We REALLY need your help

[Samurai]

Co-incidence. I sent a mail to Admin just this morning asking instructions on how to upgrade my account. I think it is fair to pay for using this forum.

Am still awaiting instructions on how to upgrade....someone pls help.

[capice]

For me at least , it is NOT about the money.

Just go back and read all these ideas and come to some understanding and direction,

If not this SAME situation will rear it`s ugly head again.

Far too many have simply shot off at a tangent and taken it on themselves to pull RWG out of the mire.

Very admirable I admit , but .............it is not the solution. ( Long term wise ).

A FORTHRIGHT DIRECTION IS REQUIRED FROM ADMIN. TO SAY WHAT WILL BE FROM NOW ON.

I can agree with you for some of this m8, but you have to start somewhere, so I like the suggestion to follow Youp's lead 1 month free and whein interested in more just pay the annual subscriptionfee, $50 or $60 .

Maybe there will be lesser members but the ones who stay are more serious and the costs will be covered..the rest of the money T can spend on organizing a annual GTG?

In the situation of today with almost 12000 members using this forum, only a handfull is willing to share in the cost whereas the other 11895 are just enjoying whatis paid by a few, sounds ridiculous to me

I really don't believe it when a member says he doesn't have the money...buying reps all the time?

Show what you are wort and pay the subscription, simple as that

[takashi]

I decided to be a supporter

[crystalcranium]

12,000 members paying $1.00 a year would almost cover it! It's kinda silly when you think about it. 4% of the total membership covers the operating expenses here? Thats scary.

[capice]

Taka, welcome to the club....

[rodwc]

I can agree with you for some of this m8, but you have to start somewhere, so I like the suggestion to follow Youp's lead 1 month free and whein interested in more just pay the annual subscriptionfee, $50 or $60 .

Maybe there will be lesser members but the ones who stay are more serious and the costs will be covered..the rest of the money T can spend on organizing a annual GTG?

In the situation of today with almost 12000 members using this forum, only a handfull is willing to share in the cost whereas the other 11895 are just enjoying whatis paid by a few, sounds ridiculous to me

I really don't believe it when a member says he doesn't have the money...buying reps all the time?

Show what you are wort and pay the subscription, simple as that

"but you have to start somewhere"

You START by plugging the holes in the leaky boat.

Simply throwing money at a problem is NOT going to make it go away.

12000 members with this kind of crap happening is simply a bloody joke.

Cull the number to those who are willing to pay for the benefit, and lets face it 99.5% are getting benefit from RWG.

Look at the ongoing problems in Africa, many many billions have been thrown there, and the problem is STILL the same,

Give them the means and knowhow to plant and grow food for themselves, .........THEN see the benefits.

[Samurai]

Co-incidence. I sent a mail to Admin just this morning asking instructions on how to upgrade my account. I think it is fair to pay for using this forum.

Am still awaiting instructions on how to upgrade....someone pls help.

Bump

[capice]

so what would be your suggestion for solving the problem here Rodwc..? cause I'm not following you..

In Africa thousands of people are taught how to prevent aids but a majority simply doesn't listen or is ignorant.

People are taught how to grow there own food, some will succeed and sell there crop on markets but a minority ect ect ect

So, hand us a solution m8

[rodwc]

so what would be your suggestion for solving the problem here Rodwc..? cause I'm not following you..

In Africa thousands of people are taught how to prevent aids but a majority simply doesn't listen or is ignorant.

People are taught how to grow there own food, some will succeed and sell there crop on markets but a minority ect ect ect

So, hand us a solution m8

Whether Admin., or anyone cares to listen or not, there have been some good suggestions allready.

This problem will arise again sometime down the track, unless addressed NOW.

The situation of leaving the financial side to the minority , ie. the Supporters and donations, to carry the can for the whole RWG

simply has to be changed.

That at least stops the leak.

A number of 12000 members , with more than 11500 paying nothing is simply ludicrous.

Sort the wheat from the chaff, by just who is willing to pay for, after all A SERVICE.

1000 members at $60 is $ 60,000.

How much is needed per annum ?

Also to be quite frank , out of the 700 views from this post and only 58 replies, this shows just who cares about RWG.

There is too much dead wood around .

[Shundi]

I'll weigh in on this briefly:

In finance classes in school you're taught that budgeting is the foundation to a successful business of any sort. Now, most business schools simply say "budget, and you'll won't have a problem." A good business school will tell you "budget, but prepare for the unexpected." In terms of "unexpected," I think Admin hit the nail on the head (obviously, he is Admin ) when he detailed the precautions that he takes so that we, the membership, are protected from Big Brother.

Many people on this forum are open about the fact that they collect reps however many people would not want their boss/co-workers/wife/ etc. discovering this little hobby for various reasons. As such, the forum needs to make due with the expensive hosting plan we're currently on. I do like the idea of not allowing picture quoting and/or hosting images on a cheaper server. My field isn't computers, but I feel like that would reduce the strain on the "expensive" server. The downside, of course, would be worrying about this other server/the cost effectiveness of shuttling the images / content between two different servers. The more complicated something is (obviously) the more likely it is to go south in a hurry. I know in the past some servers have also gone "offline" at certain hours to reduce the server load, however our diversity of membership (an obvious plus) would be the downside there, as the time differences would wreck havoc on posting. At the end of the day, we should take a look at a couple of things: Why people are here (fundementally) and why anyone would pay for any service (speaking broadly). The vast majority of people are here because they A. Do not have the funds to purchase gens of some beautiful watches, B. Have the funds, but would rather spend them on something else, C. Just like collecting nice OEM style watches for a highly reduced cost, or D. All of the above, and a love of watches/mechanics in general. Now, in terms of paying for a service, our fundemental assumption is that the chance a person will pay for a service increases proportionally to the amount of value said service adds. I think we can all agree, especially those of us that log in on a daily basis, that RWG has a high value added component. From frequent get togethers, tips, tricks, advice, reviews and testing (not to mention the sense of community and family), RWG has a huge value added component. So, that being said, we've got people that, fundementally, want to save money and not be scammed/get some great advice. Kind of a crappy basis to ask for membership fees lol. I find it particularly interesting that people have the money for a $500 super rep, but do not see the need to purchase a supporting membership. Why? Either the feel they contribute to the community enough that they have actually encouraged people to purchase memberships in gratitude for their reviews/advice, they provide various services on the forum, they belong to 12 different forums and we're no different, or, quite simply, because this forum has been free for quite some time and they do not feel that being able to have ad free pages or a supporters area is worth the cost. As such, there are a few different routes:

1. Pay to play. Simple, 2 bucks a month to access the forum. You can pay $24 up front non-recurring, or you can pay $2 a month through whatever means Admin has access to.

2. Pay to post - posting a sales thread costs $2.00. I don't recommend this because market theory would dictate that people would just go to a cheaper site to sell.

3. Make Sales Threads available to supporting members only

4. Make Reviews available to supporting members only

5. (And I encourage this no matter what) I think Admin's call to donate and posting the exact amount needed to continue operations is an excellent idea. I'd recommend doing this on a month to month basis in order to really show the costs that the forum incurs.

6 In regards to the pay to play 1 and 2 above- another thought is that between RWG and the other site Admin hosts, his forums do occupy a significant chunk of the replica review/advise boards... it might be possible to do with one, the other, or both without people flocking.

I'd keep going but today is the day where I get to have a lovely endoscopy. Joy. On the plus side...versed and fentanyl I'll try to sleep off the drugs and not post anything finance related while simultaneously being unable to stand. Please let me know what you think, I'll try to dig up other examples and respond this evening (Eastern US time)

Shundi

[Samurai]

Just made the payment to upgrade my account. Am so chuffed!

[capice]

Whether Admin., or anyone cares to listen or not, there have been some good suggestions allready.

This problem will arise again sometime down the track, unless addressed NOW.

The situation of leaving the financial side to the minority , ie. the Supporters and donations, to carry the can for the whole RWG

simply has to be changed.

That at least stops the leak.

A number of 12000 members , with more than 11500 paying nothing is simply ludicrous.

Sort the wheat from the chaff, by just who is willing to pay for, after all A SERVICE.

1000 members at $60 is $ 60,000.

How much is needed per annum ?

Also to be quite frank , out of the 700 views from this post and only 58 replies, this shows just who cares about RWG.

There is too much dead wood around .

Fully agree, it seems we ere talking about the same idea...

[robertb]

Donation made and money well spent IMO! It's nice to see a community step up and work through something like this.

[Admin]

Thank you all. There are some wonderful ideas in this thread and I will for sure go for some of them. But you guys also need to keem a couple of things in the back of your mind:

Yes, there is a very small percentage of members who pay to play, but the aother percentage is also what makes RWG what it is, like it or not. If we make this a pay-only board, we will loose big chunk of the members to other boards and this will decrease the quality of this board. I don't think a board where all members would have to pay would be a success, but I could of course be wrong.

Re. recurring payments. I have no problems understanding that people have a problemw with this. These payments can easily be cancelled through paypal and we can provide detailed instructions on how this can be done. I don't mind charging a 1 year membership as a one time payment either. I guess my question here is if people are cool with paying $5 a month so that a year would be $60 or if they expect discounted memberships for a year?

As someone mentioned above, it is the usual pattern on this kind of discussion; mostly members who are already supporters who post. I really wish the regular members would chime in here with both suggestions and their thoughts.

But this is a good thread and a good discussion. Let's keep it up and together we'll find a permanent solution to this.

[yellomen]

Some ideas, as a base for discussion:

1. Split the forum load, all pics etc from a cheap non off shore server (Host in the Netherlands, cheap and secure), only the sensitive data (site access etc on a secure off shore)
   
2. Block all irrelevant traffic, avatars, signatures etc..
   
3. Automatically delete / block all quoted pictures
   
4. Restrict image size
   
5. Charge the collectors traffic fees on their posts
   
6. Close all discussions after page one for non paying members
   
7. block all pictures for non paying members
   

hope this helps

These are quite some interesting points youpmelone (does the name have anything to do with Andre van Duin???)

I find especially number 1 and 2 very promissing...

Also the idea to have a 60 free trial period is nice, but i guess it brings a lot of administrative work.

[chubbchubb]

I have read so many of these support requests that I am

[andreww]

@T - I've just transfered some funds to my account and will send as soon as they have cleared. I don't really care if you upgrade my membership or not, as I have little concern about what other people think about my status. I think that "supporter" badge only causes issues between the "haves" and the "have nots" anyway. Consider it a donation, as everybody should, and remember that I don't need anything extra in return.

Cheers,

Andreww

[Corgi]

I have never felt more embarrassed at not being a supporter than today.

:-(

[andreww]

BTW, if you want to encourage supporters, only allow access to the "Member Rep Sales" section to paid supporters. Decrease the yearly amount to a nominal figure, say $30, and watch the numbers rise. In my experience, a good portion of our members are here solely to troll for cheap purchases. IMO that would be the real plumb!

[cdv]

BTW, if you want to encourage supporters, only allow access to the "Member Rep Sales" section to paid supporters. Decrease the yearly amount to a nominal figure, say $30, and watch the numbers rise. In my experience, a good portion of our members are here solely to troll for cheap purchases. IMO that would be the real plumb!

I concur with that thought. Though I believe the trade reviews is also extremely important to those "trolling."

[scoobs1971]

Yes, there is a very small percentage of members who pay to play, but the aother percentage is also what makes RWG what it is, like it or not. If we make this a pay-only board, we will loose big chunk of the members to other boards and this will decrease the quality of this board. I don't think a board where all members would have to pay would be a success, but I could of course be wrong.

I think the quality of this board lays in the indepth watch reviews, the technical discussions, the dealer QC feedback and the community feel (id. GTGs, wristies, raffles, donations to help a brother out in bad times), but I have the feeling that 90% of the essential posts are made by paying members. So I wouldn't mind that as a consequence non-participating members will leave to other boards (I prefer them to join off course).

I also think that marketingwise it wouldn't be a bad idea to have a more exclusive (i.d. pay to play) quality board to differentiate from the other boards. But maybe I'm taking this one step too far for now....

Anyway, I'll prefer quality over quantity (as I do with my rep collection, lol) and I would be happy to pay for that.

There have already been mentioned some very good ideas. So what about:

- access to member sales threads (reading & posting) for paying members only

- access to knowledge base & review section for paying members only

- access to collectors and collector feedback for everybody

- general discussion for everybody

- brand forums for everybody

- limited pic size, no avatar and no signature for non paying members

- if the software allows, a chatfunction for paying members only. Shoutbox for everybody

- non paying members can only PM other non paying members

- non paying member 'post of the month' gets free upgrade for 1 year.

In this way non paying members can find some general information on reps, where to buy them and experience some community feel. If they like this place they can upgrade and get access to the indepth quality part of the board. This will sort the weath from the chaff.

[andreww]

I have never felt more embarrassed at not being a supporter than today.

:-(

There is no reason to feel embarrassed Corgi. I know that you contribute in more valuable ways, simply by being here frequently and keeping the conversations going. More important and much more time consuming than any cash donation could ever be. Keep up the good work mate!

I have no problem If guys just can't afford to contribute. I'm in the same boat. My watch collection is not substantial, and new acquisitions are infrequent. Its guys that are constantly buying new stuff who are not supporters that bother me a bit. But they may have there reasons as well.

[Watchmeister]

Nice to see everyone contributing their ideas. The age old adage of 20% of the population footing the bill for everyone else is true everywhere in life. Look at the country you live in. Now if we could get 20% to contribute we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

In any case I do hope that those who can afford it and spend time here will contribute.

[rodwc]

Yes, there is a very small percentage of members who pay to play, but the aother percentage is also what makes RWG what it is, like it or not. If we make this a pay-only board, we will loose big chunk of the members to other boards and this will decrease the quality of this board. I don't think a board where all members would have to pay would be a success, but I could of course be wrong.

As someone mentioned above, it is the usual pattern on this kind of discussion; mostly members who are already supporters who post. I really wish the regular members would chime in here with both suggestions and their thoughts.

But this is a good thread and a good discussion. Let's keep it up and together we'll find a permanent solution to this.

"we will loose big chunk of the members to other boards ."

What would we be loosing ? What are they contributing anyway ?

How long before those "other boards" become bogged down with dead wood and excess traffic/bandwidth ?

I will answer that myself by saying, The minority here are making this whole RWG possible by supporting the board financially/reviews/donations,etc.

How can we be loosing anything , we can only gain by them going.

No posts, no donations, they are simply freeloaders

feeding off the providors.

The free lunches are over.

Secure RWG now, and keep the content top quality.

[rolli]

completed..... ;)

rolli