droptopman Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 Good morning fellow enthusiasts, Been working on this one for a while. I was lucky enough to acquire a great dial from a great member. Everything (but a movement) is with or on the way to dbane for his very talented skills to bring to life. After much discussion we decided on an MQ case set, gen spec dial, gen crown and tube, and gen crystal. Looking for a "perfect" gen insert but have not come up with one yet, so initially may have a Phong red triangle. Planning to use a black horween strap with red stitching (need to swap a Rolex buckle in), also have a Yuki 7206, but may source a gen rivet at some point. My vision for this piece really has it sporting a red stitch strap with the red depth rating dial and red triangle insert. Here is my dilemma: Was planning on using a 1030 cal all along, but a friend has suggested to take an ETA and remove the base plate and cut holes for gen feet to keep the gen spec dial in tact. Would have to modify the hands to fit but this is also doable. I have been looking for a 1030 for some time now and not having much luck. Run across potential donor watches with 1030, but really do not want to destroy a vintage Rolex just to get the movement. Obviously the ETA option saves me about 1K and is easily accessible, but I also plan to keep this watch so the expense is not as much of a factor as finding the movement now, and then being able to service it in the future. Thoughts from the collective are encouraged and welcomed. Here are a couple pics: Thanks 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mendota Explorer Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 Tough one. Very promising start to this. I'm no expert. If you do go the donor watch route, you can always store the rest of the gen parts safely for future use. Just put the 1030 back in and that piece would be back to good use. So you really aren't damaging anything. I want to try this a few years from now, but I'm starting to lean towards the 5510 now, since I can use a 15xx in it. Seems to be easier to find those. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 This was the most emotional decision I had to make during the Big Gonzo build. It was, and always will be known as the Great Gonzo Crisis. In the end I chose an ETA 2846 for several reasons. 1030s are getting more scarce by the day, and autowind reversing wheels will only last so long. I intend to use mine in the ocean - a lot - and I cannot justify trashing a 1030 if it leaks. An ETA is durable and easy to replace. So my path chosen, how to make it work? My dial is made on a gen 6538 plate so the feet were wrong. Drilling the ETA base plate is the most elegant solution. The stem height for 2846 vs. 1030 was wrong anyway (too tall) so did I want a spacer? In the end I had Ziggy cut the feet off the dial (please remain calm) and he built a custom movement ring. Then he machined the MQ case to fix the stem height. That's called 100% commitment. A problem arose when I used 1030 spec hands on the ETA. He Who Must Not Be Named had lumed them to exactly match the dial so I needed them. I had one watchmaker attempt to broach them to fit, and he was marginally successful. I wound up sending it to MyManMatt and he did it right. Using gen Tudor gold hands would have been easier if I could have them tinted to match. You'll need a stem adapter to mate a gen 8mm crown to the ETA movement. Now it's together, the movement doesn't move AT ALL in the case, it looks fantastic, keeps perfect time, and it's bulletproof. That's exactly what I wanted. PS: an additional something to consider: http://www.yukiwatch.com/articles/article/7390084/160035.htm 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted February 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 Thanks B, If I go ETA Matt would do the movement and hands. So even if the ETA is modified to accept the gen dial feet, I would still have a stem height issue? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 Yes, the stem height between a 1030 and 2846 is different. IIRC the ETA combo is slightly too tall. ETA: http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&&2uswk&ETA_2846 1030: unsure.... I can't remember where I found the numbers? Maybe it matches the spec for the 1530 on ranfft? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 I would opt for the 1030, no matter how long it takes. But I am in agreement that you should not dismantle an otherwise good, working Rolex just to pluck out its ticker. Wait for either a bare movement or a more common watch with a damaged case or dial. You do have to be judicious in your enhanced patination of these new pieces so your final watch does not look like it either came out of the factory yesterday or was artificially aged, as has become so common. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbane883 Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 yeah, stem height will potentially be an issue, even after the ETA base plate is drilled. it's one more peril to consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 You do have to be judicious in your enhanced patination of these new pieces so your final watch does not look like it either came out of the factory yesterday or was artificially aged, as has become so common. Exactly correct. You get to do this once, so go slow. The eye picks up things the brain doesn't announce, and if the subtle details don't agree, it just feels wrong. Your final product has to feel like it's a coherent, well loved piece from 5 decades ago... whether it was worn a lot or a little. In my case the dial is too pristine, but then again the dial in my 1971 Seadweller is absolutely pristine too. So it can happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted February 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 Gentlemen, Thank you for the feedback and information, this has been very helpful. Sometimes I just need to write ideas out and get some input from members who's opinions I value. I have been grinding on this pretty good. I will just be patient and find a 1030 CAL. This is a very special build for me and the design in my mind always had a genuine movement. Hopefully, at some point I will also find an MK1 insert that is priced less than a house.... I really appreciate this forum and the great members here. Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc33 Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 Can't wait to see it done!! I forgot that Nanuq had to have his case machined, I really would opt for the 1030 as others have said in that case, just don't swim with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Impressive choice of parts, very well done. May I ask you where did you source the strap from? B&S perhaps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted February 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Impressive choice of parts, very well done. May I ask you where did you source the strap from? B&S perhaps?Thank you. The strap was made by a guy I found on eBay. Does custom work, very reasonable prices and I think his work is great. Super nice guy too. http://www.jack-foster.com/ Sent from my droptop using telepathy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Thanks a lot for the pointer. sent forn mungalaxy jote 3 usong tapatalk and this crappy onsc4een keyolboars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
automatico Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Plus and Minus on 1030 vs Eta... Plus: 1030 is what came in this model of watch quite a few 1030 donor watches around donor watch with corroded case/ratty dial is not much of loss to vintage rolex in general when parted out aftmkt dials are usually made for 1030, not Eta movement and any left over parts should hold value so not much $$ loss there project watch with 1030 is worth a lot more than watch with Eta Minus: 1030 is very expensive compared to Eta 1030 replacement parts are very expensive and hard to find compared to Eta 1030 is not very rugged compared to Eta many 1030 are just about worn out rotor bearings pn 7004 cause trouble and are near impossible to find service cost is high on 1030 lost or stolen project watch with 1030 is a big loss What would I do? Probably decide on which class of watch I want to go with. First Class = top of the line case, dial etc with 1030. Second Class = lower $$ case/dial and Eta movement. Another choice would be to put a Second Class watch together first for a few hundred bucks and decide if it is worthwhile to put a First Class watch together for a few thousand bucks. Who knows, the swelling might go down after building the Second Class watch and you are happy with it and give up on a First Class watch, or you might learn enough to avoid future mistakes in building a First Class watch. You are probably looking at $3000 or so for a First Class watch and maybe $500 to $1000 for a Second Class watch depending on how much you can do yourself. The 'free' advice above is from putting 10+ Frankenstein projects together and learning an expensive lesson when I stalled out on a Phong case 1655 with genuine movement. Four years later it is past $3000 and still in the parts box while I look for the remaining few 'affordable' genuine 1575 GMT parts. Always remember...'free' advice is worth exactly what you paid for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted February 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Thank you for the feedback. I actually have a <$1000 HR build that I bought to see if I really wanted to spend the money for a high end build. The HR is a nice piece but in the end does not give me what I am looking for in a 6538, mainly because it will not accept gen parts, but it did prove that I indeed did want to do a real deal build. The stem height issue was the final factor in deciding to stick with a 1030, just do not want to mess with that. Been through it before and ended up replacing a movement then had to modify the case to correct the position and in the end never liked the way it turned out. Funny though....I wish I could build it for $3000, little more now days to do one of these Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Because I was working with Ziggy helped me finalize my ETA decision. Il Maestro could make a Da Vinci from a tin can, so I knew he could do it right. It was his last project before he retired. Would I do that again? Probably not. $3,000? Yeah that's a good start. Mid $4k gets you a top shelf build on a Yuki band, and then you pick a movement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mendota Explorer Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 (edited) So it sounds like the only two options are Phong and MQ cases when doing a build using a gen movement. It seems like the case, dial, and movement are the 3 biggest culprits that drive up the price so much. This is an area where Adrian really has an opportunity to shine if he can get his gen spec case produced. If he could come in at a 3rd or even half of these others, that would be a game changer if it was as good. As for dials, if Ivan isn't within a budget, what is the next best dial option that would be socially acceptable to put on a gen movement? What would really do a gen movement justice? Or is Ivan really the only way to go if you want to have a piece that can be an heirloom to pass down to kids? Edited February 12, 2015 by Mendota Explorer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Other than Ivan there's another made using the same technique that's not too bad, but it's also $1,000. MQ I think... So try a Big Dazza modded (MQ) $350-level dial and hands, add Adrian's crown and an "okay" insert and it's pretty good. But not an heirloom. Here's how mine looked, it was good enough while I waited for an Ivan dial to come along. Consider a T17 will run well over $500 and a gen crown/tube will be about $450 and you're in almost another Grover for details. FF MkIII insert? Another $300. It adds up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted February 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 I looked at the MQ dials and it was made in the gen spec fashion, just did not seem to have the same wow factor that the man with no name. Nanuq is right about costs adding up quick, and the prices he listed above or lower that what I have seen lately. A decent MKIII insert is now 700 and up. Crown and tube 600 ish for both. I have been searching for a period correct insert for months and you could buy a pretty nice car for what they are going for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Roger that. Add $1,000 for a gen bezel, or $300 for a pretty good Phong. $300 for a trit pearl... It never ends. Literally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc33 Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Roger that. Add $1,000 for a gen bezel, or $300 for a pretty good Phong. $300 for a trit pearl... It never ends. Literally. That was last year! Gen bezel (service) more like 1500$ + now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbane883 Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Yup. Takes a big commitment. But for me, oh so worth it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted February 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 that is just mean....I am still weeks out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Oh, you THINK you're weeks out. That's what I was still thinking two years into my project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.