Are You Getting Crap Watches Too?

[Whatever123]

I'd say my rate is about 50/50 up to now. It's a bit strange - we really seem to accept a lot of problems with rep watches while we would have returned a gen straight away. Partly that's because of the price, sure. But I think it's also a psychological issue - we still think "Hey, what a great value", because we bought the rep for 1/10th of the gen price and therefore we tend to accept some minor issues. At least that's how I'm thinking. Problem is, if we'd return all watches with minor issues we would indeed return about 75% and all the dealers would go bust...

Anyway, I also think the overall quality of reps is not too good, at least compared to gens that is. But usually you can fix most of the issues yourself. And that's part of the fun imo. Personally I think buying gens is a bit boring...

Cheers,

Whatever

[Katerchen]

+1

@Frank

Same reason why i choose better to get some gen-parts

and modify the reps to frankens...

George

[maxman]

If I was having the problems some members were experencing I would probably not buy reps. I dont have nearly as many reps as some members but so far my experence has been very good overall. The first thing for me is "reasonable expectations", a $300.00 rep Is not going to be as good as a $3.000 gen, aint going to happen. I think some people lose site of this, no one In this thread naturally. That being said, I have really enjoyed my reps and there all behaving themselves quite well, all things considered. I to have had some minor Issues but nothing serious, not yet anyway. I have 12 reps with a white SA on the way. I try to buy reps with a fairly good track record. I read as many reviews as I can on the rep I want to purchase. So far this has proven to be a successful aproach. I also realize that I have had some pretty good luck so far. My next rep could be a turd, I sure hope not I give the Asian rep makers a lot of credit for the reps that they produce, not all of them of course. I have to remember that although the authorities look the other way, this is still counterfeiting and against the law. These rep makers dont have the same sterile work environments that the legit companys do. The fact that they can make these as well as they do still amazeses me at times. They have to work under the cloak of darkness and secrecy. There being made In someones basement for gods sake. My experence has been that the more I spend on a rep the better It Is. This is not always the case but it does seem to be the case more times than not. Im sure If I would have purchased as many reps as some members here I too would have more problems. I will probably stick to purchasing 2-3 reps a year from here on out. The last thing I will mention are the Asian clone movements, take the 7750 for example. Most of my reps have this movement because I perfer chronographs. All of my 7750's are running well and only 2 of them have been serviced. The Zigmeister himself says that there Is "no discernable difference between the ETA and clone". This may not be a direct quote but It's close. The big thing of course Is to have It serviced. Based on my experence I have to agree with Zig. I dont think there are to many people around here that know more about movements than are very own Zigmeister. Franco another brilant watchmaker has many good things to say about the 7750 Asian clone. I know that there use to be some problems years ago but they do seem to be doing a better job with these movements. So the news Is not all bad and there are members here like myself that have had a pretty good experence with this rep hobby. As I type this Im looking down at my Omega PO chrono. It's keeping great time and It's has great AR and the lume is very good for a rep. I know, sunkin DW and the pushers are off a bit, but that really dosent bother me that much because the quailty is very good for a rep. I guess the coolest part of this hobby Is making that rep as gen like as we want, franken anyone. Oh well thats my story and Im sticking to it Mike.... No powermax for the maxman

[gran]

[JohnCraig]

What about the reps we trade among ourselves? What is the ratio of good (as described) versus bad (shall we just say "less than' described)?

[Ronin]

What about the reps we trade among ourselves? What is the ratio of good (as described) versus bad (shall we just say "less than' described)?

Surprisingly, my luck has been pretty good. About 90% Success. One DOA, and a few minor issues. All corrected.

[By-Tor]

Here's some facts to consider (just a few details about my watches):

New crystal for gen Breitling Steelfish Superocean: 280 Euros + 50 Euros to install

Complete service for gen Rolex GMT Master II 16710: 500 Euros

Rep Breitling Skyland v2 through a member trade = no QC issues, almost 95% visual accuracy, perfect flawless 2xAR, good power reserve and accurate movement = 130 Euros. Wears and feels like any of my gens and more. Yeah, if you examine the dial with microscope you'll see the misplaced lume dots.

But no worries, throw in an extra 2500 Euros, take the gen route and they're fixed. But if you scratch your crystal and damage your AR, it's going to be 450 Euros.

I love my gens but reps have many advantages. In many ways I love my reps even more.

[Utheman]

What about the reps we trade among ourselves? What is the ratio of good (as described) versus bad (shall we just say "less than' described)?

I'm 3 for 3 on the good side in member buys.

For trusted dealer buys, I'm 5 for 7

Not too bad

Utheman

[Whatever123]

What about the reps we trade among ourselves? What is the ratio of good (as described) versus bad (shall we just say "less than' described)?

I bought 15 watches from members altogether. Only 4 of them were not quite as described and only 2 of those 4 had really big issues, the other 2 were an easy fix.

That's why I prefer buying from members.

By the way, it can happen to all of us: I shipped a watch to the US once and it was DOA even though it worked perfectly before. I couldn't even take it back because of the customs issue (I live in Germany). Not good... that's one of the reasons I prefer selling in EU only.

[gran]

Last months have been good for me regarding replicas

Just received Chopard GTXXL and PO Chrono 45mm from Josh yesterday

and both seem to be as good as can be so far...I am happy

Eralier I also bought an IWC Jones for my mother for Xmas from Josh also and before that a ROLEX and a Breitling for friends also from Joshua...

So far it seems the last 6 watches (about $1500 worth of watches) I have bought from Joshua had the QC we wish for

(However if I add all the replicas since 2004...I estimate based om my replicas that 20% had bad initial QC and 40% have had difficulties at one time or other since purchase...3 watches returned...most common problem was bad/faulty closing mechanisms on strap and unaccuracies/mistakes on dial...closely followed by missing/loose and poor screws....loose movement/dial..flaking plated gold....loose dispaly back window...Chonograph function ceased to work on Venus 175...had to change movement on one item...relume...+ 4 watches that have not been repaired yet)

[maxman]

Here's some facts to consider (just a few details about my watches):

New crystal for gen Breitling Steelfish Superocean: 280 Euros + 50 Euros to install

Complete service for gen Rolex GMT Master II 16710: 500 Euros

Rep Breitling Skyland v2 through a member trade = no QC issues, almost 95% visual accuracy, perfect flawless 2xAR, good power reserve and accurate movement = 130 Euros. Wears and feels like any of my gens and more. Yeah, if you examine the dial with microscope you'll see the misplaced lume dots.

But no worries, throw in an extra 2500 Euros, take the gen route and they're fixed. But if you scratch your crystal and damage your AR, it's going to be 450 Euros.

I love my gens but reps have many advantages. In many ways I love my reps even more.

Well coming from you By-Tor, thats saying something. I also feel the very same way

[automatico]

"New crystal for gen Breitling Steelfish Superocean: 280 Euros + 50 Euros to install

Complete service for gen Rolex GMT Master II 16710: 500 Euros.

Rep Breitling Skyland v2 through a member trade = no QC issues, almost 95% visual accuracy, perfect flawless 2xAR, good power reserve and accurate movement = 130 Euros. Wears and feels like any of my gens and more. Yeah, if you examine the dial with microscope you'll see the misplaced lume dots.

But no worries, throw in an extra 2500 Euros, take the gen route and they're fixed. But if you scratch your crystal and damage your AR, it's going to be 450 Euros.

I love my gens but reps have many advantages. In many ways I love my reps even more."

"Well coming from you By-Tor, thats saying something. I also feel the very same way."

Me too!

My two cents:

Comparison of one of my genuine rolex watches to a replica:

Genuine 16013 (cal 3035) between April 2008 and July 2008...broken balance staff replaced along with new mainspring, mvt cleaning, new case tube, crown, crystal, case gasket, and springbars (typical rolex tune-up). My cost was about $125. The same friendly 'authorized rolex repair' cost would probably have been around $1000 because authorized repair outfits do not (or can not) install a balance staff and poise a balance (they are parts changers), so I would have had to buy a 'balance complete' (p/n 5019) for $400+/-.

I keep a stash of genuine rolex parts to keep these things running as I still have a few genuine rolex watches.

Cost for spare parts about $10k (all from legit sources at dealer cost).

I admit to being a little bit rough on this one but you know what they say: "Your rolex will take anything your arm will take."

Sold the damn thing July 2008. Good riddance!

September 2009...it's back!

Another broken balance staff replaced and hairspring untangled. Rotor axle is getting wobbly. It looked 10 years older than when it left. The guy said it was the best rolex he ever had.

Imagine what the rest of them must have been like.

"Frankenstein" tutone rolex '16233' DJ with Eta 2836-2:

rep case, oem spec pink sapphire crystal, aftmkt case tube, genuine crown, 18k (genuine) 16234 fluted bezel, aft mkt steel and gold jubilee.

No parts needed to date.

Parts stash = nothing ($0) because I anticipate no trouble.

The replica has lived a harder life than the genuine watch. It will be on my arm today, working on a bathroom remodeling job.

[panerai153]

By-Tor and Automatico are absolutely correct. Over the years, I have had more genuine that reps. All in all the genuine watches have been pretty darn good right out the box, only had one recently that has had bezel problems and has been back to the manufacturer twice to sort out the sticky bezel and bezel lock mechanism. Both times it was repaired for free, but I was out postage and insurance X2. Where the genuine's get you is the service. And it's not just Rolex. I had a genuine Breitling SS/Gold Chronomat, every time it went back for service, they wanted to replace the crystal, pushers, bezel markers and strap, plus clean and adjust the movement. both times over 500 USD.After the warranty is up, every time you send one back, it's going to be gone for months and it's going to be pricey to fix.What I have concluded over the years is just because it's a genuine, it's not an automatic that it won't have problems, and when it does, the problems are expensive to fix.

My reps for the most part have been pretty good, although I had to send a DSSD back for multiple problems, but everything else has run, kept reasonably accurate time, and performed as expected. I do believe that if you have a rep that you like and intend to keep and use, it's a good investment to have it cleaned and oiled. As The Zigmeister and others have said repeatedly, a lot of these watches are never cleaned and oiled properly from the factory, and they get to us, dirty and dry. All I can say is my rep experience has been pretty positive. I don't baby any of them,they are treated just like my genuines. If it's a "Tool" watch rep, then I'm not going to treat it and different than it's genuine counterpart

[pollux1]

My personal experience has been pretty good so far, mind you I have tended to buy from Andrew mostly and josh once or twice. Most other purchases have been from forum members and the gentlemen I have bought from have been exemplary in their sales.

One thing of note, I bought a IWC from a dealer and if the same problem arose with a watch bought from Andrew/Josh it would have been fixed forthwith, not the "sorry you should have expected it" line.

Also of note is a Rolex I acquired for a dear friend who has since passed. the watch developed a fault 5 months after my friend received his watch and upon informing Andrew of said fault he advised the watch be returned, six weeks later the watch turned up working as good as new ( same watch as a few scrapes my late friend had acquired along the way were still there) So all in all I say choose your dealer wisely, learn all you can and be prepared for a few bumps. perhaps I've just been a bit lucky.

[brayen]

Before i found this forum, i bought two watches. An omega spm chrono from swissmirrorwatch, it was a mess, all hands, except chrono ones, fall on the dial of the watche the first day. I had to send it, with a tracking( obligation from them, cost 70$ in Canada). They repair it, send it back, watche was not working at all. Tryed to deal for a refund, got 1/3 of my money back and they send me to hell saying that i cost them money because they have to repair the first one. Than i found eurotimez, they send me the same model and it stop working after 2 weeks. They never answer to my many emails. Lost 300$ again. Than i found RWG, read, read read, and passed order with Trusty, Trusty send a lady's rolex, she keep time perfectly, and than i passed an order with him for a pam 111h. He stopped the first order because he told me he was not happy with the watch and after a week or a little more, he send me a more expensive model of the pam111h. I have it since a month, keep time perfectly, look very good, even under 10X. Very happy with this two watches from trusty. I also passed an order with Ajoe for a A7750, receive it and keep time so perfectly, used the chrono over 100 to see if it will broke, but no, still keep time even using chrono. Will pass next order with trusty and i cross my fingers.

[maxman]

Before i found this forum, i bought two watches. An omega spm chrono from swissmirrorwatch, it was a mess, all hands, except chrono ones, fall on the dial of the watche the first day. I had to send it, with a tracking( obligation from them, cost 70$ in Canada). They repair it, send it back, watche was not working at all. Tryed to deal for a refund, got 1/3 of my money back and they send me to hell saying that i cost them money because they have to repair the first one. Than i found eurotimez, they send me the same model and it stop working after 2 weeks. They never answer to my many emails. Lost 300$ again. Than i found RWG, read, read read, and passed order with Trusty, Trusty send a lady's rolex, she keep time perfectly, and than i passed an order with him for a pam 111h. He stopped the first order because he told me he was not happy with the watch and after a week or a little more, he send me a more expensive model of the pam111h. I have it since a month, keep time perfectly, look very good, even under 10X. Very happy with this two watches from trusty. I also passed an order with Ajoe for a A7750, receive it and keep time so perfectly, used the chrono over 100 to see if it will broke, but no, still keep time even using chrono. Will pass next order with trusty and i cross my fingers.

Most of us were ripped off before we found RWG. Im happy that your new purchases have been good ones. As they say "stick with the trusted dealers" Mike

[wisrep2010]

well since I recently got back into collecting replicas I have also seen that the quality compared to a couple of years back has decreased.

Since my rejoining of the replica community I have purchased 11 replicas

• Franck Muller Conquistador Black King Cortez
  
• Patek Philippe Aquanaut Jumbo V2 - Rubber Strap Version
  
• Patek Philippe Aquanaut Jumbo V2 - Bracelet Version
  
• Graham Chronofighter Diver Tech Seal
  
• Graham Chronofighter Commando
  
• Graham Chronofighter Diver SS
  
• Rolex Red Submariner
  
• Rolex Double Red Seadweller
  
• AP Survivor
  
• AP Rubens Barichello II TI
  
• IWC Top Gun V1
  

Only the 2 Rolexes, the IWC and one of the Graham's didn't have issues - the worst part is that the most expensive ones where also the worst. The issues where mostly QC related, such as misaligned hands, scratched case or bezel, bad movement, dirt under the crystal, glue residue under crystal etc

I have used a variety of sellers - drop shippers as well as the ones claiming they would inspect the watch before shipping - well they might have inspected it, but they still didn't spot the most obvious issues

I did expect some issues since a rep is just a rep, but for watches over $500 I would have expected at least some basic level of quality - not QC, that's a different story all together as we all know.

My conclusion is that I will stop buying for now until the I can resolve those issues with the sellers and my watchmaker respectively - If 70% of the issues can be resolved I will continue to buy - if not I will once again have to say goodbye to buying replicas.

cheers

WR

[billywhiz]

I think we all need to sit wider on the box here - It must be stated, well it was touched on earlier that these watches are being made in sub standard conditions by people earning a pitance - factorys being highly protected by people that you would not want to meet down a dark alley.

the pure fact that todays rep watches have got to the standard they are shows testement and respect to those that work so hard.

the very fact that for every 1 lost 'western' customer of reps there are a que of 100+ lining up ready to pay out the $$$ only pushes this market along including the price hikes> that fact will never go away.

As one of the more famous cartel dealers once said "buy a knock off watch from the internet and what can you expect"

I for one would certainly not like to be a dealer > they don't all ride around in ferraris and drink starbucks and coffee stations > what these guys are doing is extremly illegal - if and when caught can expect to be dealt with very nasty and would be lucky to remain with their balls in place... credit to them and for what they do for us in rep buying land

Fact is very simple > buy a rep, it's always going to be a rep, quality issues on par with a big fat 0 - buy a gen and you can run through the meadows singing sweet songs flicking your hair.

think of rep, think of franken > only way to go.

afternoon all