dieselpower Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 I have read many times that a build begins with the dial. Everything else is secondary to that. After many years in this game I'm finally seeing the wisdom of these words. Now, given that gens are silly prices I got to thinking - which dial is the best on the market? So folks, here's the question. Which vintage rep dial, readily available and regardless of gen model number, without requiring further work is the most faithful to the genuine article? Let's have a heated debate.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomhorn Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 The "readily available" part is the kicker. Unfortunately, a lot of the really good dials are easily found. I really liked the ND Trading 1016 dials, but getting one is next to impossible. I also bought two of Whoppy's dials (5514 and 1016) which I liked a lot, but you can't get them now either. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 The best dials are from Ivan. After that, I'd say Kirk Rich... but you send him a genuine plate to work on. After that, it's a crapshoot... a dial from MQ might be junk, but the next one he sends might be spectacular. Likewise, Phong has good stuff but at different price points... his $1,000 dial is made different than his $300 dial. So it's apples/oranges. NDT and InGod have nice dials, but they vary from piece to piece. Which explains the QC pictures we clamor after. It's like finding the pearl among the peas... you might get lucky or you might have to send a few back until the right one comes along. Or you pay the man and get an Ivan ... and it's perfect every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProMariner Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 The best dials are from Ivan. After that, I'd say Kirk Rich... but you send him a genuine plate to work on. After that, it's a crapshoot... a dial from MQ might be junk, but the next one he sends might be spectacular. Likewise, Phong has good stuff but at different price points... his $1,000 dial is made different than his $300 dial. So it's apples/oranges. NDT and InGod have nice dials, but they vary from piece to piece. Which explains the QC pictures we clamor after. It's like finding the pearl among the peas... you might get lucky or you might have to send a few back until the right one comes along. Or you pay the man and get an Ivan ... and it's perfect every time. InGod Paul Newman dial are just rubbish, but the 1666 rail dial is near to perfection I must admit ! The "readily available" part is the kicker. Unfortunately, a lot of the really good dials are easily found. I really liked the ND Trading 1016 dials, but getting one is next to impossible. I also bought two of Whoppy's dials (5514 and 1016) which I liked a lot, but you can't get them now either. I have a Whoopy 5514 dial I have to say it is the best comex 5514 dial you can get Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
automatico Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 I think it is best to not have very high expectations on your 'next' aftmkt or refinished dial because they are so chancy and hit or miss. This comes from owning various dials of all kinds from Chris to Paul, Yuki to IG44, plus a couple 'like new' J&W dials. Most members know who 'Paul' is but no one except me knows who 'Chris' is. Thank goodness. I would say around $125/$150 is about the max I will pay for a good aftmkt dial because at $125 to $150 I can stand getting a dud now and then but ratty $500/$1000 dials are hard to swallow. After all, some of the crappiest dials are over $500. Imho no aftmkt dial is worth over a couple hundred bucks unless it will fool just about every 'expert' on the planet. Think of the size of the market for these things...maybe a few thousand guys in the whole wide world, even when including the "I don't lie" 'Serious Rolexpert Dealers'. Because so many dud dials are cranked out, the dial 'dealers' can really jack the price up when a good dial does come along while the average crap is sold to guys like me. In my Crystal Ball, I see a table in a HK market with 100 dials spread around on it, all are $25 each and all were made by the same dial maker but on different days. A Tuesday, Wednesday or Thursday dial may retail for $700 where a Monday or Friday dial might go for $50 or end up on eBay. "You can't fool me with that dial, I'm a damn expert!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 I have a story about a certain Rolexpert with a huge collection of incredibly nice vintage pieces, all with fake dials that fooled everyone. It's not Maron. If I get enough scotch in me some night maybe I'll tell it. Probably not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ww12345 Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 Really!?! Who could it be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieselpower Posted December 12, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 I have a story about a certain Rolexpert with a huge collection of incredibly nice vintage pieces, all with fake dials that fooled everyone. It's not Maron. If I get enough scotch in me some night maybe I'll tell it. Probably not. Someone buy that man a drink! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 All MQ (with gen coronets that I added) & the only thing I have seen that is better are gens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbobdobalina Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 I would say around $125/$150 is about the max I will pay for a good aftmkt dial because at $125 to $150 I can stand getting a dud now and then but ratty $500/$1000 dials are hard to swallow. After all, some of the crappiest dials are over $500. Imho no aftmkt dial is worth over a couple hundred bucks unless it will fool just about every 'expert' on the planet. I think this is good advice. So what would one recommend as the best "readily available" vintage sub dial that is less than $150? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionsandtigers Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 "Ivan" is a myth. dont bother.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Well, you can always make your own. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kime Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 IMG_3677.JPG Yes that's the Ivan myth right there ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Here's the Big Gonzo's dial..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionsandtigers Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 first rule of Ivan, dont talk about Ivan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Roger that. You don't contact Ivan ... he contacts you. On the other hand..... http://www.krdial.com/services.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
champagneinhand Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Any recommendations on Breitling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DVNE Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Well, you can always make your own. My dial.JPG IMG_3677.JPG holy hell. Beautiful! Just like the Bill Yao Kingston dials. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Here's the Big Gonzo's dial..... IMG_3679.JPG The decals start out like that, but the spray sealer sealer takes away most of the indent. I'd like to find an ink that doesn't need the sealer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc33 Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 What about using lacquer instead of a sealer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 The contents of lacquer will melt the vinyl decal. I don't think it would be compatible with inkjet inks, either. That's why I use a water-based acrylic lume. The chemicals used in normal lume even melts my inserts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc33 Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Wow, interesting! I don't really think you need to change a thing, your dials are great as they are imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbane883 Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 What about a water-based varnish like Varathane diamond coat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Wow, interesting! I don't really think you need to change a thing, your dials are great as they are imo Thanks. It'd be nice to have that little extra of the black visibly raised above the script. Of course with my tired, old eyes, I can't see it without a lot of help! I really like the 'natural' patina from the decal and spray sealer for an aged chapter ring dial. What about a water-based varnish like Varathane diamond coat? I think I'd get the same effect as I do now. The picture above of the decal is without sealer. I've looked for a waterproof, permanent ink to use in an inkjet printer, but only found 'water-resistant'. They run and flatten out when the decal is wetted to apply. The quest continues! The problem with the quest is that every time I find an improvement I like, I wind up refinishing all my chapter ring dials! This was my first decal from 2010. It has changed a lot since then. Serifs on all the markers including chapter ring, more crisp lettering, cleaning up computer pixel 'bleed', better sizing, sharper and more accurate crown 6 & 9 markers and triangle, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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