bruce79 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyd3 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 It seems someone struck a nerve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbj69 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 It seems someone struck a nerve. it seems someone told some lies is more like it , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supermanx Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 I'm not a photoshop expert, and the picture is small (blew it 4x), but why is the only color inconsistancy at the same two places the dent marks are on the lugs in The Zigmeister's pictures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supermanx Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Here is the lugs on the pic with the rusted crown tube blew up 4x: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hk45ca Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Here is the lugs on the pic with the rusted crown tube blew up 4x: that looks like the case lug??? or am i seeing things (and that is very possable) lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutchy Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 It really is a shame that this type of situation has to occur, especially in a good ol' community like this one, that does it's absolute best protecting, warning, helping, and advising other members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supermanx Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 It really is a shame that this type of situation has to occur, especially in a good ol' community like this one, that does it's absolute best protecting, warning, helping, and advising other members. I've seen some of Joes work and it was really really great, but damn every 3 weeks there are more and more posts about where has joe gone... And a lot of them are from well respected members, many of them who still have their watch with him. How bad are you going to call out someone if they still posses a couple of your watches? I personally have never dealt with joe, but I have dealt with The Zigmeister and he is quick to respond to my questions and always very helpfull. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbj69 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Here is the lugs on the pic with the rusted crown tube blew up 4x: i wish i had that watch back in my hands as i sent it and i could blow up everything but same thing i said if u blow up anything that much u will see many flaws on any watch, but not to the naked eye is what im saying, , i promise u if u had that watch in your hand it would look like my pics and a good comparison would be with the michael young dials with this same type tritium effect and like i said he and many were so happy with it before and if u have been around in the past jealous The Zigmeister has always tried to pull stunts like this before and time and time again he blows up the truth ,ONE MORE THING TO NOTICE ON THIS WATCH HE PUTS LIGHT TO BRIGHTEN UP STUFF TO SHOW FLAWS (i can do this to any watch to show flaws, as u can see in the top pics all those nicks ) but again this watch in question is the one in my pics and it is nothing like the pics The Zigmeister provided i promise u that,, BUT IF U GO LOOK AT THE ONE HE DID THE LIGHTING IS DIFFERENT AND LOWER SO U CAN'T SEE CRISP ON HIS WORK, IT IS CALLED PHOTO ALTERING, i hope u r not that blind to see and i have nothing else to prove other than this pic of other vintage watch lugholes? ps. i just noticed supermax u saying this so here is my answer to u ok just keep in mind i was down for 3 months and kept everyone informed and now im playing catch up , but before i got sick i was very punctual and hung out all the time, all i can say is my slowness was not intentional and i have never screwed anyone , and right now i have been great and dont have time to hang out like i used to only because i have to get work done and i do have a family as well to be with , if u cant understand that then please dont send me anything, its not like i go out and beg for work and or advertise my work to drum up business, i dont have to , my friends and customers do it for me , only because they know it is good stuff and i will bend over backwards to try and make u happy , i never have anything bad to say about anyones work even the do it yourselfers, if u know me from the past i have always tried to help people with there problems and help the do it yourselfers , but i guess when u have been on top as long as i have and as flawless as i have, u will get jealous people here and there try to discredit u , im starting to get used to it by now , sad to say but at least that means my work is worthy of critiquing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutchy Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 I've seen some of Joes work and it was really really great, but damn every 3 weeks there are more and more posts about where has joe gone... And a lot of them are from well respected members, many of them who still have their watch with him. How bad are you going to call out someone if they still posses a couple of your watches? I personally have never dealt with joe, but I have dealt with The Zigmeister and he is quick to respond to my questions and always very helpfull. Joe has been very helpful and fast with my questions too and The Zigmeister was very nice when I PM'ed him as well back in the day. I wasn't talking about anyone in particular in my post. I have never dealt with Joe, nor The Zigmeister, and I am 100% for free speech. It was just a general comment saying it's a shame that stuff like this happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrcraft Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 I have an MBW "Great White" in with Joe right now for a full mod package and genuine 1570 movement placement. He was up front and told me it will take 3-4 weeks to get the watch back to me (It's been one week now). For those asking "where's Joe"? He has posted several times to please not PM him but to use his email address. He has responded every time I've emailed him, and has given me his phone number as well. Sometimes he answers, sometimes he doesn't...like the rest of us. So, to this point, he has been nothing but friendly, responsive and helpful. I'll keep you all posted how long it actually takes for him to get the watch back to me, and I'll post some picts and comments on the quality of the work as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbj69 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 I have an MBW "Great White" in with Joe right now for a full mod package and genuine 1570 movement placement. He was up front and told me it will take 3-4 weeks to get the watch back to me (It's been one week now). For those asking "where's Joe"? He has posted several times to please not PM him but to use his email address. He has responded every time I've emailed him, and has given me his phone number as well. Sometimes he answers, sometimes he doesn't...like the rest of us. So, to this point, he has been nothing but friendly, responsive and helpful. I'll keep you all posted how long it actually takes for him to get the watch back to me, and I'll post some picts and comments on the quality of the work as well. thanks for your support but i wanted to clear something up , i said 3 or 4 weeks before i start ok, buy i may suprise u anyway , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namor Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Old story again and again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 I'm not going to get into a "[censored] for tat' Flame war with Joe, The photos are out there for everyone to see. I seriously doubt that Rob would go to the trouble to Photoshop things into the photos that didn't exist, or make them worse. Rob doesn't have an axe to grind with Joe, Rob has more work that he can handle, and a lot of those are restorations of very nice genuine watches. He has done three genuine Doxas as well as a Omega SM300 for me and did a wonderful job on all of them. One of those was a pre Sub300 Doxa Dive watch that is to this day, the only one in the world, and very, very valuable. I trusted Rob to do a careful restoration of this watch, and he did a wonderful job. I trust him with my genuine watches, and I certainly can’t say that for most of the watchmakers around. As far as I’m concerned, Joe can say what he want’s to say. I trusted him, and he came up short, for the price he charged. He says I was satisfied with the lume job, sure I was, until I looked at it magnified. It was terrible. My question to Joe, If it was experimental, only the second one, why charge 150.00 USD while you were learning? After I got the watch back, I realized the crown was not screwing down properly and wasn’t any better than the stock crown/tube that came on the watch. As to the bezel insert, it was truly plier or wrench tight. I spent 30 minutes in my shop with Kroil and a thin piece of rubber trying to get it back to the 12 o’clock position. It wasn’t correct. And Joe as to that remark about genuine bezels, well sport, I would bet in my 62 years on this mortal coil, I have owned more genuine Rolex Subs, SD’s and GMT’s than you will ever own, not counting the very large number of genuine Dive watches all with rotating bezels. The only time I ever saw a bezel even as close to as tight as this one, was when the watch was so filthy that dirt and grime had hardened under the bezel and cemented everything stuck. I don’t care if you work on other folks watches, that’s fine with me. I wish you luck and success and hope that you are able to keep your watch modification business, if that’s what you want to do. I don’t bear you any malice or ill will, as long as you don’t make this personal. You aren’t the only watchmaker that I wouldn’t use again. I wouldn’t use RGM who is the official designated Doxa repair facility, simply because they seem to be too involved in their watch manufacturing business, and think nothing of keeping a watch for 10-12 months while they “Search for parts”. This is the last post for me on this thread. I’ve said all I’m going to say. Arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 I have never dealt with Joe, but here is something that really puzzled me. It always appear that after a few post came forth about "where's joe?" or "something goes wrong with Joe" then Joe will come out of no where. If people are asking Joe where he is, it seemed to me that they are the ones that have sent Joe watches already. Which leads me to believe that Joe did not answer for them. If Joe can come forth and respond again, and let us know how many watches he has currently that is pending work, and come out with a time table, then I think everyone will be happy. Joe won't have to clarify himself again, and members won't have to keep asking "where is joe, and where is the watch?" until some serious time has passed after this so called time table has been posted. I think I can wait a long time too, if I know someone is really busy, but if there are any watches that Joe has in his possesion for more than 6 months, I think it would be appreciated if Joe can give some of those members an update. I hate to say it, I think it is only fair, especially if there are watches in Joe's place for more than 6 months, if there isn't, certainly Joe would get my apology first and foremost. Just by reading some of the stories, I truly feel bad for some of the members........happy timing, everyone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbj69 Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 I dont bare u any ill will either, im sry u feel the way u do , but i will have to say this maybe all those mars and scratches rob was fabricating in the pics and trying to make it seem like it was my fault ,could have come from u in the shop prying on it, but it certainly didnt leave me that way, and like i said u were happy for a spell with it and i never heard anything as to u being unhappy with it till now , all u had to do was contact me and problem would have been solved so easily but that is your perogative and im sry i lost your friendship to gossip but put anything under a fine microscope especially an aging look we were looking for and u will see all the flaws u want to, even michael youngs who many love, have many flaws in those conditions,(send me a The Zigmeisterdial and let me take the pics and his will look like crap to) it is actually easy to use regular lume and bring it out closer to the edge like your sd but the key is not get puffy looking , but we wanted it to fan out to the edge and then have a white outline and that is what i gave u , if u asked me ,would u notice it under a microscope? i would have said hek yeah , and any lume job u will see many flaws under those conditions, i think u got conned into this thread by someone but at this point i explained and showed what i sent u and i think deep down u know that watch didnt look like rob made it seem ,(thank god i saved those pics of it )when u got it back in june or july , i know u r not that kind of guy and it didnt even sound like u at all, so for me i am going to think u r a good guy still and move on, just wish u would have talked to me about it before hand, but hindsight is 20/20 i guess that is how it goes, this is the end of it for me as well, and im not here to bicker back and fourth as well, i would have bought the old dial back from u to help u compensate your losses and or the whole watch for that matter but again u didnt communicate, i thought u knew by now i stand by my work as a gentleman but gentlemen communicate to one another where i come from , take care my old friend joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRT Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 I have seven fully-modded Rolex reps from Joe. I have posted close-up pics of all of them, and I think they look quite spectacular. So do a number of other folks who made very nice comments about them (this includes some of the same people bashing him in this thread.) I look at the pictures of Panerai 153's DRSD and wonder how it could look so messed up compared to what Joe says he sent him. Where are all the other pictures from other folks with messed-up RBJ watches. Please come forward and share them with the board. Panerai 153 seemed so happy with this watch when he wrote about it a few months back...what happened to set this off? I thought the pics of his new vintage lume-job looked so awesome that it inspired me to send my 1680 and 1665 back to Joe to be relumed. Obviously, if you take the time to look at the lume with a magnifier it will be imperfect. A magnifier-perfect lume line or dot can not be painted by even the steadiest of hands (even under the influence of B-blocker's.) Replace RBJ's fingers with a "DaVinci" robot, then maybe. I too would like to see The Zigmeister's lume under the same high-power magnification and contrast lighting. If ever I didn't like something Joe did, I would let him know and he would make it right (i.e. pay me back or fix the problem.) When he does an experiment (i.e. new lume technique or custom molded brevet crown, etc.) and you aren't happy with the result, why not just tell him and give him the chance to make it right? One time, he installed an experimental pearl dot for a vintage insert and I thought it looked way-off. He didn't charge me. He charges an hourly rate like any contractor I have ever come across (i.e. plumber, electrician, hi-fi techs, etc.) To me, it was worth the price since his quality has been very good and I too don't have the time or skills to do this type of work. In short, these photos do not represent any of the end products I have ever received from RBJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hk45ca Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 i guess i am confused. if was so bad why was he so happy with it when this reveiw was posted? i must have missed something here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRT Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 i guess i am confused. if was so bad why was he so happy with it when this reveiw was posted? i must have missed something here. Panerai 153 even initially stated that the watch looks "absolutely identical to several DRSD's that are picture in Skeet and Urul's great reference book..." I agree with that statement, since I am holding mine in my hand now and looking at the "great reference book". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 usually it is only jealous higgy humpa Sometimes the best defence isn't a good offense. This is one of those times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 Sometimes the best defence isn't a good offense. This is one of those times. Maybe Pugwash, our resident Photoshop expert, (or slay) can say whose pictures were doctored if it's obvious to them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 Maybe Pugwash, our resident Photoshop expert, (or slay) can say whose pictures were doctored if it's obvious to them? Something tells me this would not be needed. Still, I'll run the tools on the pics when I get home next week, but I'm about 100% sure that it will find no foul play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 Almost anything I say here is going to be overexaggerated as grossly in support of, or detrimental to, the parties in question. Be that as it may, some of you know that I have a few fairly rare watches. One of them is rare enough that I have refused to let anyone inside it until I did a lot of looking and evaluating. I saw what I liked and so I sent it to The Zigmeister for an overhaul and he did a masterful job for me. I have no hesitations about sending more to him. I wish everyone was like you.. Doing a little research before sending his watches to someone to mess with them (in a good or bad way) I think sometimes things are so bloody obvious that if people want to see the tree and not the forest they deserve to be burned. Something tells me this would not be needed. Still, I'll run the tools on the pics when I get home next week, but I'm about 100% sure that it will find no foul play. There is no foul play.. I am a graphic designer as well and the pictures are NOT modified in any way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted October 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 I too would like to see Ziggy's lume under the same high-power magnification and contrast lighting. How's this, close enough for you???? This is the SAME dial you saw in the first post AFTER I Salvaged it... Not close enough for you...is this better??? SAME lighting, but I used the CORRECT amount of binder in the lume, therefore it doesnt' look like a piece of burnt cheese... As for the rest of the comments, it's like reading a CSI episode...anyone who wants the original pictures for "Analyzis" just let me know, and you can analyze them to death... IF I WAS going to do something, why would I waste time on photoshop, all I would need to do is damage the watch and THEN take a picture of it...get real folks... Funny to see the analysis, especially considering that the watch has 2 lugs that look the same in the photo's, how did you determine exactly WHICH lug I had taken a picture of for their analysis when compared to the other ones... It's hard to believe that people have been here as long as they have, meaning did everyone forget what has been posted during the past few months? It sure seems as it that is the case... Or am I the only one that noticed a TREND here with this member... And when I see a someone who sent their watch to him last week (I have to guess you missed ALL the previous posts on the problems with this member), and then believes they will get it back in 3-4 weeks, I suggest you contact the member(s) on TRC who have been waiting for their watches for Six months to OVER A YEAR...as they are going to be [censored] that your watch is being done before theirs... I got the watch, took it apart and took pictures of what I found. If you dont' believe me, that's your choice. As Arthur said, I DON'T do the same type of work Joe does, so there is no COMPETITION between us... I have enough to keep me busy for months...without getting into this type of work. As for the ramblings and childish comments and insults from Joe, there is nothing further to say. I did what I was asked to do, and posted the results. Seems I struck a nerve...as did the others who posted their displeasure with Joe over the past few months... one post, maybe a accident or one-off incident, numerous posts - on here and TRC - again and again, it doesnt' take a genius to make the connection. How many examples does one need before you can put 2 and 2 together... I have to assume that the members here are intelligent enough to see through the BS...but it seems as if the lessons will continue to be repeated for those that are not willing to learn from others...much to their dismay... No further comments are needed or coming from me...it is what it is, all the excuses and BS and insults arent' going to change it... This is Arthur's watch not mine, I did what was asked of me, I have nothing further to add. RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighDef Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 WOW!!!! Was that lume done by hand??? I think The Zigmeister is an Alien from planet Rep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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