panerai153

I recently thinned out a few watches that never saw the light of day, as well as my WM9/BK 166610. I had a couple of purchases in mind, one was an older genuine submariner. I was looking for something that had drilled springbar holes, but since it was my daily wearer, I decided that I would prefer a 16610, over a 16800. Although I really like my vintage Rolex watches, having one with a newer movement and superluminova seemed like the best route. I was able to find a nice "P" serial model from 2000, sort of a millennium watch. My second watch was something to replace the WM9 SD project which I have totally given up on. I won't go into that,except to say that what WM9/George did in my opinion was criminal, unless he was arrested and is in jail, or is no longer on this earth, either of those eventualities would take the project out of his control. At any rate, i have been looking, rather casually, for a nice SD to fill in for the "disappeared" WM9. Last week one appeared on the sales forum. Pretty much modded to the max, and fairly reasonable considering the amount of genuine parts that were used. SSD case with working HEV Gen dial Gen bezel insert Gen tube and crown ETA 2836-2 SSD bracelet with one half gen with correct 93160A stampings I picked it up yesterday, and frankly I was pretty impressed, although it still needs a little "Fine tuning" which I will probably get done later this year. After you see the photos, I think you might be able to see the things that need to be done, although one or both are hard to see from the angle of the photos. the two things that need attention are the datewheel centering, its a little off and the top of the numbers are almost even with the top of the window. I believe that the dial is a tiny bit rotated clockwise which could account for the date being off. It's not much, but it's there. the second are the hands. The genuine dial indicies have more glow than the hands. Here again, it isn't much, but it is apparent after the watch sits in the dark for a while. Also someone mentioned in the sales thread that the pearl looked like it was tritium. It probably is, because the glow isn't as bright as the lumi pearl on the Sub. No problem there, I have a genuine lumi insert i bought for the WM9 SD, so that will probably go on as well. Another thing that I wanted to demonstrate here with the photos of the 16610 was the correct crown position on the genuine, as well as the difference in color between the 904 steel used in the Rolex and the whatever number steel in the rep SSD. It's pretty hard to describe, but I can promise you when you hold the genuine next to a rep, you can tell. Pardon the photos, I did these in a hurry tonight,and they aren't the best. First photos are side by sides of the 16610 and the SSD The "P" serial 16610. Looks pretty good for a 10-11 year old watch And now a few SSD photos

No matter what motor, it's still a very nice watch, and as D-Rock mentioned, it's available, which is a big,big plus. There are still going to be some folks who opt to pay a premium for used WM9/BK v3's, primarily because most that come up for sale have been modded, and that makes it less of a hassle for someone who doesn't have the skills, time or tools to do all the modding required. But for those who want to start from scratch, this is and excellent one to start with. To me the biggest plus is the ability to accept genuine parts with out having to do lots of alterations to the watch or part and coming up with compromises that alter the durability, water resistance,etc. It's really nice to be able to pop the bezel off and replace the insert with a genuine by snapping out the old one and snapping in the genuine, changing the crystal and using genuine gaskets, etc. and not having to glue things together!

Chef, That's a really nice watch. I wasn't aware that the v1 and the TW were one and the same. Certainly this is a nice watch to use as a base for modding. the only problem I can see is the crown position. The 2836-2 movement requires the crown tube to be too low in the case. It's not something the average person could recognize, but anyone who hasa genuine Sub16610 could see the difference right away. I went back and tried to find a photo of my recently sold WM9/BK v3, from the crown side, but it looks like I didn't ever take one from that angle. It appers in the other photos to have the crown tube slightly higher and the crown position looks to be more like my genuine 16610, possibly even a tiny amount higher. I wish I could have hung on to the WM9/BK for a few more days until my 16610 arrived, i would have liked to take some side by side photos for comparison.

Could you give us a quick post on how you removed the cyclops? i have an AR'ed cyclops from the same source.I would love to replace the non AR cyclops with the AR one. I can't disassemble the watch, so i need to be able to do it with the watch assembled. Thanks in advance.

I don't think that there are enough of the TW's out yet to have a good side by side comparison. I would say that over the next few weeks, as more are delivered, some good reviews will be posted. As to your parts question. Every genuine part you add will make the watch more credible. What the deciding factor becomes is the cost /effect ratio. Is it worth 250-300 USD to replace the bezel? possibly if you have the resources and you want the watch to be as close to genuine as possible. We had a really detailed conversation on a thread a month or so ago, relative to modding a DSRD 1665. how much would most folks be willing to spend on making the 1665 as close to genuine as possible. What the consensus was, you could spend around 20% of the cost of a genuine to build a "super franken". So if the cost of a genuine 1665 DRSD is around 15k, you could spend around 3k on your "Super Franken". With the 16610, you have another story altogether. I have a genuine "P" series 16610 that I paid 3250.00 USD for a few weeks ago. So based on that, you could afford to spend around 650-700 USD. including the cost of the watch. Considering that ratio, you couldn't afford to spend much more than a genuine Crown and insert. I would say the crown,insert and aftermarket tube are definite pluses. Possibly a genuine crystal (At least get Burt to replace the rep crystal with a Clark crystal) would be nice, but a genuine bezel would entail a replacement retaining ring and gaskets as well as a genuine bezel probably looking at 300.00 USD plus for that upgrade. Another thing to remember, you can take a 400.00 USD watch and add genuine parts and pretty quick you have a 900.00 USD watch! If you need to sell it, you are going to take a pretty big hit. I have sold exactly two modded watches for what I had in them, and they were both very desirable and rare. The others, probably 25-30 were sold at a loss, some pretty considerable.That is just the history with Replica watches. Hope this helps.

I've got the perfect movement for that one, a no date 1570!!

That's pretty much what I envisioned as well. I'll try to draw a picture of what I'm envisioning and post it. Possibly this has been tried before and doesn't work?

How do you go about centering the hole from the outside. I mean if you are off a tiny bit, your holes won't "meet in the middle" ? I could envision some type of drill guide that uses the inner hole to line up the outside and holds the drill bit in one place so that drilling the hole is easier and more accurate.

Rolex lug width is 20mm, so you need a 20mm strap. 24mm is too wide, would fit PAM's. Your Rolex springbars will fit fine.

I believe that at some point Rolex is going to offer the Pepsi bezel as an option on the IIc. From what i hear, they haven't gotten the red and blue to work. Much more difficult than a single color bezel insert. As to the love hate, i'm with you. I didn't think i would like it at first, but it has proven to be a pretty nice watch. I would still like one with a 2893-2 movement, or better yet a really accurate 1675 w/2893-2!

I believe that the attitude of the AD's is as variable as the attitudes of the folks who work in the respective stores. If you have someone who is a good sales person and they are interested in fostering good will and future sales, they will probably be more likely to work with you on a part such as a bracelet or end links. Another thing that is important is your relationship with the store and/or the sales person. I would bet that if you are a customer who comes in and buys a genuine watch or two, jewelry for your wife, etc. and they know you, it will likely go much smoother when you ask them to sell you a part. After all the AD wants to sell you the new bracelet. he probably has a pretty big markup on it and every sale counts in todays economy. On the other hand he doesn't want to jepordize his Rolex account either. If he has never seen you before, and you blow in and want a 93150 w/585 endlinks for your "1665", which you "Forgot " to bring in with you, how does he know that you aren't a "Secret Shopper" sent in by Rolex, just to check out his sales policies. We used to have an AD here in our small town, and the owner was a friend of mine, and she would do just about anything to accomodate a customer. unfortunately, our slumping economy back in the late 1980's got her store.When out economy was humming, she sold lots of Rolex watches. Her best seller, 18k Day Date!! Every Oilman in the area wanted one, it was one of their primo status symbols.I wish all the time that she was back in business, it sure would be nice to have an accomodating AD right in your own backyard.

Guys, there was a thread about this same problem about 2 weeks ago. Also over on Rep Geek, they posted a thread (By the administrator) to the effect that if anyone on that forum started a PAYPAL dispute or a credit card dispute, without allowing enough time for the backlog to clear and for dealers to figure out if packages were delayed or actually lost, that person would be banned. also their forum name would be passed to all the other forums as well as all the dealers. Obviously some of the hotheads over there were threatening to start retaliating against dealers to get money back or new items shipped. Pretty harsh words, but obviously there were problems. hopefully everything is going to get worked out here on RWG and cooler heads will prevail.Here in the USA, the Post Office will not even accept an insurance request until the package is at least 30 business days late. So the dealers cannot get reimbursed for "lost" packages until enough time elapses that they are truly "Lost" and not just delayed. I would be willing to bet that there will, in the end, be very few packages that don't eventually get to their destination. IF they are sent to the wrong place, they should eventually get straightened out or be returned to sender. There are several reasons for the problems. This shipping season sort of turned into the "Perfect Storm" relative to shipping delays,problems. First of all we just finished the Christmas season. The number of packages increases exponentially during Christmas.If you don't believe me, just ask your local UPS driver. Second the weather has been a huge factor. Every time an airport shuts down because of bad weather, it affects other airports around the world. If airplanes cannot land at JFK, they can't leave London or Hong Kong, etc. Snow and Ice in Europe shut down major airports for days. anything being carried during that time stacked up at the source.. third, since the "Toner Cartridge" bombers tried to get bombs to the USA, Security has tightened dramatically. One thing that has made a huge impact on packages being shipped to the USA is a new regulation that any package over one pound or 500 grams CANNOT be shipped on a commercial airliner carrying passengers. Everything above that weight has to be shipped on a cargo only aircraft. This has caused a huge problem especially from China to the USA. Lots and lots of companies that were shipping EMS had to scramble to find alternative methods. there has been a tremendous increase in demand for freighter aircraft. Of course the freight carriers were caught unawares, as the US Government decided to implement this new rule with no advance notice. And lastly, as the packages stacked up, the "pile effect began to emerge. In other words as the pile grew, newer packages were thrown on top of older ones. Well, guess what? As the pile began to be worked down, the last ones on the pile were the first ones to go out. as the pile dwindled down to nothing, finally the got to the packages that were put on the bottom and had been sitting there for weeks! that's why some of you folks are still waiting on packages that started out in late November, and others who ordered a week or two ago have already received their packages. So all I can say is stay calm, dealing with reps requires a whole lot of patience, because nothing is certain and nothing is guaranteed. If you internal wiring is such that it bothers you too much, then you should either stop buying from dealers overseas, only buy used member watches in your home country or region, or at the least mark out November to end of February on your calendar as "Do not order reps from overseas" months. Sort of like not eating Oysters in months that don't contain and R!!

Hi George, Great to see you back. Seems like I got a 1680 from you way back in the days of the old TRC. :thumbsupsmileyanim:

That looks really nice. It seems like I read or saw somewhere years ago that someone, possibly in the UK, was customizing Submariners with this white dial option, I suppose sort of like folks who put serti dials and diamond bezels on Subs! Obviously these were done a while back, as the tritium has aged nicely and the dial has some wear.

I have bought from them. Julian is who I've corresponded with. my only problem is the shipping charges are ridiculous. I complained to him, and he agreed. Supposedly, thye are looking for a better shipping method. They have a lot of really nice stuff, and some of the parts are fairly reasonable. If they could get the shipping down to some thing reasonable, I would probably buy from them again.

d-r, look at by-tor's reviews of the correct hand stack version of the 16710. I believe it was a noobfactory version. He wrote a pretty nice review on it. However, i believe he has changed his mind about the CHS version, as it was so problematic for most everyone who owned one. I don't know where you would find a MBW now. if they are even still available. Since Eurotimez disappeared, they haven't been widely available. I believe that at least one of the members here has access to MBW watches, and can get them on occasion. Problem is most everyone has moved on to the ceramic GMT IIc, What we really need is a good version of the 1675. That one has the same hand stack as the 2836-2 and the 2893-2 movements. A really correct version of the 1675 should sell like hot cakes!

Diz, If you are in the USA, I would recommend Snap On. i bought some from them a few years ago and they are really nice. there has to be a reason that almost every really good mechanic i know has a tool chest full of Snap On tools.

Greart looking watch. I agree the WM9 is the closest thing to genuine you can find.

Hey, I recognize that girl, I did a labor epidural on her a few weeks ago!! She's looking pretty hot now, must have weighed at least 40 # more when she was pregnant. Her younger sister is a hottie too, but she's a little bigger!! :thumbsupsmileyanim: didn't mean to step on any toes guys,lots of us are rednecks around here.

Congrats guys, both of those are great looking 1665's. Can't say the same for those feet!!. Hopefully in a few weeks i will have mine back to add to the 1665 photos. Diz, don't feel bad about the Christmas decorations. lots of the Rednecks around here keep em' up year round!!

Obviously, what one does with his own watch is his own business. looking ahead however, it boggles my mind that someone would do that to an iconic watch like the 1655.Surely to a collector PVD coating the 1655 would destroy its collector value. The price they are asking is right up there with a really nice condition collectible 1655 ,of which it obviously is not any longer. Of the two, it does look the best. the first one looks like a cheap mall watch that was painted. There are so many 2nd tier homage watches that are available, why would someone want to do that to a genuine Rolex, or for that matter a genuine anything! If you want to see some action, post that thread and link over on the Vintage Rolex Forum =@

Possibly you could put a want to buy on the Rolex forum or Time Zone for a set of used genuine hands. Might try Clark, I know they have pretty nice hands for the older Subs to fit a 1570 movement. Were you able to find a WM9/BK Sub? I know you were looking for one a few weeks ago, or did you spring for a genuine?

there must be quite a few, because I have seen them for sale almost daily over on the Rolex Forum sales forum

Hard to tell what it's worth from a few photos. In your post, you said gen 5512 then in the body you said 5513. you can get some idea of values by going over to the Vintage Rolex market. Quite a few 5512's and 5513's come up for sale over there all the time. Looking back at your photos this is a non chronometer model. mybe some of the Rolex experts will chime in and give you more nformation. unless Switzerland is different, the AD won't give you and appraisal, but they can tell you if it is authentic. I doubt that you would find a rep watch in a jewelry store in Switzerland. The AD can also take off the caseback and it should tell you more about the model, date built and possibly dates of service.

She should be proud, That's a really nice Daytona, actually I like hers better than yours. But then she is much better looking than you!!! I have to agree with her, I like it better on and Oyster. I don't know why, maybe it's just some sort of crazy preception on my part, but i have never liked Rolex watches on leather! That's strange, because to me some chronographs, such as Breitlings just seem to be made for leather, but not Rolex.