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Ok my guy has come back to the table and all is sorted. Now I'm going to have a chat to Aston and see if I can't help a little. Ken

So here it is guys. I never thought there would be so much interest in this review. My post on the announcement of this review led to a lot of views and replies. That was very cool and flattering. I hope I can now live up to all the high expectations! First off I would like to thank Angus from Puretime for sending me this movement to review. He is one of the few dealers that is really engaged with all the different fora. As a matter of fact he sent me an entire watch. To my best of knowledge this specific 3135 (short A3135-v2) copy variant is only available at Puretime. I will do a short review of the entire watch when I put it up for sale and will ad a link here. But for now I will concentrate on sèc the movement. So enough with this colloq advertisement, on to the review To manage some expectations I would like to say that I did not have a genuine 3135 at hand to do a thorough 1-on-1 comparison nor did I have spare Rolex parts laying around. I’m blessed with a supplier that lives 10 car minutes away so I don’t need to keep an expensive stock of genuine spare parts. I serviced several gen 3135’s so my comments will be based on my experience. I will also use pictures of the genuine movement of the net to clarify certain things. This review is not an exact science meaning there is a possibility I will overlook certain aspects of the movement: mechanical and visual. Please feel free to ad them in the comments below. I pondered a while about the best way to do this review. I know 10:10 watchmaker did a tear-down of the Yuki 3135 (short Y3135) and I know Watcher did a short photo review of it. With their courtesy I will be using some pictures from them in this review. In my opinion this review would be the best of use if I would compare the A3135 to the Y3135 and the genuine 3135. A big challenge to do so. I will review the A3135 on a couple of aspects, and where possible I will involve the Y3135 and genuine 3135. I’m just making this up while I'm writing this …. Index 1. Looks 2. Performance 3. Interchangeability 4.Summary Looks Comparing the Y335 and A3135 to the genuine we can see a lot of visual differences. I tried to highlight the main differences in the picture. I very well could have missed some but it gives you a good Idea. Overall I would say the A3135 wins the ‘looks-competition’ hands down. Mainly because of the very gen-like engravements. Also the finish is way better than that of the Y3135. The bridges are nicely beveled, striping is nice and fine and the pearlage is ok. The balance apposed to the Y3135 has fake micro stella screws that ad to the overall gen-like appearance. More on that later. Both Y’s and A’s 3135 most noticeable difference with the genuine (apart from the engravements) is the balance. It’s not free sprung and therefore has two regulating arms instead of one. The winner of the looks competition: the A3135. One thing I did notice is that the serial# is missing. Angus posted a picture of an earlier prototype which did show the serial. I don’t know if the factory changed it’s mind or someone forgot to engrave it on this movement? Performance Well upon receiving the A3135 I tested it on the vibrograph. It showed very poor results as you can see on the picture below. With an amplitude of just 188 degees and +32 sec/fast a day this watch is not wearable in this condition. You are better off looking at the sun to know the correct time…. So the tear down begins. Know that all pictures were taken under a bright light.. which even would make Paris Hilton look like a pimple face . First we need to remove the auto wind-bridge to let down the main spring. The thing I noticed immediately is not only a visual difference to the genuine but also a difference in design. The A3135 does not have an extra shock absorber for the escape wheel. Something the Y3135 does have. A very nice feature which ads to the sturdiness of the movement. Also there was no oil on the jewel where auto winding intermediate gear is connected. A very critical spot as all the build up tension that is generated by the rotor is transferred to the main spring through that jewel. All rep movements come this way so nothing new.... Than for the balance. It is nowhere near the real deal when it comes to design and materials. A gen Rolex balance is free sprung. Hence the 1 arm. I won't go into details as this write up is already taking up enough of my time and energie but you can look it up on Google. Also the genuine Rolex balance has a Glucydur hair spring and Micro Stella regulating screws. This is just your typical rep balance with imitated non-functioning Micostella screws. Thereby this balance had coils that were out of alignment. You can see how the space between the coils at 1 is smaller than at 2. This was corrected so that all the coils are now evenly centered. Little blurry but you can see the difference. Also you can see how rough and unfinished the underside of the bridge is. But who cares. It does not affect anything. Here you can see the barrel arbour jewel. The spot where the most tension is generated in the entire movement. Also bone dry… Here you can see the train gear exposed. Also the Balance bridge regulator screws can be seen very clearly. Where the genuine balance bridge can be regulated by turning these screws (end shake adjustment) these are merely for show and non functional. They are one piece and force fitted into the base plate. They did oil the jewels of the train gear, up and down side. Most of the time when we see oil in rep movements these are the spots that get oiled. The reason for this is because they are easy accessible and quick to oil. Here you can see a dirty gear from the gear train.. So now let’s have a look at the dial side. Here we immediately see some major differences with the genuine. Not only in looks but also in function. I won’t go into the visual differences as they are irrelevant on this side of the movement and you can search for them yourself. I do however want to mention the small jewel that is meant to guide the date wheel. It is present on the Y3135 but on the A3135 they used a metal version. We all know jewels minimize friction so a jewel is preferred. However I could not determine whether it really affects date-change reliability as everything works like it should. Than there is the keyless works. Where the Y3135 mimics the keyless works very good the A3135 is totally different. Not only in looks but also design. I have no idea why they did this. So forget spare parts. Genuine Rolex parts will definitely not fit. Here you can see the dirty keyless works. The cut outs on the setting lever are really shallow (arrow). This makes it a little finicky to get the crown in date-set position as one easily pulls through the date position. You need to be really gentle, like with your girlfriend….does not affect anything other than you have to use some more 'finesse' when searching for the date set position. When I came to the main spring I immediately knew what caused the low amplitude and bad performance. Besides little oil throughout the movement the barrel and main spring were very dirty…. And this is how it looks after cleaning, the proper amount of braking grease on the barrel wall and oil on coils and floor. But proper oiling is for another day… To conclude I want to show you some pics of the reversing wheels. They are constructed completely different than the genuines. They can not be taken apart. The reversing wheels of the Y3135 are just like the genuine. At least in terms of construction. I can’t say anything about dimensions off course. Interchangeability Like I said before. I didn't have a genuine movement or parts laying around and I did not have the time or energy to go look up all the genuine dimensions. Therefor I will give you the dimensions of some critical parts of the A3135 and I will let you do you own investigation. What I do know a 100% sure is that the keyless works of the A3135 is not interchangeable with the genuine. Diameter balance wheel= 9,99mm Diameter date wheel= 21,75mm Height main spring= 0,95mm Diameter minute wheel= 1,02mm Diameter hour wheel= 1,45mm Diameter second hand post= 0,20mm Diameter reversing wheel= 7,00mm Diameter reversing wheel jewel hole= 0,25mm Overall movement diameter= 28,4mm Overall movement thickness (without rotor) 5,4mm Here is also a scan of the dial feet position. You can use it in your own build to decide if a genuine dial will fit. IMO the feet are at the right position. The thickness of the dial feet is 0,92mm (-actual size- with the dial feet circled in red) The stem’s thickness is indeed increased just like Angus mentioned to 0.55mm. Screw thread is 0,85mm Summary The A3135 mimics the Rolex 3135 very well but when it comes to construction and design the Y3135 wins. This is purely based on the fact that the Y3135 copied all the design features like the keyless, date wheel guiding jewel, escape wheel shock absorber perfectly. If it is looks you want than the A3135 wins. Both the Y3135 an A3135 have several tell signs but the A3135 just looks the most accurate. Off course mainly based on the nice engravements and overall finishing of the bridges. But neither will fool a watchmaker for a second off course. Most movements assembled in China are incorrectly oiled and dirty. For the A3135 his is no different. After service it can be as reliable as an ETA or clone. The Y3135 for that matter is designed almost identical to it's genuine counterpart so I believe that if serviced correctly the Y3135 can even be as reliable and sturdy as a genuine 3135 ...but now I'm getting out on a limb. So basically both movements have the potential to be reliable when serviced even though it asks a lot of skill and time from the watch maker to correct all the problems.... If I would service these for a living I would definitely charge more for these 3135 clones than a regular ETA oR clone. The 3135 clones are simply more sensitive to oiling and proper adjustment of parts to get it performing up to par. The A3135 from this review was fully cleaned and oiled according to the Rolex spec sheet. It is now running at an amplitude of 275 degrees and within COCS norms. This is the best this movement can do without replacing the main spring with a genuine. So why buy the A3135? For me the only advantage of the A and Y3135 for that matter is the crown position, ability to take genuine hands and genuine like 'time setting'. As Rolex has closed case backs no one will ever see the movement. And although the A3135 is accurately decorated and better finished, it still doesn’t fool anybody. So if looks don’t count and only mechanics and movement design matters the Y3135 would be a better choice….If you don’t care about crown position, gen hands and all that stuff just go for an ETA or clone. They are a lot cheaper, parts are widely available and they are virtually bullet proof after proper service. Food for thought The balance click on the A3135 was milled wrong making it impossible to tighten the screw. A washer needed to be added. The exact same thing applied to the Y3135 as did 10:10 repair mention in his review. Two different movements with the exact same strange production flaw…. Different movements same sub contractors? Who knows? Well that was all folks. Hope you liked it! Mark ------------------------ Performance shot after service. Running and performing flawlessly like a gen

1665 for 11413

I'll carry the Tudor flag

First as I said previously even Scalia states that assault weapons are NOT included in these 2nd amendment rights. So explain to me how regulations on these dangerous and quite frankly unnecessary weapons has anything to do with "taking away rights"? You assume pre-exiting free for all approach to what is considered "an individual right to possess and carry firearms". Try buy a surface-to-air missile, a rocket launcher or a tank to see how today you don't have unlimited rights to own any kind of weapon you want. Second, as with anything related to the US Bill of Rights there are rules and regulations for you to EXERCISE your right (free speech has limits, you have rules to petition the government, you have to register, be a citizen and resident of a certain area to be eligible to vote, etc.). Any time a discussion of regulations comes up someone loud tries to distort the conversation with a false claim of "taking away my rights". As for using volatile and oppressive regimes as an argument for why the US population needs assault weapons, that's the kind of reductio ad absurdum that makes it impossible for reasonable people to even consider the positions of fervent NRA folks. When in the history of these United States of America has the ELECTED government even come close to the regimes of those dictators to grant arming the general population with military grade weapons? It's like saying everyone should buy a space suit since in theory we could all go to the moon.

Going basic today!

Not had this one out for a while......

Slick...

Yep, they are far left. I am a Liberal, but I don't read their garbage either.

Whoa Mike this is not and should be a racist discussion, if it becomes such I will lock it up. Ken

In the summer of 1968, my freshman year in college, I had a job on a loading dock through my uncle. It was Teamsters Union and paid $3.87/hour, Teamster Truck Drivers made $3.97 an hour.

Also Sub 16800 and 168000. I had the same question. Do you want to know if it's genuine or Rep? Between Mike and i you now have the appropriate models this bracelet /endlink combo was used on. The "S" sserial on the bracelet indicates 1994 year which is well within the range of the 93150. By the way, all this info came from the sticky "Bracelet and endlink guide" at the top of the Rolex page. If it's not gen, it's a pretty darn good rep.

Discussions about guns in this country will always be based on emotional reactions and not real facts. If emotions were left out it would be a simple case of political common sense. If someone bothered to look at actual facts the fierce, illogical and profit driven NRA positions wouldn't hold any water. However every time real life examples like the success of the Australian assault weapons ban comes up someone loud has to counter with some bogus anecdotal evidence (e.g. somebody somewhere that did not have a gun handy got shot therefore everyone needs a gun) or pure and simple lies as in the case of that video, to cling to their point. When even when someone like Scalia says assault weapons are not protected by the 2nd amendment and there are some radicals out there that believe they have an argument, it just shows discuss is pointless.

Those things are almost impossible to determine via QC pics. The pin probably is flush but appears sunken because the pin itself is slightly rounded at the edge. This creates a subtle shadow giving the illusion it's sunken and gapped when it's not. Also the CP is ever so slightly domed, I have yet to to see one that is flat. Gen is not flat, but slightly domed as well.

I'm not afraid of the Government and the bogus "Socialism" threat. Total nonsense in my opinion and an invalid reason to "need" an assault rifle. What concerns me more is what's going to happen if "Global Waming/Climate Change" is an actual fact, Should these changes happen even faster than predicted, there will be global chaos and mass starvation with enormous poplulation shifts from one area to another as the population centers dry up and run out of water, the coastal areas become uninhabitable and the farm belt turns to another dust bowl. That's the only fear that I have and hopefully I'll be planted in the ground before it becomes an eventual reality. But, at least I would find that as an cceptable reason to own military type weapons. I also find it strange that it's mostly the same extreme right people that believe in every other conspiracy theory, that refuse to believe in Climate Change, other than it's actually based on real science.

that is the white-est house i think i've ever seen deltatahoe

First let me welcome you to the forum. I'm actually surprised you received this much feedback considering your question is,"who has the best sub?" The reason I say this is this is one of the most common questions received on the forum(s) and is a running joke when it comes to new members....hell, I did the same thing when I first arrived on the rep scene. However it sounds like you have already done some research. Let me try to help..... Consider Andrew simply a vendor....although he's a great choice and will deliver a good product you get what you get with him and that's a rep. Chances are you will be happy with the purchase at first and as you recognize the flaws over time then you'll probably start to look for someone to perform upgrades or modifications on the watch to make it closer to gen. This is where BK comes in.....he started his rep career modifying Rolex replicas and eventually started to offer them for sale as it made it easier on him and us. BK is a perfectionist and it shows in all his work. Yes, you will pay for this service but his products are amazing. With that said I'd suggest the following....start with Andrews watch. It's a cheaper alternative and will allow you to get understanding of this hobby first hand without spending a lot of money upfront. In my opinion this gives you a good benchmark to start this hobby and establishes true expectations. As your skills evolve you'll begin to learn what to look for (I.e. rehault, pearls, fonts, cgs, crown position, etc, etc...). Later on you might contact BK and ask him to perform some upgrades on your watch as well. As an alternative I'd suggest contacting PBdad.......he's an amazing modder IMO and can take your rep to an entirely different level Bottom line, the answer to your question is subjective so you will get conflicting answers from our members depending on where they are in their "rep careers". One thing I can guarantee you....if you love this hobby this subc will not be your last submariner. Good luck!