Replica compared to similarly priced Seiko, Casio, Orient or others

[CzechMate]

Hello everyone,

has someone compared quality replica (for example Omega UPO) to ordinary brand watches, like Seiko, Citizen, Orient or others in similar price range? How would they perform? Qualitywise, is it better to buy Orient for 200GBP, or is it better to buy Omega UPO for 200GBP?

(sorry if this was already discussed here, but I cannot think of the right keywords to do the search...)

[JohnG]

Hello everyone,

has someone compared quality replica (for example Omega UPO) to ordinary brand watches, like Seiko, Citizen, Orient or others in similar price range? How would they perform? Qualitywise, is it better to buy Orient for 200GBP, or is it better to buy Omega UPO for 200GBP?

(sorry if this was already discussed here, but I cannot think of the right keywords to do the search...)

Gens for same price will always be superior.

[KB]

The only other point is that gens for the same price are usually quartz

Ken

[CzechMate]

Gens for same price will always be superior.

Excuse my noob question, but in what way will they be superior?

[KB]

He means better made, but in general that is becoming more and more hazy these days as reps continue to improve in quality.

Ken

[JohnG]

Yeah, I meant better made. I am making this up, but my theory - gens are made in higher production and very modern facilities, largely automated, and in addition don't have to contend with costs associated with illegal products (seizures of goods by police or customs, lower volume sales, and a host of other issues that make selling reps more costly than selling gens).

I have just purchased a Seiko SNKf07K for $149 shipped (hasn't arrived yet). This watch has a japanese (Seiko) automatic movement. I have not the slightest doubt that is is superior in quality, reliability, lume, fit/finish, and serviceability than ANY equivalently priced replica.

Here is a pic of the watch - I have owned a lot of nice reps in this price point but haven't found them to be at the level of any Seiko I have ever owned....

Edited July 14, 2009 by JohnG

[cornerstone]

Seiko automatics are superb. You'll find a lot of fans of them here.

- Great movement

- Very well made

- Best lume in the business, bar none

One thing I wish they'd quit is the Hardlex mineral crystals.

Here's one of mine:

Reps of course are a lot of fun too.

[CzechMate]

I have checked several automatic watches from Citizen and Orient in the 200GBP range and i must say that only Orient offers realy nice watches, but with mineral glass. I cant say just by looking at the pictures, but it seems to me, that the quality of craftmanship of UPO rep will be on par with these watches. Your opinion?

[jmarin.72]

Seiko automatics are superb. You'll find a lot of fans of them here.

- Great movement

- Very well made

- Best lume in the business, bar none

One thing I wish they'd quit is the Hardlex mineral crystals.

Here's one of mine:

Reps of course are a lot of fun too.

+1

Here is mine

[chris5264]

you can pick up a new seiko monster right now for 145 (usd). IMO, there is no rep that could touch this in terms of overall quality at this price. I know there are many stories, someone picked up a 100 rep and it lasted for years without issues. But IMO, it is the unknowns and unpredictable issues from lack of QC that is the reason my collection is only gens. For example, exploding crystals, stripped case tubes or crowns or lug screws or modifications made to make the watch work just long enough to sell it. In watchtime it was reported the 40 million reps were made last year compared to 26 million gen Swiss watches. I wish I could get a number on how many of those 40 million are still running without issues. The difference is that brands like Seiko have a rep, as in reputation so they want their watches to last. The rep companies want to keep their cusomers coming back. Just my opinion.....

[KB]

Some sexy Seiko's popping up here

@CzechMate the quality of the UPO wont be on par with these Seiko's but then the gen PO is going to cost you 7k

Ken

[CzechMate]

+1

Here is mine

Wohoa Beautiful colection and very nice watches of both of you guys!

[By-Tor]

@KB: Gen PO will cost only about $2K.

Quality is impossible to measure without some kind of advanced machinery / equipment. "Build" is just one thing. Some of the reps seem to have superb "builds" and details (for the naked eye) that rival almost any gen out there (save watches like Breguet and Patek of course).

But when you take zoomed pictures the differences become apparent. Rep dial prints and stuff like bracelet SEL fitting can rarely compare. The reps can last just as long as gens but as someone mentioned there might be QC issues. But if your watch arrives ok and works for the 1st month without problems it can last just as long as a gen (without service). Reps generally can't take as much abuse as gens... like people hand winding their automatics (without any reason), or tighten their screw down crowns like there was no tomorrow, etc.

Seikos are excellent watches for the money but then again so is the rep of Swiss Steelfish SuperOcean. But if both of those watches were taken to very rigorous conditions and someone performed a "hardcore endurance test" I bet Seiko Orange Monster would win (I have owned one too... nice watch).

But is that really so important? If you don't beat up your watches the quality of most rep is more than sufficient.

I think the best reps are much better watches than some people are willing to admit... because "they come from China and they simply can't be good" analogy. People also exaggerate the quality of their gens because they have spent so much money on them. It's human nature... you want to justify your expensive purchase somehow.

I have both reps and expensive gens and I really don't see that much difference on them. But then again I'm a WIS and I paid for that "remaining 10%". Of course I'm talking about the visual part and forget about the superior movements in the gens. But as long as they look good and keep good time I'm happy... for me a nice watch is a nice watch (rep or gen). Sorry to say but very few Seikos and Orients do it for me.

Just my 2c.

[CzechMate]

you can pick up a new seiko monster right now for 145 (usd). IMO, there is no rep that could touch this in terms of overall quality at this price. I know there are many stories, someone picked up a 100 rep and it lasted for years without issues. But IMO, it is the unknowns and unpredictable issues from lack of QC that is the reason my collection is only gens. For example, exploding crystals, stripped case tubes or crowns or lug screws or modifications made to make the watch work just long enough to sell it. In watchtime it was reported the 40 million reps were made last year compared to 26 million gen Swiss watches. I wish I could get a number on how many of those 40 million are still running without issues. The difference is that brands like Seiko have a rep, as in reputation so they want their watches to last. The rep companies want to keep their cusomers coming back. Just my opinion.....

I can see... I wish I could afford colection of gens (on the other hand, I already own a little colection, one Moeris Titanium watches and one Swatch chrono - both junk ). One advantage for me is that my best friend is very good watchsmith and though he is discouraging me from reps, I think I will give it a try - and my watchsmith is also curious to see some better quality replicas - most people bring him 30USD crap like breitling bentley replicas with quartz movement...

[CzechMate]

@KB: Gen PO will cost only about $2K.

Quality is impossible to measure without some kind of advanced machinery / equipment. "Build" is just one thing. Some of the reps seem to have superb "builds" and details (for the naked eye) that rival almost any gen out there (save watches like Breguet and Patek of course).

But when you take zoomed pictures the differences become apparent. Rep dial prints and stuff like bracelet SEL fitting can rarely compare. The reps can last just as long as gens but as someone mentioned there might be QC issues. But if your watch arrives ok and works for the 1st month without problems it can last just as long as a gen (without service).

Seikos are excellent watches for the money but then again so is the rep of Swiss Steelfish SuperOcean. But if both of those watches were taken to very rigorous conditions and someone performed a "hardcore endurance test" I bet Seiko Orange Monster would win (I have owned one too... nice watch).

But is that really so important? If you don't beat up your watches the quality of most rep is more than sufficient.

I think the best reps are much better watches than some people are willing to admit... because "they come from China and they simply can't be good" analogy. People also exaggerate the quality of their gens because they have spent so much money on them. It's human nature... you want to justify your expensive purchase somehow.

I have both reps and expensive gens and I really don't see that much difference on them. But then again I'm a WIS and I paid for that "remaining 10%". Of course I'm talking about the visual part and forget about the superior movements in the gens. But as long as they look good and keep good time I'm happy... for me a nice watch is a nice watch (rep or gen).

Just my 2c.

Thanks By-Tor for your comment. I also appreciate your guides you have written about omega replicas and how to get the best. Thank you.

BTW, this is my point - I rarely put my watches under stress (when I go to the gym, I take them off, i dont swim with watches and I dont work with bush hammer either ), first thing I would do is ensure proper inspection by my watchsmith friend, proper oiling and seal siliconing, so I guess as far as they keep good time, there is not much risk involved for me. And I know it will never be genuine Omega, so maybe someone on the street will believe I wear a gen (hardly, ,if I buy gen, everyone will think they are reps), but I will always know it is a rep, so it is a bit spoiler, but I like the beauty of these watches, regardless if the beauty is fake or genuine. I like DaVincis paintings, I cant afford them, does that mean, I cannot put a copy of it on the wall?

But this topic was about quality and if the quality of UPO with Swiss ETA is good enough to last few years, then I'm in...

[automatico]

"But is that really so important? If you don't beat up your watches the quality of most rep is more than sufficient."

I agree 100%.

I have some replicas that are between 5 and 10 years old and they are fine.

For example, one Eta powered no date submariner from "WLD" in 2001/2002 still runs fine and is still water resistant...it was less than $200. A couple DG powered GMT masters from a guy called "Cal" are still running after more than 10 years. All that has ever been done to the DGs was oil them when I got them...balance jewels etc.

I am wearing a new DG powered GMT now that is running about +15 seconds in 3 days. It has a 21600 beat gold colored movement with the Dixmont-Guangzhou trademark under the balance and I have not done anything at all to it.

"I think the best reps are much better watches than some people are willing to admit... because "they come from China and they simply can't be good" analogy. People also exaggerate the quality of their gens because they have spent so much money on them. It's human nature... you want to justify your expensive purchase somehow."

Agree again.

A large percentage of "swiss made" watches and parts are made in china anyway. It does not matter where a watch is made, only how high the standard of quality is.

Imho "swiss made" is a head trip.

"I have both reps and expensive gens and I really don't see that much difference on them."

Except the price.

[CzechMate]

Thakn you automatico for your comment. Appreciate it.

BTW, When I was looking at Orient watches here in Czech Republic, they dont seem to sell CEM75001M, which is a BEAUTY!!! (it is almost like Omega PO). I might as well consider them, but, on the other hand, no one will think I am wearing Omegas then, and with Omega reps, I might fool at least someone...

Behold:

Edited July 14, 2009 by CzechMate

[JohnDorian]

I'd be curious to see if a $500 Seiko has a better finish and initial quality than say a WM9 V2 watch or a DSSD V5.

In terms of robustness, a WM9V2 is 300m rated (has anyone tested one that far?), uses a gen ETA, and it feels extremely high quality. It compares to my $2000-$3000 gens in terms of "feel" and eye examining the watch.

[CzechMate]

I'd be curious to see if a $500 Seiko has a better finish and initial quality than say a WM9 V2 watch or a DSSD V5.

In terms of robustness, a WM9V2 is 300m rated (has anyone tested one that far?), uses a gen ETA, and it feels extremely high quality. It compares to my $2000-$3000 gens in terms of "feel" and eye examining the watch.

Thanks for very encouraging comment...

Sorry for extremely noob question, but what is WM9V2 a where can I find it. I have found SeaDweller and it looks wonderful, I almost wet my underpants, but no one, and I mean NO ONE would ever belive I have bought real Rolex... And, to be honest, I intend to lie about UPO genuinity, at least for a while...

[JohnDorian]

Just do a search for WM9v2 or hit the sticky review in the rolex forum..

UPO doesn't seem very ultimate to me because of all the flaws. By the time you replace all the flawed parts for gen parts, might as well just bought a used gen.

[chronos666]

you can pick up a new seiko monster right now for 145 (usd). IMO, there is no rep that could touch this in terms of overall quality at this price. I know there are many stories, someone picked up a 100 rep and it lasted for years without issues. But IMO, it is the unknowns and unpredictable issues from lack of QC that is the reason my collection is only gens. For example, exploding crystals, stripped case tubes or crowns or lug screws or modifications made to make the watch work just long enough to sell it. In watchtime it was reported the 40 million reps were made last year compared to 26 million gen Swiss watches. I wish I could get a number on how many of those 40 million are still running without issues. The difference is that brands like Seiko have a rep, as in reputation so they want their watches to last. The rep companies want to keep their cusomers coming back. Just my opinion.....

Where can you get a monster for $145,? never seen them that low

[charmquark]

Are there any cheap gens with quality parts which would fit reps? I'm thinking crystals with good AR, hands, bezels, lume dots etc.

[FxrAndy]

"I think the best reps are much better watches than some people are willing to admit... because "they come from China and they simply can't be good" analogy. People also exaggerate the quality of their gens because they have spent so much money on them. It's human nature... you want to justify your expensive purchase somehow."

Agree again.

A large percentage of "swiss made" watches and parts are made in china anyway. It does not matter where a watch is made, only how high the standard of quality is.

Imho "swiss made" is a head trip.

"I have both reps and expensive gens and I really don't see that much difference on them."

Except the price.

Plus 1

And to the above poster the AR and crystals that you get on our better reps is as good as the high end gens

Here is a challenge.

Find a Gen that costs $300 with the following

Saphire crystal

Double AR

ETA type, inc selitas automatic movement or a seiko movement infact i will alow allow a miyota auto

Steel bracelet

100m + water resistance

stylish

any takers

[chronos666]

Plus 1

And to the above poster the AR and crystals that you get on our better reps is as good as the high end gens

Here is a challenge.

Find a Gen that costs $300 with the following

Saphire crystal

Double AR

ETA type, inc selitas automatic movement or a seiko movement infact i will alow allow a miyota auto

Steel bracelet

100m + water resistance

stylish

any takers

how about an Invicta pro diver, decent cheap watch. Meets those qualities.

[JohnDorian]

If you owned gens like Breitling or Omegas with actual double AR, the best factory double AR that comes on reps don't even come close to anything like a real OEM double AR. It almost just looks like they put on some bluing treatment on the glass that doesn't really have any anti-reflective properties.

Also, I'm not 100% sure the "Sapphire" glass that is advertised on $300 reps are actually sapphire. I'm more inclined to say they're mineral. Kind of the same way how sellers will drop ship you "ETA SWISS MOVEMENT" and it'll be a clone most of the time.