-Scary-Jaeger-navy-seals-fake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justasgood Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 I would estimate that a Submariner is $1500/movement, $1000.00/case and bracelet. Rep. Buyers are still ego maniacal assholes with huge cocks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazed7 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Hoho, Bonesey has opened a can of worms on Page 2, but then again, this gen forum is a little more forgiving than some, although there are a few pitbulls who will mark him for life on there after that. Still interesting discussion on the JLc http://forum.tz-uk.c...navy-seals-fake Raffe is a fiesty one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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