Serafino Posted May 26, 2014 Report Share Posted May 26, 2014 Some say a 2836 movement in a 1601X case will have strain on its stem because of the .05 mm greater stem height. -Does anyone know first-hand of a Franken that had a stem break or malfunction because of this issue? In the event that 'best practice' would be to use a 2824 (assuming one could have the needed cannon pinion mods performed): -Has anyone come up with a way to use a 2824 in a 1601X case without a Stilty spacer? Would new dial feet located for an ETA do the job of spacing the dial .4 mm if they were long enough, or are dial feet solely for alignment? -I see a lot of conflicting recommendations on the web about attaching dial feet: 'epoxy won't work'; 'JB weld'; 'special industrial magic epoxy'; 'the only good way is specialty soldering equipment we don't have access to'. What's the truth? Does better consumer-grade epoxy such as JB Weld used on properly prepared surfaces fail? -I've been wondering if one could stack two Raffles movement rings, soldered together, and then sand that down to the right size to give a .4 mm space for the dial? Poor man's Stilty spacer? -What about the Rafflestime dial spacer? Anyone used one? How thick are they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeypunch Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Dial dots and a modded raffles movement ring will work. The 2783 I had in my 1016 16014 cased franken started losing time so I switched it out with one of those Seagull 2824 movements. Haven't had an issue yet. I simply put the dial dots on the movement, slapped on the dial without the calender spacer ring thing, mounted the hands, cased and was in business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alligoat Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 The 2836-2 ought to work just fine in a 16013 case, both of my DJs are 2836-2s- a 16013 and a 16014. The 1016 is no different- glue the dial to the spacer ring, install the hands and put it in the case w/ a #2 rafflestime ring. If you don't have a 2836-2, maybe you could get one. The 2824-2 is best for the 16200 DJ cases. Since Stilty rings are no longer around you might as well forget about using one. The old adage is a 2836-2 fits best in a Rolex case made for a 3035 movement, a 2824-2 fits in a case made for a 3135. You can fight the common knowledge all day long and I wish you the best! Some people mange to make it work, but for long term success follow the old adage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kin tama Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 hi, exactly what mods were done to the raffles ring? i have one but im not sure if i should just get a yuki ring for simplicitys sake... kind regards, kt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeypunch Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 As I recall, a little has to be removed from the overall diameter of the ring and two slots cut to fit the clamps. Maybe 5-10 minutes work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denimhead Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Some say a 2836 movement in a 1601X case will have strain on its stem because of the .05 mm greater stem height. -Does anyone know first-hand of a Franken that had a stem break or malfunction because of this issue? In the event that 'best practice' would be to use a 2824 (assuming one could have the needed cannon pinion mods performed): -Has anyone come up with a way to use a 2824 in a 1601X case without a Stilty spacer? Would new dial feet located for an ETA do the job of spacing the dial .4 mm if they were long enough, or are dial feet solely for alignment? -I see a lot of conflicting recommendations on the web about attaching dial feet: 'epoxy won't work'; 'JB weld'; 'special industrial magic epoxy'; 'the only good way is specialty soldering equipment we don't have access to'. What's the truth? Does better consumer-grade epoxy such as JB Weld used on properly prepared surfaces fail? -I've been wondering if one could stack two Raffles movement rings, soldered together, and then sand that down to the right size to give a .4 mm space for the dial? Poor man's Stilty spacer? -What about the Rafflestime dial spacer? Anyone used one? How thick are they? You might be better using an eta 2846, remove the calender date parts then you'd have a nice reliable slow beat movement. Closer to the Gen than the 2836. Can't remember having any issues with the stem height using the Raffles Movement ring either Cheers DH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serafino Posted May 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Thanks guys. I guess I have a bad case of backseat perfectionism. I think I will go ahead and snag a 2846. I had a prejudice against them but I'm getting over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephry73 Posted June 1, 2014 Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 Get the 2846 and find a swatch movement with the two step keyless. Swap the parts and have a movement that works flawlessly and acts like gen. This is what I did for both my 5512 McQueen and the 1016 I currently working on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serafino Posted June 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 Thanks Ephry, I have movements on the way, and will go read up on keyless works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymanmatt Posted June 2, 2014 Report Share Posted June 2, 2014 Ive done dozens and dozens. Never ever used a 2836-2. Always a 2824-2. 16013 or 16234, I still use a 2824-2. The stem height is wrong on a 2836 or 2846. It will be low in the case tube. Im just saying. Been doing it for a very long time, and never had one fail. FIRST RULE OF ANY BUILD-THE STEM MUST BE CENTERED IN THE CASE TUBE. Of course thats only if you want it to last for years. There is not a watch in this world I would use a 2846 in, ever. Terrible movement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomhorn Posted June 2, 2014 Report Share Posted June 2, 2014 There is not a watch in this world I would use a 2846 in, ever. Terrible movement What would your low-beat preference be? I am about to build a 5514 and was planning on a 2846 powering it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted June 2, 2014 Report Share Posted June 2, 2014 I just put together an Explorer for a member using a Felsa 4000 series movement. After removing the date gizmos, making a special movment spacer the dial glued directly to it and stem height was just about perfect + it's an 18k vph movement. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serafino Posted June 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2014 mymanmatt: Do you know of any 2836 / 16013 projects which failed due to the .05 mm stem height difference? How do you space the movement from the dial? What size canon pinion do you change to, and what's a good place to buy them? Thanks! JMB: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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