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It's junk like this that makes Phong prices seem reasonable.

VRF used to be Ok but now it's not...it went PC. They ran me off years ago because I sent a message to one of the bosses that some fake parts were being sold on VRF and pointed out a couple. The guy blew up at me. Turned out I was right. I may have to go back on VRF later to get Fool's Gold prices for my old rolex parts but that would the only reason. For now it's scroo 'em and feed 'em fish heads.

I did not know you were going to use a genuine movement/dial so I guess you should go with genuine parts if possible. The 16013 case is close but the 3035 is thicker above the stem center line than a 1570 no date with a 1016 dial so the stem will be too high in the case tube...same problem you run into with no date 15xx movements in MBK cases. A no date 1570 with 1016 dial is a drop in fit in a 16200 case and this is why I used the 16220 in my first go round when I first used a 1570 In it...later I put a 2846 in it. Next time I would use a JMB case when going with an Eta or something similar and a replica dial. A 1570/75 date movement and flat dial with the proper od will fit in a 15000/16000 case but not a 15200/16200 case. A 1520/70 no date with the proper od dial will fit into a 15200/16200 case. I have a nos 1570 and nos 1016 dial/hands/crown etc but no luck finding a like new case in 10+ years. After this long I would go with an aftmkt case if there was a super good one available but am gun shy because with replica parts you can always get some unpleasant surprises and I have seen no feedback on any of them. May have to go with a Yuki case just so I can put all the parts together but I do not know anyone who has used a Yuki 1016 case so I am a little bit scared of them and Phong is too much $$ for a 'road test' case. I do not mind 5513, 1680 with out of spec cases because they all are out of spec so I just go with MBK or Yuki. Nothing is easy.

I saw a bunch of fake Seiko 5 a few years ago for $40 each and I could buy genuine gray market Seiko 5 back then for $45 if I got 20 at a time. The $45 price included the box/papers, for a few bucks less they left the b/p off. Still see fake 5 today but they are a lot cheaper, bought one for the movement a while back for $12, signed bracelet and all but it had a 'pot metal' case where the others had steel. Iirc the genuines are now up to about $50 with box. Have a rose gold plated over steel manual wind dressy AP and a matching raw steel AP, never saw any like them on the cartel ads. Also have a couple steel Oakley Time Bomb automatics from 6 or 8 years back, they look pretty good. Not many of them around I bet. ...and a few steel fake cartier jumbo size square Santos style from back before the genuine 100 came out. They were called 'convertibles' and have a white dial/black Romans with screws in the bezel on one side and a black dial with silver Romans and no screws in the bezel on the other side. They have two quartz movements and a /convertible' leather strap and buckle.

Pay now, ask questions later. http://www.network54.com/Forum/207593/thread/1447326524/last-1448498582/View+All Guy will probably end up with a cartel watch and not know the difference. Genius number two wants to know if this rotted out 5513 is Ok. http://www.network54.com/Forum/207593/message/1448544649/How+concerned+should+I+be+about+the+pitting+on+this+5513- Genius number three tells him it is fine: "if it does not bother you and you are not going to immerse your timepiece in water, then I see no reason for any concerns." The case is Junk...I doubt if water dripping out of it would clue them in. Unbelievable. I get some of my best laughs on VRF.

Here is the way it is (imho)...since the case has already been bored for oversize 1016 spring bars, the case has been killed as far as being used for a genuine DJ. So...you need the proper bezel and crystal. For a low profile 1601/1016 project case you probably need a lower profile bezel so it will not look like someone dropped a silver dollar down on it. The thicker bezel may be Ok spec wise but it just does not look right. The 16xx, 16000, 16200, and 1016 cases all have the same size case neck so a T22 spec crystal will work. The catch is you need a bezel that fits the T22 crystal after it has been mounted on the case and most of these projects simply do not work with a ready made bezel without swapping crystals around. Catch...bezel/crystal fitting usually needs an experienced watch fiddler (usually with a lathe) to make it work. Fact of life. What to do? Buy a JMB case assembly complete but it's too late for that...so maybe lower the profile of the bezel by sanding it down on a sheet of flat metal, glass etc. You might have to try 2 or 3 different brands of crystals to find one that fits properly and it's a good idea to start with a GS PA464-64C because they are very close to genuine. I would not waste $$ on a genuine crystal. Something else...there is no way in the world to tell if the bezel you bought is genuine or fake. Why? Because any competent machinist can take a $15 ST bezel and after an hour on the lathe, no one can tell the difference. Sad but true. That's why it would have been better to buy a JMB case complete and go from there. Q...Am I talking out my azz? A...usually, but not this time. I have put a few dozen of these projects together and presently have a '1016' with Eta 2846, genuine 16220 case, GS PA464-64C, machined ST bezel etc and it looks fine with the too thick case and bezel...sorta like a newer model. Otoh I have a JMB case set and it looks better to me, like an older model. This should make you feel better...a 1016 project is a lot easier than a 5513 or 1680 project because they have more bezel parts that won't fit, expen$ive crown parts, and the 1680 has a date that never lines up. I have done a few of them too. Good luck!

I am glad to see everyone is not bending over to the greedy swiss parts cut-off. I for one will NEVER buy another new swiss watch from an AD that would send one cent of profit to any swiss brand watch company. I have to buy swiss parts now and then but avoid it if at all possible. The swiss brands' "No Parts For You!" policy is why I took up replicas as a side hobby. My latest new watch is a Bulova Accutron II, an old American brand now made by Citizen in Japan/HK etc. The A-tron II quartz tuning fork runs at 262,000 vibrations per second (normal quartz is 32768), the original Accutron 214 metal tuning fork was 360. http://www.people.timezone.com/library/horologium/horologium631672882451976629 Industry Action Fund - Progress Reportfrom Steve Domb, Project Manager, BWCMG Industry Action FundOur Industry is faced with anti-competitive practices, and it is very difficult to be entirely open about the actions we are taking to combat these, without potentially handing an advantage to those who are intent on enforcing them by whatever means at their disposal. For this reason, you will have to forgive us for leaving out some of the details, but we have been working hard over the last few months, and are now in a position to report back. From the Guild's perspective, the best solution would be for the Swiss to come to the realization for themselves that they have made a monumentally bad business decision in refusing to openly supply spare parts, and of their own volition reverse this policy before they do any more damage to their Brands. The issue is, therefore, how to demonstrate to them what this damage is. A couple of months ago, at the request of the IAF, Christian Dannemann wrote a very telling piece on his internet blog (http://watchguy.co.uk/swatch-group-parts-policy), in which he suggested consumers should avoid buying Swatch Group watches in future, and invited his readers to write directly to Swatch telling them so. The response of his readers was immediate, and the effect was very interesting. Within a few days, Christian was contacted by Swatch, and invited to Switzerland to “discuss” matters. A couple of weeks later, Christian was on a plane to Bienne, and whilst nothing new came from the discussions, at least a line of communications was opened. When he came back, Christian decided to set up a Customer survey to get the views of enthusiasts and collectors (http://watchguy.co.uk/watchguy-survey-swiss-watch-industry), with the intention of sending the results to the Swiss in order to reinforce just how much they are damaging themselves. The results made for very interesting reading (http://watchguy.co.uk/swiss-watch-customer-surveythe-results) with the Independent Service Sector consistently outperforming the Manufacturers, and with over 98% of respondents wanting open supply of spare parts. Christian has duly forwarded the results to the Swiss Federation, and is waiting for their response. The survey was also reported in the trade press (http://www.watchpro.com/18458-watch-guy-seeks-answers-to-spare-parts-stoppage), which will not have gone unnoticed. But what can we do if the Swiss are foolish enough to ignore the requirements of their customers? Like all situations where a change of approach is required of someone, there are two choices. Either they change their approach for themselves, or they are made to change. A fight is best avoided, but sometimes avoidance isn't possible, and it is always best to be prepared. The Guild believes that by refusing open supply of spares, the Swiss companies are in breach of a range of Laws and trade agreements. The IAF team have been looking closely at the options available, and the processes needed to have the Law enforced. Once again, it would be indiscrete to be public with too much detail, but we are pleased to release the following announcement:- “A delegation from the Industry Action Fund (IAF) of the British Watch and Clock Makers’ Guild, met at the beginning of November with Senior Officials from the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) to discuss the Anti-Competitive practices being imposed by the Swiss Watch Industry, and how these are impacting both the Consumer, and the Independent Repair Trade. Before the meeting, IAF Project Manager, Steve Domb, had provided BIS with a briefing paper on the background to the situation, and the issues that urgently need addressing. This was supported at the meeting with a more comprehensive information pack. Steve reports: “When we arrived for the meeting, it was clear that the officials had studied the briefing and were well prepared. We knew within the first minute of the meeting starting that we had a sympathetic and knowledgeable audience, because one of our hosts opened proceedings by removing from his wrist a vintage Swiss watch. He then told us about his recent experience of getting an exorbitant quote for service from the manufacturer, and subsequently having the work done at an Independent Watchmaker for about one eighth of the price.” The meeting worked methodically through all the issues relating to parts supply, barriers to entry created by the manufacturers requirements for specific tooling for each brand, and by product specific training requirements. The IAF highlighted the impact on consumers, and presented the results of Christian Dannemann’s recent survey. The IAF team also went to great lengths to highlight the true size of the market for watches in the UK (over £1 billion annually), the current actions in the EU Court, and the worldwide nature of the parts embargo being imposed. The team from BIS provided the IAF with very helpful advice on the next steps needed, and have put us in contact with the Competitions and Markets Authority so that we can discuss the matter with them. The IAF will report again on progress in due course.” There are those amongst us who have little faith in Politicians, or that anyone who has the power to enforce the Law has any interest in doing so on our behalf. However, if you want Laws enacted to support the consumer, and existing Laws enforced to ensure our trade can best serve their customers, then these are the people and organizations you must engage with. The fact of the matter is that Politicians can only provide support to a cause when they have the issues efficiently laid out before them, and a timely opportunity to raise them. The enforcers of the Law have carefully established processes which the aggrieved must follow if the Law is to be applied. There is evidence to be gathered, documentation to be prepared, and meetings to be held. Please believe that we are working hard on all of these. Keep supporting the IAF, and encourage others to do so. Please also make an effort to work with everyone else in the Industry to present a united front. I will report again soon. Steve Domb Project Manager The British Watch and Clock Makers‟ Guild Industry Action Fund

"I may have chipped some of the paint off the edge of the dial when installing it (spinning movement around when attaching movement screws)..." I have the same trouble. I usually sand the dial seat with 600 and 1000 sandpaper to help prevent it, some are pretty rough. On most of my Frankenstein projects with genuine movements, I use case clamps and smaller head screws in place of the oem type 'jack screws' so I do not have to turn the movement inside the case. This does not always prevent paint damage though and the last F-stein I took apart with MBK case (using clamps and screws), Yuki dial, 1520 had some paint pull off where it just stuck to the dial seat...not much way to prevent this. It's a paint losing battle.

"Yeah that's the downside with mechanical watches - the service component of it is just so expensive." Official omega repair prices (this has been posted before): http://forums.timezone.com/index.php?t=tree&goto=7108527&rid=12189#msg_7108527 "I'm not even wearing the vintage watches now as I know its just a wallet burn if it dies...." The saving grace for 'common' vintage watches (Benrus, Bulova, Wittnauer etc) is that you can usually buy another complete watch for not much $$ but higher grade vintage watches and parts (GP, rolex, omega, JLC etc) are now out of the ball park in price. Rolex 1520/30/60/70 movement parts prices are so high now that I parked all my genuine rolex watches along with a couple completed 'Frankensteins' and removed the genuine movements from any unfinished F-stein projects and will either stick Etas in them or sell the cases and dials. As for the left over genuine rolex movements...I will either put them in genuine cases or sell the movements later. Pizzing $$ away on these projects had to stop. One good thing is I have gathered up some new and nos watches with swiss 28xx Etas in them so I am Ok on Etas. Otoh I have quite a few watches with DG, NN, Seagull etc movements and they are basically worthless.

Tongue in cheek... The term 'beater' always revs me up. What is a 'beater'? VRF guys will say "5513!", TZ guys will say "Patek trip date/moon, Purist guys will say "A. Lange Zeitwerk repeater, Sir." while Nanuq will say "The last one I broke all to hell." ...but times have changed and by definition (imho), today's 'beater' is usually no longer a mechanical watch because truthfully, they are about as tuff as hen eggs. Many will say "Ok then, how about a G-Shock?" Well...they are usually plastic and thick so they stand up high on the wrist and are just looking for trouble...metal door frames, rock walls, etc and besides...they are fugly, lumpy, and fray cuffs. Nix the G. Next they say "Ok how about a Seiko 5?" Nah...mechanical = fragile and they run only if you shake the pizz out of 'em. Nix the 5. Timex? The word j-j-j-junk comes to mind. Today's Timex ain't yesterday's Timex. Nix the mex. The answer is (drum roll), there are hundreds of 'beaters' but the vast majority today happen to be quartz (analog or digital but digital = Ugh!). A 'beater' needs to be in a low profile case (to help it stay out of trouble) with sapphire (prone to shatter), MG (prone to scratch and shatter) or acrylic (prone to it all) crystal with a canvas, rubber, leather, metal, nylon, barbwire etc strap or bracelet. Rotating bezel? Nah again, they are for kids and real divers (not bedroom divers). Screw down crown? Yeah, if you can stand it (stripped threads). Crown guards? Nah, why guard something that usually gets stripped, not knocked off? Q...Ok smarty, what 'beater' would you get? A...A thin quartz pocket watch in a steel or plastic case carried inside a leather/nylon etc pouch on my belt. "B-b-b-but you can't wear a pocket watch with a suit!" You do not need a beater if you are wearing a suit, you only need a 'beater' out in the wild, my child. So...a 'beater' = what you like and can afford to lose, break, or destroy. Each to his/her own. Edit: All kidding aside, how about a Bulova Precisionist or Accutron II? They are cool (smooth sweep quartz) and the price is right on many models on eBay.

"As you can see my Service 127 measures 30.25 and Service 19 measures 30.22." I measured a new genuine 127 and it is 30.42mm at the base (not mounted on a case). A new Clark 127 is 30.28mm. A new ST 127 is 30.32mm. A new Bestfit Materials Co. 127 is 30.3mm. "I ran into this exact problem when I was trying to install a Tropic 19 that Gary Clark Sent me. It measured 30.39 and I couldn't get my retention ring around it." I measured a new genuine T19 and it is 30.42mm at the base (not mounted on a case). A GS PA462-66 (T19) is 30.38mm. A GS PA462-67 (T19) is 30.43mm. A new Sternkreuz T19 is 30.33mm. A new Clark T19 is 30.30mm. The crystals get smaller in od as you measure up from the base. You will get a better measurement (to match with the bezel) if the crystal is mounted on the case neck...unless the crystal is loose on the case neck. On project watches, I gave up buying crystals by brand and just buy different brands and try to match them with the case/bezel combo. GS crystals are always the same but some supply houses change crystal suppliers and they might not be exactly the same from one order to the next. I always order three at a time hoping to get all three from the same batch.

"Dial is unknown on gen 1520." Case = Yuki. This is something I have seen quite a bit on various projects. The proper dial size should be 26.0mm and about .4mm thick. The dial opening in the case should be around 25.4mm +/-. You will need to measure all three to find the trouble. The dial should also touch the bottom side of the dial seat inside the case when everything is tightened up. On some aftmkt cases (DW for example), the dial opening is cut for a 26.5mm 1680 size dial and a 5512/13 dial will always appear be too small. To make matters worse, all the DW cases I have seen were machined for a 1575 date movement, none for a 1520/60/70 no date movement so the dial/movement mounts too low in the case and the edge of the dial and movement can be seen around the outer diameter. I have never seen this problem on Yuki cases (yet) so my guess is the dial od is too small or the movement/dial is too far to one side...hopefully that is all it is. Even on genuine cases you can sometimes see brass showing on the dial around the edges where the paint has worn/chipped off. If there is too much space between the inside diameter of the case and the movement you can sometimes see down beside the edge of the dial to the movement plate on one side or the other. Look at the center hole in the dial and see if the hour wheel tube is centered in the dial hole. This can also cause the trouble you are having but there is not usually enough room for the dial to be very far off without the hour wheel or hour hand hub rubbing the dial hole on one side. The last time I worked on one of these things (about three months ago...MBK case, Yuki dial, 1520), I got so aggravated that I stuck all the parts in boxes and put them way until I cool off. So far, I have not cooled down much. These things can be a real headache. Nothing fits. Nothing at all. Never. I've been wearing my trusty quartz TAG Heuer 2000 (WK1112-0) while I cool down. Trouble free watches like the T/H make me feel guilty because I am used to mechanical watch trouble. This is a twisted hobby. Marquis de Sade would have loved it.

I knew a fellow who was the head mechanic at a rolex AD for over 20 years and he said when rotating bezels fell off of 5512/13/1680 etc (a common occurrence) he always replaced the crystal and complete bezel assembly because mixing the parts (genuine parts) did not always work. There is a lot to go wrong and he spent a lot of time screwing with them in order to get the 'right feel' and he kept a small box with inner and outer bezels for these old watches handy. I have the od of a genuine inner bezel written down and it is 35.50mm on average...measured one way it was 35.49 and another it was 35.50. I always go with the larger size on the od of the inner bezel and smaller size on the id of the rotating bezel. The case neck has to be the right size, the od of the crystal after it is fitted on the case neck has to be the right size, the crystal retainer bezel has to be the right size (id) plus the right size (od) after being pressed down over the crystal, the spacer has to be the correct thickness, and the id of the rotating bezel has to be the right size. After fighting snap on bezels for years, there is a lot to be said for spring wire retainer bezels, they have enough slack to take care of sloppy fitting parts and they are hard to knock off...also hard to r/r though. When was the last time anyone lost a spring wire bezel from an F520117 noobmariner? You can't even blast one off. Imho, with replica 5512/13/1680,1675 etc, you are usually better off to use quality replica parts and just match them up or modify them to fit. Adding genuine parts into the mix does not always work, costs a lot of $$, and sometimes makes it worse. There are three or four different crystals for 5512/13 in the GS line plus Sternkreuz and a dozen others, sometimes you have to swap crystals around too. I do not use genuine crystals on Frankensteins etc because I have had good luck with various mix and match aftmkt crystals. Sometimes you need a 'misfit' to make it all work. Let us know how it goes with the genuine parts. Hope it all works out.

I agree with mvb, genuine or not, the price is high for the condition. If it is genuine and I was buying it, I would peg it at $500/$600 and that is because gold and clasp parts are high right now. I bought a tutone 15053 OPD, complete watch with ratty 13 link ss/18k oyster bracelet and drowned 3035 mvt for $300 a while back. I figure $300 = gold value plus leftovers. The way I look at high priced watch parts is how hard would it be for me to sell it at the asking price. The reason why rough parts bring a high price on the internet is because the 'net has a huge audience and many of them are walking sideways. Good deals in rolex parts are in the trenches, not on the internet. I bought a 13 link 19mm C&I rivet oyster a month ago at the local flea market for $20 but it is missing the clasp cap. Not bad though. Price one on VRF.

"How long does the guy have before he forfeits it?" He has to make a payment within 30 days plus a 'fee' and interest, then pay on it again (plus another 'fee' and interest) before the end of 60 days, or pay all 'fees' and interest due and refinance it. Fees and interest at the end of 60 days will be over $100. Some shops allow the customer to pay only the fees and interest every 30 days without making a payment on the loan and at the end of 60 days they have to pay everything they owe and take the item back or pay all fees and interest and refinance it all over again. No payment in the first or second 30 day period and he loses it. Shops usually hold the item for 30 more days before putting it out for sale.

They offered to buy it for $1500, I offered to buy it for $1700 or loan $1000 on it for 90 days. He hocked it for $500 and will probably never be back to pay the loan off and pick it up. The shop owner and the 'scout' said the guy will not be back and they are about as good a judge of characters like this as the average professional head shrinker.

If the crown is stainless steel and the threads, clutch, and spring are all Ok it should be all right. Some have a brass inner threaded part with a steel clutch and cap and they hold up pretty good too. Be careful with crowns made out of cheapo 'pot metal' as they usually have trouble early on. I have had good luck with the crowns on JMB and StoneP cases. Genuine crowns are mostly made out of nickel silver with a steel cap and later 'monobloc' models are all steel. Many replica 6mm crowns are made to the same spec as a crown on a 16200...6mm od but take a 5.3mm case tube. Your 16000 case is all 6mm so make sure you get a 6mm crown made for a regular 6mm case tube. It is all in the crown info 'sticky' above. Prices have gone crazy...brand new 5.3/6.0mm steel crowns were $20 each in 1995, yellow gold 5.3/6.0mm were $35, 7mm steel were $35, and 7mm gold were $75 from a supply house on 47th St in NYC that I had an account with back then. The mechanic at a local rolex AD used to give me all the 'take off' crowns. Now take offs are going for $75+ each on eBay. A new genuine crystal for a 16000 DJ was $17.50, one for a 5513 was $15.50.

I have a couple friends who scout watches and one called this morning from a pawn shop where a guy had a tutone black dial acrylic crystal submariner in good condition that he wanted to know if it was genuine. My friend does 'look overs' for the pawn shop and he said it was genuine. The guy asked what the shop would give for it and the pawn shop boss said "$1500 right now". The guy said no. The watch owner and my friend went outside to talk it over (with permission from the shop boss). He called and asked how much I would pay for it and I said go to $1700 or would loan $1000 on it for 90 days and take $1100 at pick up. The guy did not say a word, turned around, went inside and pawned it for $500. Why? Because he wanted to "deal with someone he knows". No one working in the pawn shop had ever seen the guy before and all have worked there 5 years or more and they all doubt he will ever come back and pick it up. He has to make a payment within 30 days plus a 'fee' and interest, then pay on it again (plus another 'fee' and interest) before the end of 60 days, or pay all 'fees' and interest due and refinance it. Fees and interest at the end of 60 days will be over $100. It's a license to steal. Always has been. I will still have a shot at it for $1500 if the guy chokes. I see crazy things like this all the time.

Here is one on eBay for $96.95 plus $10 shp...item number 221906955299 You might find them for a little less now and then but if it was me, I would stick with new swisseta as long as they are reasonably priced ($175 - $200). What is up with this guy asking $537.49 for a swisseta 2836, item number 360798166820 ?? ...while ST has complete running watches...screw back ss case, sd crown, 100 mwr, sapphire xtal with a swisseta 2824 for $179. It's a crazy world out there...

"I have a genuine 1603, I've been contemplating a modern (gen) Datejust." If it was me, I would jump over 16000 types unless you want an plastic windshield, and go with 16200 etc. Why? I like the 3135 better and there should be a longer supply of parts. No telling when The Genius in Charge will cut 3035 parts off...but what do I know? I figured everything was Ok with parts for a swisseta 2836.

"I'm deciding to go for a 1655 superfranken..." "I'm thinking to recycle my Phong based superfranken 1675, that was put together by Rolex Addict or sell it, I'm still debating it. I have invested over 6K in that GMT." Frankenstein 1655 and 1675 projects are expensive for sure. I started on a 1655 project in mid 2011 with a used Phong case in fine condition, genuine 1575 almost fully converted to 1575GMT with new parts, and aftmkt dial/hands. The killer has been the GMT parts. After four years it is not finished (still missing a few $GMT$ parts) and the project passed $3000 a long time ago just in parts. If I bought the Phong case new it would be close to $4000. The only thing that would hold the cost down to the low to mid $3000+ mark is that I can do all the work myself. Hire it out and the cost will rise rapidly. Since the 1575 with GMT parts is worth about what I have in it, I may put it away and go with a nos swisseta 2836 with Asian GMT conversion and slow it down to 21600 bph with 2846 escape wheel, pallet fork, and balance assembly plus taller hour wheel, center second pinion, and cp. From my experience, the Asian non adjustable GMT conversions are basically trouble free. Looking back at the hassle and expense and knowing what I know now...if I wanted a 1655 today, I would probably pick out the best cartel 1655 with a good bracelet and DG GMT movement, c/o the movement, and go with it for around $300 or less for a while before getting into a high $$ 1655 project. If I wanted a high quality 'reasonable' cost Frankenstein project, I would go with a Yuki case/dial and genuine movement 5512 (1560/70) or 5513 (1520). An MBK 5512/13/1680 case might save a few $$ but you would need to use a date movement with the date works removed. No date vintage projects are easier even when using genuine movements because less parts = less trouble and besides, slow set dates are a curse.

All I could find on the Miyota 9015: 11 1/2 ligne = 26.0mm 24 jewels 3.9mm thick (6.0mm thick from tip of second hand pinion to back side of winding rotor) hand hole sizes H = 1.52mm M = 1.0mm S = .17mm stem thread size is tap 10 same as eta

My guess is that it is not as bad as it seems...yet. As time goes by, eta movements and parts will go up quite a bit, especially if they really do cut parts off for the 2824/36, 2892, 7750, and 6497. One thing that will ease the shock for us is maybe using clone movements on projects but from what I have seen their failure rate is around 25% and parts are pricey on eBay considering a complete movement goes for $75 or so. As for clone parts, the only place I have seen clone parts is eBay when looking at swiss eta 28xx parts. http://www.ebay.tv/sch/i.html?_sop=1&_nkw=eta+2836+movement&_frs=1 Imho Citizen really missed the boat when they made the affordable and reliable 9015...they should have made it with the same dial foot holes, crown/date position, and hand sizes as the eta 28xx. I am not high on Sellita and Valanvron clones as I would just bite the bullet and use an eta at this point in time. I have seen up close what happened with rolex parts from being able to get parts from most USA supply houses for 25+ years to all of a sudden rolex closing off all parts to supply houses. Next, rolex allowed parts accounts to a select few independent repair shops if they met certain requirements. Next, they closed almost all of the parts accounts off making many parts prices jump 400% or more. Example...I needed a 'balance stop spring 8115' for a 1570 a few weeks ago and they were between $40USD used to $138 (!!) new on eBay. Luckily I found one I bought when we had a parts account and it was marked $8 and that was the price we charged a customer if we put one in their watch.

And the end of an eta... It looks like the swatch group (aka the snatch grope) may be going to cut off all common eta movements and parts to 'non account holders' after 12-31-15... http://watchguy.co.uk/swatch-group-parts-policy/ But they will still overhaul your $25 quartz eta 955.xxx for only $415. Plus $hipping and fondling. Relax, it's all Ok as long as Hattori does not cut off supplies of the PC21 and Miyota keeps cranking out the 2030. I guess my next Frankenstein 5513 will have a PC 21...

"But it takes a year to build a Rolex!!!" And 5 years to pay for one.