predfan2001 Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 (edited) I really only like Rolex and Omega reps and here's my luck so far: 1. Omega 4th gen PO (Had a chip inside the crystal and a big scratch on the bezel upon arrival-seller let me exchange it) 2. Rolex 1655 with asian movement (quit after 2 days, I said screw it and kept it to practice mods and disassembly on) 3 & 4. Omega GMT with asian movement (I have 2 of these now, 1 with a Speedy band and 1 with a SMP band. No problems so far with either one) 5. Ultimate Rolex Submariner (very nice and very reliable but the rehaut is a little conical) 6. Rolex Submariner 14060 nodate (the watch I received was nothing like the one pictured on the site-it's just a nodate dial in a modern case with no lugholes. I'm returning it) 7. Omega Ultimate PO (my favorite-no problems at all. Great time piece) 8. Rolex 1655 with ETA (DOA-stem stays in time set mode all the time, no detents. Can't wind or set date-it's going back) I'm still waiting on a 5517 and a 5513 to come in, keeping my fingers crossed. I would like to add that even though I have had more than my share of product problems, I have had no problems with my sellers. I primarily buy from 2 sellers (trustytime and brand9ave) and they have both bent over backwards to help me when there is a problem. Andrew is so nice, I hate to have to tell him if there is a problem. Edited July 6, 2007 by predfan2001 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deltatahoe Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 sounds like you haven't had much luck at all...on the whole i've been pretty fortunate; i've had a problem here or there, but my dealer has always made things right.... deltatahoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victoria Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Since starting 3 weeks ago: 1- Patek Phillippe Sky Moon Tourbillon (Paul): Flawless and gorgeous. Does not have a lot of power reserve, but a good shake every night keeps it running. Arrived in 7 full days from placing order. 2- Gucci Twirl (Andrew): Impeccable. Arrived in 4 working days. 3- Rolex Daytona/Audemars Piguet Royal Oak Chrono (Jay @ watchsilix not silix-prime): AP RO arrived with broken bracelet. Daytona doesn't keep time very well, though it's a Quartz. The bracelet also had some problems, which I however, was able to fix myself. Arrived in 10 full days. He said he would send a replacement bracelet for the AP RO this Monday. On hold. 4- Vacheron Constantin 31-day Retrograding Calender (Joshua): Problem with first order, which wasn't caught until 3 days after being given the EMS. This was a substitute, at $10 more which he graciously comped. Arrived without the right strap. Strap on its way, but I placed a Cartier Tankissime watch order to sweeten the sourness for him. The watch itself is gorgeous and runs like a charm. Took 3 weeks to arrive... 5- Fantasy Mini-Fiddy PAM (Paul): See massive thread in the Panerai area. Not a horror story, but not good either. Paul hasn't at the time of writing said if he'll address the problem. I have good hopes he will. Took 2 weeks to arrive... 6- Vacheron Constantin Rose Gold Moon phase watch and Mont Blanc Pen (Paul): Arrived in a record-breaking 3 days after he confirmed EMS tracking #. Package locked in the porter's area of my condo overnight, so can't verify until Friday. Ack! Still to come: Pam 111h (Andrew), 2 weeks; Cartier Tankissime (Joshua), ordered Monday; about to order, Omega SP007 (Andrew). That's 50% so far of the ones I received and have vetted which presented some kind of problem, both serious and fixable. Shipping seems to be a luck of the draw. It's not encouraging, but as long as you know what to expect once you've received your first order, it's worth doing, IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMK000 Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 After 4-5 years of reps ...with more than 20 reps..... had an average of 30% problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregers Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 One with no problems, one with an easily rectified problem and 5 with a multitude of problems. The dealer tries to help but it is time consuming, expensive and often extremely, frustratingly unsatisfactory to have to go to these lengths to get something that actually works. Any other commercial activity-including plenty of illegal ones- would soon be out of business if they operated with this business model. Maybe the rep game is, to borrow a phrase, the triumph of hope over experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pix Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Just about the reps I kept (. I started last december, so within these monthes I actually have "only" one issue, which is not major (yet) : my favorite VC Overseas has problems winding manually (the rotor spins at the same time, which should not be the case). Actually I had worries since the beginning, it did not run the first 2 days. After wearing it these 2 days, it started "ticking" :-) Then always kept good time and winds flawlessly on my watchwinder. Watch is from Sashwatch. Recently it stopped working without reason again, but finally resumed beating. It's an ETA 2834-2, so supposed to be more reliable. See, there's no rule... Now the VC is by a (former) watchsmith buddy, and there are some minor parts to be replaced. That won't cost a lot, then I think I'm just lucky with reps. Oh, maybe I forgot to mention : no Asian 7750 in the whole collection (please don't flame me !) Only 2 Swiss ETAs, 3 handwinding movements (these show to be reliable always), 2 automatic "standard Asian 21J" and 1 quartz (which I NEVER hesitate to recommend). You can see the details in the "complete collection" link in my signature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 After 4-5 years of reps ...with more than 20 reps..... had an average of 30% problems. That's just about right if you include all problems including owner/operator easily rectified problems. QC in reps is abysmal and follows an almost linear association with complexity. Simple reps with reliable Swiss movements are the most problem free....complex reps (HBB???????) with unreliable movements (A7750) are the least reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddhead Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 That's just about right if you include all problems including owner/operator easily rectified problems. QC in reps is abysmal and follows an almost linear association with complexity. Simple reps with reliable Swiss movements are the most problem free....complex reps (HBB???????) with unreliable movements (A7750) are the least reliable. I have pretty much followed that rule as a guiding principle.. i.e. simple Swiss ETA movements and as a result have done pretty well. I am not sure if you consider a GMT function to fall into that category.. i have two of those... one is an ETA 2892 from EL and it runs another is asian powered and it is not doing very well. I also have an asian powered noobmariner it runs very well. So as a guidling principle, my experence would dicatate keeping it to simple ETA powered movements (1st) and if possible, avoid dropshipping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMK000 Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 QC in reps is abysmal and follows an almost linear association with complexity. Simple reps with reliable Swiss movements are the most problem free....complex reps (HBB???????) with unreliable movements (A7750) are the least reliable. Damn right That's why ..... I am not even thinking yet to get the choppard 1000 miglia GMT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victoria Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Maybe the rep game is, to borrow a phrase, the triumph of hope over experience. Excellent reasoning. Also, most of the illegal activity in this world you alluded to, whether prostitution, gun-running or drugs dealing has a decidedly violent undertone. We just love expensive watches. It seems to me that though we could theoretically get into trouble with the law, Customs, etc. MOST of us rarely do (touch wood), and it's the dealers in fact, whose lives might be in greater danger than ours. Tangentially, maybe this is the reason why they don't produce 1:1 copies that are at least cosmetically perfect. A bad font here, a missing numeral there, etc. It just can't be the rush to get out the product to be able to make $$. I have a suspicion part of it is not to fly too close to the sun, as they might get their wings singed -- in other words, these companies would really crack down on them if their copies were too perfect, possibly in ways we cannot imagine in the West... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victoria Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 After 4-5 years of reps ...with more than 20 reps..... had an average of 30% problems. I'm well on my way to 20, in one month. But you know, that means nothing because I bet you most people in this forum prefer quality over quantity, and my stupid little $150 watches will fail, had I just saved to buy one with Swiss ETA for $350. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pix Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Don't agree Price is not synonym for quality in our world, we have many examples. Reliability is obviously in directl link with the movement used, and as mentionned before, the simpler, the more reliable. And you can buy an Asian 7750 clone for 700 dollars, it's "still" a 7750... My Montblanc Timewalker cost me 150 bucks...it has an ETA 2836-2 inside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobs1971 Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 (Edited. Keyboard was running out on me.. ) So far I've been pretty lucky. My experiences: 0. Bought my first rep at Patpong in Bangkok: a Chinese quartz Tag Heuer Monaco. When I got out of the plane all the chrono pusher appeared to be missing in action... Then I found this forum and my life changed completly... 1. Link Chrono (A7750b): arrived in good condition. I wasn't too happy with the grinding rotor sound and put a tiny bit of greese on the rotor screw. Has been running perfect and quiet since...Too bad I messed up the keyless work last week by changing the date in the evening . 2. SMP (Swiss): apart from the hard to remove bracelet screws (understatement of the year) the watch arrived in healthy condition. The wave pattern of the dial was not strong enough for my tast, so I swapped it for a gen dial together with the hands. In the process I damaged the keyless works and I also needed to change the movement. 3. PAM111h (Swiss): arrived in good condition and is still going strong. 4. PAM212 (A7750b): arrived in good condition. Didn't get wrist time, so it has been sold after 2 months. 5. Carrera Black SS (A7750b): arrived in good condition. Didn't get wrist time, so this one also have been sold. 6. PAM089 (A7750b): on arrival the strap screw was a bit stripped, but not too much to worry about. All were bought from PT. He really does a good job in QC. With the Carrera he canceled the initial shipping to my address because of a quality issue and I received a new one after a few days. That's what I call QC! I also bought a gen automatic chrono (ETA 2894-based) that suddenly died already in the first month. After 6 weeks it got back from the factory and is running perfect since. All in all not a bad score for the reps considering that even a gen died within a month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
export Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 I bought 5 in the last 2 months. A quartz PO, no problems looks very nice. A asian auto omega co axial on a leather strap that I aged and looks good no problems. The last three I bought on CQout for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWATCH Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 I guess I'm pretty lucky. After about two years I have Rolex: Datejust TT, Colamariner (I have my reasons), Perfect Sub from Josh, 5517, GMTII, TT Daytona secs @ 9, SS Daytona secs @ 6, Cellini quartz. Panerai: Regatta, 104, 202/A (Davidsen), Omega: PO, Speedmaster (manual), Seamaster Pro, Constellation. A Patek Calatrava manual, Tag SLR quartz, Breitling SuperOcean, Vacheron Constantin quartz, and a B&R BR01-92. The only problems were with the Daytonas. The TT secs @ 9 was originally shipped as a SS, was replaced with correct watch by dealer, crown fell out during regular (non-strenuous) wear after about a year, dealer never replied to emails about how to repair, The Zigmeister replaced crown and tube with gen. Daytona secs @ 6 sent with black leather strap when ordered with brown leather, even after emailing a picture of the rep to the dealer. He said he would try to get the correct strap, but apparantly he didn't try hard enough, as I never got the right strap. Found one on the 'bay. I don't buy watches from him anymore. It keeps good time, chronos work great, but can't wind it manually. Roror spins, but no wind. Impossible to set the time correctly, when I want to set it, I wait until my atomic clock displays the time on the Daytona, then I shake the crap out of it. Seems to work. Contacted the dealer since it was NG out of the box and (same dealer as the secs @ 9) he said it was OK. NOT. Could be a lot worse. I 'spect I'll send it off to The Zigmeister for a look-see after his long awaited and much deserved break. So all in all, I can't complain. They all keep good time so far and not too many things have fallen off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomRiddle Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 :X I feel like I'm livin on beginner's luck.. I'm 2 for 2 right now I just got a Rolex YM (TWP) as a belated father's day gift and it looks spot on.. my dad loves it and frankly I'm surprised because I wasn't really considering a YM but well for the 'cheap' price I gave it no afterthought really. but yea, so far UPO - Andrew and YM - TWP and both came out fabulous.. I think mostly go with good reputable dealers and more often than not, their products will come thru.. the real test for me will come when I get a dud and then I want to see how the dealers respond to it ^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Problems... The only problem I've had with my Submariner, were a piece of lume coming loose (I think I can identify the impact to my wrist which may have done this) and the pearl getting knocked out... My 42mm Planet Ocean had a problem where the threads in the crown stripped after about a months wear (I understand this was a common flaw of the Planet Oceans) The dealer had the watch repaired, so I had to pay for it to be shipped to him, but not for the return shipping. Other than that, the only other watch I've had a serious 'out of the box' problem with, is my X-33 from Silix. We are still emailing back and forth about precicely what will be done, and who will be accepting the charge. Personally, all I want is a replacement movement and case back, (which are the only flaws with the watch) but I don't see why I should pay shipping on those, because the watch could not have been properly QCd, or the flaws would have been immediately noticeable. The various watches I have which are dead, are dead solely because of my inept tinkering with the timing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Tracy Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 I have owned over 150,... and my stats are over 90%,... Maybe it's just luck, but I feel it's the laws of attraction,... One thing I know is that I am getting better as time goes by,.. Another, is that I don't judge a movement by it's origin,...or QC by it's 'collector' or price Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 (edited) I ordered the BCE 3 times (different dealers)... all were crap. Movement problems, dial problems (paint), clasp problems etc.... CRAP all CRAP. No more reps for me in the near future... I'm saving money for a gen Breitling Skyracer! Edited July 7, 2007 by Rolexman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victoria Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 2. SMP (Swiss): apart from the hard to remove bracelet screws (understatement of the year) Oh no! I just bought one for my father. The Rolex screws are very simple. What do you recommend I get ahead of time with this? Or just take it to the watchmaker and save the bother? 4. PAM212 (A7750b): arrived in good condition. Didn't get wrist time, so it has been sold after 2 months. Maybe I'm too new to the hobby, or it's just not my personality, but I can't imagine selling any of my longed-for rep "babies". Not even if they go to waste getting no wrist time whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kollektor Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Oh no! I just bought one for my father. The Rolex screws are very simple. What do you recommend I get ahead of time with this? Or just take it to the watchmaker and save the bother? Maybe I'm too new to the hobby, or it's just not my personality, but I can't imagine selling any of my longed-for rep "babies". Not even if they go to waste getting no wrist time whatsoever. For this particular model I'd say go to your local non AD jeweler. It was NOT easy removing those pins; I broke 3 different (Indian) tools trying. Fortunately, I fixed the tools and adjusted the bracelet but there was elbow grease involved... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobs1971 Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Oh no! I just bought one for my father. The Rolex screws are very simple. What do you recommend I get ahead of time with this? Or just take it to the watchmaker and save the bother? I've heard a lot of stories on the board that back up my experience. The latest SMP's have very difficult to remove screws. They strip very easy when trying to unscrew and most of the time they don't come off at all. Very hard to resize..... In the end I used brutal force to break one link off the bracelet. Luckely the other links were not affected and now the bracelet is a perfect fit for my wrist. Maybe I'm too new to the hobby, or it's just not my personality, but I can't imagine selling any of my longed-for rep "babies". Not even if they go to waste getting no wrist time whatsoever. My personality is sometimes rather impulsive... The actual watches appeared to be not that good looking on my wrist as I thought when ordering. Fortunately for my wallet I learned to do a little more research before buying now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corgi Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 I have recieved just one watch DOA in my collection of about 15. Strangely, it was a Swiss ETA 2871-2.. Most of my watches have something I call RPs - or Rep Quirks, odd little doo-dads that shouldn't be. For example, -My Pam Luminor Power Reserve has dust underneath the crystal. It can barely be seen, though. -My Turn-O-Graph has a small blemish inside the face that can only be seen under the correct light. -My Sky-Moon Tourbillion has lots of mis-cut numerals that have little bruises on them. (I suggest observing yours under a magnifying class - none of these are every 'flawless') -My first rep, a day-date full gold prez, has some gunk on the 6:00 hour marker. On my Breitling Navitimer the whole face of the watch was attached ever so slightly crooked to the right, so if you scrutinize it for a long while you'll notice the subdial hands don't quite perfectly line up where they should.. The only flawless watches I have that are absolutely, perfectly trouble free: Omega SMP Chronometer. Vacheron Constantin 1755 Jubilee Omega GMT 2nd Ed. Omega Two-Tone Deville (this one from narikaa... superb watch by the way, get them while their hot he still has two left I believe) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raijor Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 I have had two so called "Swiss movements" in two Datejusts go tilt on me after a few months and 1 of the notorious 7750's in a Daytona die a quick death. These were new watches. I have an Asian slow beat still running in a $100 Datejust and it has been trouble free for 2 months. I guess a 30% failure rate in the rep world would fall into the accepted normal range. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b16a2 Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 I am one of the lucky ones, I have had 100% success with mine so far. One of them is a year old Navitimer, dial layout at 3 6 9, and no service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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