Passing reps as gens

[FxrAndy]

Spurred on by a couple of recent posts about people trying to pass reps as gens I thought I would recount a recent encounter I had.

I was in a hotel bar in an African country chatting with a fellow englishman who lives in Beijing but travels extensively and we were discussing the prices of things around the world and what you can get in different places, so I commented on his 'white dialed, auto, black date wheel, non AR, thin crown, silver subdial panerai. Now thinking he would say yep just like this watch he had bought in Beijing, and we could engage in a bit of rep conversation, but that was not the case he insisted that it was made in 1959 and a special edition worth a lot and no amount of polite hinting was going to Change his mind.

Now this guy has a very well paid job and could if he wanted to have any amount of gens or pull off any good rep as gen just by his status but insists on trying to bluff a total fantasy cheep rep as gen. The shame is that if he has been more open in admitting I would have directed him here so that he could learn a bit if he was interested.

[shirotenshi]

Well, maybe he was scammed, so he indeed do think it is a gen. Rich people dont usually do research before buying stuff, because its pocket money for them.

Either that or he just felt ashamed to admit its a rep.

Edited March 23, 2012 by ShiroTenshi

[FxrAndy]

That is always a possibility but as we were talking about the markets in china and around the world and the fact he shops in the markets in china he would have seen lots I reps being sold

[gran]

The shame is that if he has been more open in admitting I would have directed him here so that he could learn a bit if he was interested.

But then we would all be stuck with that fool

[gran]

because its pocket money for them.

Those kind of people dont stay rich

[Cats]

Yes but some are so rich that they can't get poor what ever they do ( money wise i mean )

Carpe Diem

Cats

[gran]

Yes but some are so rich that they can't get poor what ever they do ( money wise i mean )

Carpe Diem

Cats

Oooooooooh! So you ment the Filthy rich

[modelizer]

But then we would all be stuck with that fool

[freddy333]

Well, maybe he was scammed, so he indeed do think it is a gen. Rich people dont usually do research before buying stuff, because its pocket money for them.

Either that or he just felt ashamed to admit its a rep.

Ditto. Under similar circumstances, I might bring up the subject myself & explain that I have a collection of both reps & genuine watches & belong to an online group that celebrates the best of each. Then invite him to check rwg out & leave it at that.

[TeeJay]

I'm sure I heard about a story on TZ a year or so back where a guy had owned a particular sub for about ten years, totally believed it to be the real deal, but when he sent it away for servicing, they turned round and told him it was a rep. I always took this is a good example of how a person's perception of an item is all that changes, yet can dramatically alter their feelings about it, but equally, it's a good example of how someone genuinely might not know they were wearing a rep, so always saying it was gen

[cougar1]

Heard about that story too Teejay, I can imagine how feelings towards a previously loved watch would change in accordance to how much was overpaid, even if the rep is a good one.

Similar thing happened to my brother, he bought a 2nd hand breitling navitimer back in the mid nineties, he bought it through a newspaper ad and it came with boxes/cards and all the trimmings etc. It looked good to me, but then again at the time I had no idea what I was looking at, I was just getting into watches and starting to notice and admire the blue smp etc.

Anyway he loved that watch, wore it constantly for about 6 months showing everyone his pride and joy when it suddenly stopped in work one day. He took it to a watchsmith and within seconds of opening the caseback and heard it was a rep...but a good one, his face dropped like he had been stabbed in the heart!

I think it seriously put him off watches for life, not just reps but watches rep or gen. He wears a seiko diver these days and I doubt will ever pay over £200 for a watch again. I have tried to get him to get into reps or 2nd hand gens (through the proper channels ) but no way will he bother, it's not a hatred he has just a complete indifference now...strange!

Still that is a different scenario from a person knowingly wearing a rep but would not admit it even to someone who is cool with reps, ever for fear of losing face. I can only put it down to a personality trait maybe, just insecurity or deeply defensive about it becoming known to the outside world.

[Ronin]

My thoughts mirror what Freddy333 said above.

I walk that fine line from time to time. If I were wearing my Ronin-1680 that is ALL GEN except the Yuki mid-case, I would never confess it to be less than genuine (just like I would never say a car is less genuine because it had some aftermarket body panels, after an accident). I tend to lead the conversation with, "actually, I restored this watch, it is a hobby of mine", and see where it goes. Usually nowhere.

On the other hand, if I were wearing my DW/Spin/Ronin Daytona or PAM 029 (as good as it is), I would come clean about their replica origin-- if the vibe and person were right.

People who immediately jump up and confess their Rep actually freak me out sometimes. It is as if they are so conscience and thus self-conscience about it they try and take the-- "I'm frugal, ha ha ha, don't judge me, I'm the class clown" approach.

Finally, on the RARE occasion these situations actually come up, I try and drop subtle hints. "Are you into watches, are you on ANY watch forums, Have you heard of the H/Noob/WM9-Factory?". To date, nobody has responded to those hints, and instead got the deer in the headlight expression. If they don't respond/know, I am not going to confess, and instead change the subject.

YMMV

[gran]

its a dilemma. I better not think about it at all

[ExtraExtra]

But then we would all be stuck with that fool

LOL. You're too much!

[ExtraExtra]

Spurred on by a couple of recent posts about people trying to pass reps as gens I thought I would recount a recent encounter I had.

I was in a hotel bar in an African country chatting with a fellow englishman who lives in Beijing but travels extensively and we were discussing the prices of things around the world and what you can get in different places, so I commented on his 'white dialed, auto, black date wheel, non AR, thin crown, silver subdial panerai. Now thinking he would say yep just like this watch he had bought in Beijing, and we could engage in a bit of rep conversation, but that was not the case he insisted that it was made in 1959 and a special edition worth a lot and no amount of polite hinting was going to Change his mind.

Now this guy has a very well paid job and could if he wanted to have any amount of gens or pull off any good rep as gen just by his status but insists on trying to bluff a total fantasy cheep rep as gen. The shame is that if he has been more open in admitting I would have directed him here so that he could learn a bit if he was interested.

I would double check if he is truly an englishman and living in beijing....

[Roley1]

As a noob, what I HAVE noticed from folk's is that when I wore my gen Explorer, people would (once in a while) comment on it but usually it never came up. Having sold that and then just was biding my time, I wore a regular 'ol dept. store watch (Fossil). It was nice, don't get me wrong, but I doubt I ever had one single person ever glance at it one single time. Now that I am wearing my first rep (Sub), I have noticed folks giving it a glance or 2 but no one yet (in the last month) has said anything. As far as the "filthy rich", it's been my limited experience (I have a few as clients) that they ALWAYS pay someone to do ALL their shopping! no kidding,... I'm talking about having someone go out and not only buy your toilet paper but also your jewelry. These are people that probably would never be in the same place as you and I on any given day. Unless you are one of the lucky one's to be travel'n the globe in their private yachts, jets, and staying in 50K per night hotel rooms..... However, I BET you the $20 I have in my pants pocket that more than a few are riding those yachts, jets, and red carpets into their hotels, with a very nice rep on their wrists that their "assistant" picked up from the "dealer".... and they do not have the slightest clue that their helper has pocketed the difference! Yes, another true story from the mouth of one of my clients. Wore a Car. Astrore' that, come to find out, was a rep. However, a damn fine one at that... never found out out where it was purchased from though as the helper had been long gone by then. I guess if I am ever asked if mine is a rep, I'd reply with "Why yes,... it 'REPresents' that I have good taste!"

[TeeJay]

Heard about that story too Teejay, I can imagine how feelings towards a previously loved watch would change in accordance to how much was overpaid, even if the rep is a good one.

Similar thing happened to my brother, he bought a 2nd hand breitling navitimer back in the mid nineties, he bought it through a newspaper ad and it came with boxes/cards and all the trimmings etc. It looked good to me, but then again at the time I had no idea what I was looking at, I was just getting into watches and starting to notice and admire the blue smp etc.

Anyway he loved that watch, wore it constantly for about 6 months showing everyone his pride and joy when it suddenly stopped in work one day. He took it to a watchsmith and within seconds of opening the caseback and heard it was a rep...but a good one, his face dropped like he had been stabbed in the heart!

I think it seriously put him off watches for life, not just reps but watches rep or gen. He wears a seiko diver these days and I doubt will ever pay over £200 for a watch again. I have tried to get him to get into reps or 2nd hand gens (through the proper channels ) but no way will he bother, it's not a hatred he has just a complete indifference now...strange!

Still that is a different scenario from a person knowingly wearing a rep but would not admit it even to someone who is cool with reps, ever for fear of losing face. I can only put it down to a personality trait maybe, just insecurity or deeply defensive about it becoming known to the outside world.

Sorry to hear about your brother getting stung like that, I can understand why it's soured him to watches, and indeed, quite a difference wearing a rep and knowing that it is, rather than thinking something is the real thing, and then being told it's not, shame on those who sells reps as gen...

My thoughts mirror what Freddy333 said above.

I walk that fine line from time to time. If I were wearing my Ronin-1680 that is ALL GEN except the Yuki mid-case, I would never confess it to be less than genuine (just like I would never say a car is less genuine because it had some aftermarket body panels, after an accident). I tend to lead the conversation with, "actually, I restored this watch, it is a hobby of mine", and see where it goes. Usually nowhere.

On the other hand, if I were wearing my DW/Spin/Ronin Daytona or PAM 029 (as good as it is), I would come clean about their replica origin-- if the vibe and person were right.

People who immediately jump up and confess their Rep actually freak me out sometimes. It is as if they are so conscience and thus self-conscience about it they try and take the-- "I'm frugal, ha ha ha, don't judge me, I'm the class clown" approach.

Finally, on the RARE occasion these situations actually come up, I try and drop subtle hints. "Are you into watches, are you on ANY watch forums, Have you heard of the H/Noob/WM9-Factory?". To date, nobody has responded to those hints, and instead got the deer in the headlight expression. If they don't respond/know, I am not going to confess, and instead change the subject.

YMMV

Oh for sure, I wouldn't spew "It's a fake, I'm a cheapass!!!" if someone was to simply mention the watch, they would have to actually ask the question to be told that

[mrboombasteke]

I've NEVER been asked if any of the watches I own is a rep or gen. It's usually just a "nice watch, what is it? Can I see?"

I do however have a colleague that has really bad Chinese reps and today showed me his Explorer II and bragged about how he only paid $35 for it.

[TeeJay]

I've NEVER been asked if any of the watches I own is a rep or gen. It's usually just a "nice watch, what is it? Can I see?"

I do however have a colleague that has really bad Chinese reps and today showed me his Explorer II and bragged about how he only paid $35 for it.

That's cheaper than what I buy

[Watchmeister]

It may put a crimp in rep collecting but it always comes back. Most of our dealers don't even live in China so they can source elsewhere. I am sure at some level they are tired of being the factories butt boys anyhow. Making $30 on a $400 watch has got to be frustrating. I also always have faith in free enterprise. The large sophisticated factories who make money know who to take care of. I will bet money the big 3-4 factories won't be touched. China needs the jobs. And if China really cuts off its nose to spite it's own face say hello to Vietnam best.

[captain swoop]

erm wrong thread?

[cougar1]

Sorry to hear about your brother getting stung like that, I can understand why it's soured him to watches, and indeed, quite a difference wearing a rep and knowing that it is, rather than thinking something is the real thing, and then being told it's not, shame on those who sells reps as gen...

Yeah it was a long time ago, and he was a bit green then so even though he was crushed at the time, and for a while after, he has long got over it. He is just kind of 'meh' about watches in general for years now, show him a rep and it's 'meh', show him a photo of a gen Lange datograph and it just 'meh' ....can't satisfy some people The strange thing is he was the one who really got me to notice watches before that when I was in my teens, he would show a pic of a rolex explorer in a magazine or the newly released smp at the time and say "what do ya think?". Just lost total interest I guess. He's into his cameras in a big way though!

Oh for sure, I wouldn't spew "It's a fake, I'm a cheapass!!!" if someone was to simply mention the watch, they would have to actually ask the question to be told that

On a side note, like above I think in general, forumites are pretty good and clued in when it comes to rep etiquette. It's highly unlikely someone from the forums who has any clue would go about shoving the watch in peoples faces broadcasting its a rep, usually that sort of behaviour is reserved for those who buy £20 quid reps while on holiday in Turkey or Morocco. Usually if someone asks about the watch it's very easy to ascertain from their enthusiasm or (lack of it) whether the are into watches or just asking 'fake or not?' It's usually then up to the rep owner how (far) they want to continue with the discussion. Ronin's answer of "actually, I restored/customised this watch, it is a hobby of mine" regarding frankens is an excellent gauge of the questioners interest...i must use that one sometime

It's a pity more people aren't into watches, 99 times out of a 100 nobody bothers asking anything, except for the other half going "that's not another bloody watch is it?"

[Nanuq]

I try and drop subtle hints. "Are you into watches, are you on ANY watch forums, Have you heard of the H/Noob/WM9-Factory?". To date, nobody has responded to those hints, and instead got the deer in the headlight expression.

There's a simple alternative: just mention "Jetmid" and see if they crack a smile.

[rwgforumfan]

The shame is that if he has been more open in admitting I would have directed him here so that he could learn a bit if he was interested.

What's the first rule of the Fight Club? I bet he's a regular here.

[TeeJay]

Yeah it was a long time ago, and he was a bit green then so even though he was crushed at the time, and for a while after, he has long got over it. He is just kind of 'meh' about watches in general for years now, show him a rep and it's 'meh', show him a photo of a gen Lange datograph and it just 'meh' ....can't satisfy some people The strange thing is he was the one who really got me to notice watches before that when I was in my teens, he would show a pic of a rolex explorer in a magazine or the newly released smp at the time and say "what do ya think?". Just lost total interest I guess. He's into his cameras in a big way though!

That's a shame the experience totally turned him off watches, you never know, he may regain his interest in the future

On a side note, like above I think in general, forumites are pretty good and clued in when it comes to rep etiquette. It's highly unlikely someone from the forums who has any clue would go about shoving the watch in peoples faces broadcasting its a rep, usually that sort of behaviour is reserved for those who buy £20 quid reps while on holiday in Turkey or Morocco. Usually if someone asks about the watch it's very easy to ascertain from their enthusiasm or (lack of it) whether the are into watches or just asking 'fake or not?' It's usually then up to the rep owner how (far) they want to continue with the discussion. Ronin's answer of "actually, I restored/customised this watch, it is a hobby of mine" regarding frankens is an excellent gauge of the questioners interest...i must use that one sometime

It's a pity more people aren't into watches, 99 times out of a 100 nobody bothers asking anything, except for the other half going "that's not another bloody watch is it?"

I've had more conversations about project watches in general, rather than the "Is that real?" question I've found that people're a bit more interested in projects, even if they're not really into watches, than just noticing them I think in general, most 'non-watch folks' simply don't care