Review of the MBK ROLEX Submariner 16613

[By-Tor]

 

The idea for this review came from Eurotimez, who originally sent me the Noobfactory TT Sub for a review a while back. This article is actually a sequel to that one.

Read the review HERE.

The idea is to compare the two best two-tone Submariners in the market. Actually there's still one top contender, the WM9 version, but that version isn't readily available through our dealers.

I won't comment the gold issue (again), but both of these watches are said to have gold that will never wear off. I don't have a problem believing it, as gold looks and feels excellent on both watches.

MBK (or MBW) Submariner 16613 is based on a very old replica model, and it has similar characteristics as the classic "TW Best" model. This replica type has very deep rehaut, big date magnification (a bit oversized actually) and very good quality "feel" which compensates the minutia inaccuracies. MBK/TW watches used to have low quality dials, but it has been improved greatly for this new two-tone version. This "2008 model" also has subtle ROLEXROLEXROLEX engraved on the rehaut. The crown guards are ok but not perfect. They seem to be extremely easy to modify though (just remove a little bit from the front insides).

The "Noobfactory" Submariner 16613 is basically a Noobmariner with gold parts. It has shorter rehaut, but excellent date magnification. Some people claim it's a bit too small. I still think the Noob date is much better, because the double digits correctly will not fill the entire date window. The most impressive detail on the Noob is the dial print, which is virtually perfect. The Noob has better crown guards as well. I wouldn't even bother touching them.

One thing that surprised me with the MBK is the amazing depth of the blue dial. Not that there's anything wrong with Noob version, but the MBK dial really screams quality. The bezel insert is much glossier and shinier on the MBK as well. The print isn't quite as good and sharp, but M and m align nicely and I don't find anything to complain, really. The rehaut engraving is a bit too tall, but it's perfecly symmetric (unlike the GMT IIc engraving). I'm not a huge fan of the engraving, and I'd choose my watch without it. But it's bothering me much less than I thought, it's not very noticeable in real life.

We all know how good the "Noobfactory" GMT 16710 and 16610 Submariner dials are. They're probably the best rep dials ever produced. 16613 print is on the same level, but the color depth on the tt version isn't quite as deep as the MBK. Still, a superb dial. I think the dial competition is a tie.

Here's an outside comparison of the watches. MBK on the right. Notice the stronger blue color. Also notice the thicker white crystal "seal ring" on the Noob version, which makes the area just below the crystal look "matte". This makes the rehaut look lower than it actually is. The gen Rolexes have similar "ring" but it's glossier and shinier. We geeks call this effect "rehaut thickness". The MBK has decent rehaut thickness as well. From this angle the MBK looks more accurate, but from the straight front view the Noob looks superior.

Here you can see the difference in the actual rehaut depth. It's not that dramatic at all, but for some people this small difference has become very important. Personally, I consider the thickness effect and correct shape of the rehaut much more important. Noob is a bit too short, but it still wins the rehaut competition overall (just imho). The WM9 version is the only Submariner replica which has nailed this problem area almost perfectly.

In the closeup pictures the MBK looks a bit "wokky", but it's not much of an issue in real life. The SELs are a bit nicer on the Noobfactory version, as there's a slight gap between the lugs and SEL on the MBK. However the MBK has nicer, thicker bezel and more accurate crystal height.

Both watches have the whole SELs covered with gold. On the MBK (left) there's a gold layer over the SEL, and sides are just plated. On the Noob version the whole end link is "solid", as per gen. Visually, the inaccurate MBK SEL isn't any kind of issue, as it's very difficult to notice. Still, the Noob takes the SEL competition.

The clasp on the MBW is way superior. The gold has been applied smoothly and almost perfectly. The picture probably doesn't show the difference, but in r/l the plating on the clasp area leaves a lot to be desired (on the Noob version). The plating on the crown is much better and smoother on the MBK version as well. The plating on the Noob isn't bad or annoying, but it's noticeable in certain lighting (and from certain angles).

So which one is better?

MBK feels a bit more substantial, it has deeper blue dial, deeper rehaut, and superior plating on the crown & clasp.

Noob has better dial, better (smaller) datemag, better date font (double digits not filling the entire cyclops), better SELs, better pearl and better rehaut shape & thickness.

The Noob is a bit more accurate of the two. If these were stainless steel versions, I'd choose the Noob without hesitation. But when it's about gold watches, there are some other factors to consider. The problem with Noob is that MBW feels a bit more substantial, and it simply "feels" more expensive watch. This has always been the case with MBK/TW watches, and I understand why so many people are fans of them.

I thought long and hard about this. But from these two otb replicas, I would probably choose the MBK version. But then again, if the Noob had MBK's crown and clasp, I would choose it instead. MBK is over $100 more expensive than the solid gold Noob version, so this might be a factor to some buyers as well.

The biggest annoyance on the MBW is the date magnification, especially with double digits. Noob crushes its competition in this department. A bit sloppy plating on the crown and clasp area are the "Noob's" only real issues. The Noob is definitely easier to modify to "almost perfect" shape. It only needs new crown, really. After the clasp gets the normal hairline scratches (and believe me, it does), the uneven plating surface will become much less of an issue.

I can't really say which one is better, bar none. That'll be interesting to discuss in this open thread. Please post your thoughts and questions and I'll try to answer them as well as I can.

Either way, after seeing these two watches I have changed my thinking of the two-tone replicas. Both are good and substantial gold watches. If you're a fan of the two-tone Submariner you can purchase either one of these with a peace of mind. These have come a long way in three years.

Thanks for reading, I hope you enjoyed this article. Thanks also to Eurotimez (again) for borrowing these fine watches. Hopefully there's more where these came from.

--------------------

IMPORTANT NOTE: I will not reply to watch/part/mod questions via PM from the members anymore. I'd love to help everyone privately, but my PM box gets flooded/spammed these days with these enquiries and I simply don't have the time. This is a hobby for me, not a job. Please ask your questions in the public forum where you have thousands of potential helpers. It's nothing personal. Thanks for understanding.            By-Tor.

[Edwin25]

Wow By-Tor,

ABSOLUTLY, beautifull review... !!!!

I didn

[southcoast68]

You're reviews are always well appreciated, thank you!!! This is one rollie rep that I feel I would never own because thay never seem to get it right. Seeing your two reviews on these have got me thinking of a new possible addition to my stable. One question, the bezel insert printing seems a lot better on the noob-factory version, in your opinion, if you had the MBK version, would you change out the insert for a better one?

Thanks again for all the hard work on these reviews!!

[Stephane]

Once again, a great article By-Tor.

Thanks for sharing and taking the time to put it toghether

All the best.

Stephane

[AllergyDoc]

Phew.

I just bought a MBK from a member on RG.

I like how you word the "feel" of a watch. This is important to me. I would opt for the one that "felt" more expensive/substantial.

Any idea about the weight of the watches? How close are they to the gen?

[njespo]

great review! thank you bt

this has always been one of my favorites and once the budget allows, i am going to have to get one (or both)

[emuozz]

I was expecting for quite some time than some one, did this comparison. Thank you for this great review.

[By-Tor]

Any idea about the weight of the watches? How close are they to the gen?

I don't have very accurate scale, but both weigh about 145 grams, with all links intact. That's 10 grams more than a gen SS 16610 Submariner.

The gen might weigh something like 150 (I have no accurate numbers) because the bezel is solid gold. But I doubt there's a significant difference.

[By-Tor]

One question, the bezel insert printing seems a lot better on the noob-factory version, in your opinion, if you had the MBK version, would you change out the insert for a better one?

No, definitely not. The MBK insert is glossy and beautiful. The pearl isn't awesome, but it's not bad, either. I didn't even notice the printing, but you're probably right: The printing might be better on the Noob. Difficult to see, except from those huge pictures.

[chris5264]

Interesting about the mbk dial color,,,I had the TT noob and was totally impressed with the blue dial, just something you could look at over and over again. Got me curious how nice the MBK must be.

[By-Tor]

@chris: The Noob dial color is pretty much spot on... but the MBK color is even more blue... it's deeper.

Here is another photo, taken outside... just in the darker surroundings. The difference isn't big though.

Double-click for full size.

[StormTooper4]

Awesome Review thanks for putting this together

[EuroTimez]

Wow Awesome review.....

Thanks for that one, I think I'm enjoying it just as much as every other member here...

Yes there will be more reviews watches and reviews coming

Maybe an important issue for some and worthwhile to note. the MBK 2008 version TT or SS has a GEN BEZEL CONSTRUCTION, and it's build like the GEN!

By-Tor when you compare the Gold on the bezel of both, wouldn't you say the gold on the MBK Bezel is thicker (darker in colour) than the Noob TT?

According to MBK the gold on his watches have superiour gold --gold filled he calls it-- than the chinese reps (wrapped/plated).

[silvio]

Great review By-Tor.

Thought I was reading a John Holbrook's review article on IW magazine :-). Seriously it has the same aura and information, and is very helpful to us prospective buyer.

Thanks a lot for sharing sir.

[ubiquitous]

As usual, a very in depth and interesting review By-Tor. My take away from all of this is that if you want an ultimate 16613, you should combine parts from the noob and MBK and add a sprinkle of gen parts to the mix?

Perhaps a costly endeavor when it all comes down to it... But I do imagine that the end result could be quite nice...

Great read...

R

[dluddy]

Great read BT. I have always been tempted by the TT Black dial Sub....

I agree with Ubi that buying both and using the best parts plus gen crown/tube & Insert and you have a very nice watch ...

[By-Tor]

Wow Awesome review.....

Thanks for that one, I think I'm enjoying it just as much as every other member here...

Yes there will be more reviews watches and reviews coming

Maybe an important issue for some and worthwhile to note. the MBK 2008 version TT or SS has a GEN BEZEL CONSTRUCTION, and it's build like the GEN!

By-Tor when you compare the Gold on the bezel of both, wouldn't you say the gold on the MBK Bezel is thicker (darker in colour) than the Noob TT?

According to MBK the gold on his watches have superiour gold --gold filled he calls it-- than the chinese reps (wrapped/plated).

First: I completely missed the gen bezel construction. Silly me... I only noticed the bezel looks thicker.

About the bezel... now that you mention it, the bezel on the MBK version has a bit darker gold tone. I only can see it in the daylight though. The Noob bezel has been plated extremely well and smootly, but it really is more "yellow"... while the MBK version is more "brown yellow". Very small difference though.

PS: Thanks all.

@dluddy and Ubi: I agree, mixing both watches and adding some gen parts would be the ideal solution. Very expensive route. That's why I'd be very happy with Noob version + gen 18K crown (or even MBK crown)... or alternatively MBK with better datewheel (smaller date mag). But if you're not a Ultimate Geek like us, both watches are fine as they are.

[Dude]

By-Tor,

Awesome review. Do you know if either of these watches are the same or comparable to the 14K verion that "Perfect Clones" sells for $308?

Here is the link:

http://www.pc-80108.com/rlst10002-wrapped-...362-p-2537.html

Thanks

[By-Tor]

@Dude: No, definitely not. That watch isn't bad, but it has one fundamental flaw, which is the datewheel/cyclops positioned too right. It's very typical problem with Submariner/GMT reps. It also has pure stainless steel showing underneath the sides of the gold wrapped SEL.

I think I owned that exact same watch 3 years ago (from Joshua himself). Nice rep, but can't be compared to either of these (in any way).

[Dude]

@Dude: No, definitely not. That watch isn't bad, but it has one fundamental flaw, which is the datewheel/cyclops positioned too right. It's very typical problem with Submariner/GMT reps. It also has pure stainless steel showing underneath the sides of the gold wrapped SEL.

I think I owned that exact same watch 3 years ago (from Joshua himself). Nice rep, but can't be compared to either of these (in any way).

Thank you for the clarification!

[jamesg]

Great review BT, thank you.

[Sir-Lancelot]

Your reviews are always great and I still get excited when I see you post a new one. You could get paid to do these.

SD4000 and yourself should start up a replica magazine.

Excellent pictures and very informative. Thank you so much for sacrificing your free time to do this for us.

[jfreeman420]

First of all, very nice review. I always enjoy reading your posts by-tor.

The things that has always bothered me that no one ever addresses in these reps have to do with the bracelet. They never get the coronet right on the clasp. They also never get the thumbnail imprint correct, but the one thing that bothers me most is the sides of the bracelet aren't polished. Every modern two tone sub I have seen has the sides of the bracelet polished. Why are these still brushed? Is it just the angle that makes them appear brushed or is it something they refuse to do?

[Tribal]

Great Review as always...

I don't like this Rehaut engravings

Still waiting for the Euromariners from Chris.....

Hope they will come soon....

[By-Tor]

Thanks all! Appreciate the comments!

the one thing that bothers me most is the sides of the bracelet aren't polished. Every modern two tone sub I have seen has the sides of the bracelet polished.

Another myth that dies hard. There are both polished and brushed bracelet sides on the modern 16613.

See this one for example:

http://tinyurl.com/6z9jhf