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I have bumped a handful of old technical threads that I think will be of interest to newer members that missed them on their 1st run. RWG contains a true wealth of technical information that cannot be found (& has often been copied) on other sites - including the gen sites. These are the types of threads that brought many, including myself, to RWG & kept us here. Many (most?) of the breakthroughs that bridged reps, frankens & gens came from these threads, & many of today's vintage Rolex reps owe their accuracy to the pioneering work of many early & talented RWG members. Unfortunately, due to the passing of time & other indulgences, I am unable to add much to these threads beyond what they contain, so if you seek additional info, please do not be surprised if nothing more is provided. Also, due to the numerous forum software upgrades, some links may be broken &/or pics missing, so you may need to perform some detective work on your own. Enjoy.

So I've had this MBW 5512 sub sitting in a drawer for several months now and finally thought I'd do something with it. Frankly not sure why I bought it but I guess I was curious about the case as I've never worked on one before. Naturally, the case is a bit blocky and needs some refinement. So I drilled the 1.25mm lugholes, marginally thinned the lugs, cut/polished bevels and replaced the crown/tube with a gen 703/703-0 and reshaped the CGs. I had a spare gen bezel assembly and service insert. Gen service crystal as well. I find crystals in general fit really tight because the upper 1/2 of the outer rehaut is a tad wide. I actually cracked a CWP T19 (that happens with the Yuki cases as well sometimes). As such, I will have to mill the outer rehaut to gen spec at some point . I have not yet tested to see if a gen 1520/1530 movement will fit. Likewise, not sure a gen dial will fit as I have heard that some MBW will accept a gen dial and some won't. For now, just using the stock ETA movement/dial. Not sure what dial/movement I will eventually end up with but I'm leaning towards converting this to PCG as I've left a decent amount of meat to work with. Open to suggestions. Here's how it looks now:

I tried to manufacture some brass bezels and it never happened due to cost. So I used HR and changed almost every dimension of it on the lathe, turned out nice, but it's a lot of work... May as well seek out a Vietnamese caseset/ Tonny ($600) The case was totally changed also but that's another extreme makeover, it was a silix case.

General rule of thumb for me is: If the case is fitted with a 2824, a 1520 will fit. If it's a 2836, a 1570 will fit. I don't recall there ever being an MBW with 2824, but I could be mistaken?

If that's a 2836 inside, a 1520/1530 will not fit, unfortunately. You'd need a 1570 with date to fit that case. As for the dial; a 5512/5513 dial will fit; a 1680 dial will not.

Here is the MBK 5513/1680 lowdown... All the later MBK 5513/1680 cases I've had experience with were very close to a genuine 1680 case internally except for the dial window and dial seat sizes. MBK 5512/13/1680 -- The dial seat and dial window are cut for a 26mm 5513 spec dial and the inside of the case is spaced for an Eta 2836. Dial seat = the flat area inside the case where the dial mounts. Dial window = the opening in the front of the case where the dial shows. A genuine 1520/70 and 26mm genuine spec 5512/13 dial will not work properly because the stem will be too far to the front of the case. A genuine 1570/1575 date movement and 26.5mm genuine spec 1680 dial will work if the shoulder on the dial seat inside the case is enlarged from approximately 26.2mm to 26.7mm AND the dial window is enlarged slightly to expose more of the dial and allow more of the minute markers to show. The stem lines up Ok with this combination. You could cut the OD of an oem spec 1680 dial down to 26.0mm but it will probably cause the markers to be partially covered up (depending on each particular dial). If you want to go with an MBK case, rolex 1520/70 and 5512/13 dial...you will need to use a 1570/75 date movement with all the date works removed and the date wheel spacer still in place or a no date movement with a date wheel spacer, 1570/75 center wheel, canon pinion, and hour wheel. Why? Because the rolex 1520/70 no date movements are too thin to be used as is in an MBK case. If you use rolex type case screws, they usually have to be the razor edge type and it may still be hard to turn the movement inside the case because the screws may bind in the 'screw groove' cut in the case so you may have to use case clamps and screws. Turning a movement/dial inside the case (especially one that is a tight fit) can scratch paint off the dial. I sometimes use case clamps and screws in MBK cases so I do not have to move the movement/dial back and forth in the case to r/r the movement. Case clamps work as just good and do not leave marks inside the 'screw groove' in the case caused by running the screw head out against the wall of the 'screw groove' to hold the movement tight in the case. If you plan to use an MBK 5513/1680 case with a genuine rolex 1570/75 and 26.5mm dial, you need to have the dial seat and dial window cut. The dial window will work as is but it is a little bit too small for a 26.5mm 1680 dial and will scratch the minute markers and maybe the swiss T 25 at the bottom of the dial. This is why the outside diameter of the 1680 dials are roughly ground down to fit inside the shoulder cut in the dial seat on MBK 1680 watches...the dials were originally 26.5mm or so and they do a quickie grind job on them to reduce the od to fit inside the shoulder in the dial seat. Catch 22...if you enlarge the diameter of the dial window very much you will cut into the angle in the reflector aka 'rehaut'. I cut about .5mm total at a 90 degree angle to the front of the watch, not at an angle to match the reflector. After enlarging the dial window I finished the reflector with sandpaper while spinning the case in the lathe and you will never notice it has been enlarged. It is also a good idea to lightly sand the dial seat with 600 or 1000 sandpaper so the rough surface will not scratch the dial when turning the movement in the case. I doubt pictures would help much because anyone who can do the work can immediately see what needs to be done after measuring the dial, dial seat and dial window. In reality the MBK cases are Eta 2836 with 26mm dial or 1570/75 with 26.5mm dial cases. For 1520/70 and 26mm 5513 dials, go with a Yuki etc case to get by without any modifications. Note 5-30-16...I bought an MBW '5512' timehead (no bracelet) from an RWG member (easy deal!) a while back but the watch came with a thicker 1665 SD bezel assembly. Counting the cost of the watch plus a new bezel assembly, I probably would have been better off buying a Yuki case for an extra $150/$200. It had an Asian etaclone 2836 and a pretty good dial. It seems that a few 5512/13/1680 from this last batch came with SD bezels and you will not know until it arrives. So...imho, the bottom line for an MBW case for a 1680 project using a rolex 1570/75 vs a Yuki case would be 60/40 in favor of the Yuki case for these reasons: 1...Yuki case is oem spec. 2...You get the correct bezel. 3...The Yuki case needs no modification. 4...The Yuki case has proper letters and numbers. Downside...no dial or movement. MBW disadvantages when using it for a 1680 with 1570/75 and 26.5mm dial...if you count the cost of having an MBW case modified to accept a 1570/75 and 26.5mm dial, you will probably need to spend an additional $50 to $100 and if it has the wrong bezel you are out an additional $50 to $100. Upside...lower buy-in and a movement/dial combo left over to sell. MBW watch vs Yuki case for Eta movement project...imho 60/40 for the MBW case only if it has the correct bezel and a good dial. But here's the catch...for a 5512/13 you probably need to put an Eta 2846 or something similar in it for a slower beat rate and the MBW dial might not be up to snuff. Add the cost of a 2846 etc and a dial and you are back in Yuki case $$ territory. MBW watch vs Yuki case for a 1680 project using a rolex 1570/75 and 26.5mm dial...Go for the Yuki unless you get a real deal on an MBK watch with the correct bezel and a good movement and dial to sell to help pay for the modifications to the case. DW 5513 and 1680 cases... These are all really 1680 spec cases (more or less) so if you have one with 5513 stamped on it, a 1520 and 26mm 5513 dial will mount up in the case but the dial is a bit too small for the dial window and will also be too far from the dial seat. What you end up with is a 26mm dial in a 26mm dial window with the dial mounted about .8mm below the dial seat and nothing holding the dial in place except the dial screws. I did make a very thin spacer out of aluminum to fill in the space on one DW '5513' but it took a long time to make the spacer in a lathe because it was so thin and flimsy. I had to finish it up in an old 8mm WW type 'bezel chuck' made in the 1920s. WW = regular watchmaker lathe. 'Bezel chuck' = a chuck that looks like a steel wheel with concentric grooves cut in it. It will expand or contract a few mm to accommodate small, thin bezel rings etc. DW cases are a low $$ alternative to expensive 'genspec cases' but you will need a genspec bezel kit, crystal, tube, crown etc. Also...as I have mentioned many times before, the DW cases have rounded case sides like a DJ and not flat like a submariner. They could be sanded flat on a disc grinder or by hand but it would take a lot of careful work. One good thing about the rounded case sides is they make the watch look like an old 'high mileage' example with a storied history after they get sufficiently scuffed up. I have seen a few genuine 1680/5512/13 with the case sides rounded from years of wear and numerous polish jobs so there are genuine examples with rounded case sides in circulation. 3-23-21: Yuki, DW (David Wong), and MBW/MBK cases are no longer available so now it is Ruby, Phong and a few others selling cases with Ruby's probably being less expensive. Once in a while one of the Yuki, MBW/MBK, DW cases may show up for sale here but not often. Note 2-26-16...I tried a genuine 7mm crown on an MBK 5512 I got last week and it will not work because the case tube in the MBK case is not oem spec and the post on the genuine crown will not go into the MBK case tube...the hole in the tube is too small. The MBK tube is made to have an O ring down low outside and the crown does have the skirt machined at the bottom for O ring clearance but of course none of it is oem spec. On my other MBK cases, I removed the case tubes as soon as I worked on them and installed aftmkt oem spec case tubes (did not try any genuine oem crowns) and the oem spec case tubes screwed right in but iirc the relief in the case for the case tube base gasket (where the tube contacts the case) was not oem spec and I had to use an aftmkt gasket of some sort. The MBK crown will not screw down onto an oem spec case tube either because the MBK crown threads are too small. The MBK tube and crown look like the same case tube and crown set that came on some of my DW cases. The MBK case tube is made like an old 8mm tube except for the size. Note 10-6-16...IF the case neck is oem spec 28.2mm and IF you need a new bezel assembly...here is what I found (usually) works: GS PA 462-66 crystal and ST/Clark etc bezel kit IF the ID of the inner bezel is 30.2mm. The 28.2mm case neck and 30.2mm inner bezel will not crack the crystal when pressing it on because it is not a real tight fit on the crystal while at the same time the crystal will not pop off or leak in day to day service (although I have not tested one below about 5 atm/70 psi). GS crystals are precision made and always the same spec unlike much of the inconsistent junk scattered all over the internet. The PA 462-66 is a domed crystal that has the sidewall coming straight up about 1.7 to 2.0mm above the bezel insert. You also have to make sure the bezel washer does not cause the rotating bezel to bind. The washer needs to fit over the small lip on the inner bezel (if there is one, it is there to keep the sharp washer away from the crystal) while not sticking out over the outer edge of the inner bezel or it will bind the rotating bezel. Many (if not most) aftmkt bezel washers are out of spec in my experience. I have tried this same setup with a GS PA 462-67 crystal and the inner bezel was too tight. Also measured a couple MBK inner bezels and they were both 30.15mm id...not much difference but they can be pretty tight with the GS PA 462-66 crystal. Matter of fact, I broke a new PA 462-66 with a MBK inner bezel on an MBK case a few days ago. It leaked and I had to look down through the outer edge of the crystal with a 10x loupe under bright light to see the hairline cracks. I found that ST/Clark rotating bezels will accept oem spec inserts and they snap in correctly...many aftmkt inserts and insert seats in bezels are out of spec. More DW case info: DW 55xx case review... - The Rolex Area - RWG

Hi Gents, In my journey to get closer and closer to a proper BC rep, I'm looking for a good replacement bezel for the 6200/6538/5510 Silix case we are many to have used in our builds. I've been reading and re-reading many threads but did not find a good answer to that question. Would anyone have clues where to hunt it for or know of any infos/ressources related ?

There are those trademark bevels. Looks great already.

Wore my 16570 today. Enjoying a cigar after work

This is the 1st of a number of old threads I will be bumping for those who may not have seen some of the more technical articles that RWG is famous for.

Genuine 1963 PCG

Sure, here you go: ...compared to the old Cartel case (above) ...compared to the Cartel 1665(above)

That's awesome and congrats, bud!! So what are the specs??

Awesome. This is going to be a really special build[emoji1303]

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