Why To Buy A Replica Buy Genuine

[panerailord]

I HAD SPENT A LOT OF MONEY TO REPLICA WATCHES

AND FINAL I DECIDE THAT DOES NOT WORTH

from now i buy genuine

for exaple

if you 5 expensive replicas with reluminer ar-coating bla bla bla bla

you have spent at least 3500 euro or 4000$

with that money you will buy 1 panerai 24 submersible

or panerai 25 or any used panerai

and you wear a genuine piece and not a replica!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

what do you think?

[olreon]

hello,

yes you are right, but you will have only one watch.... and so you got 5

best wishes

olreon

[sssurfer]

yes you are right, but you will have only one watch.... and so you got 5

I think the same too.

And what about the excitement of modding a rep?

[Quarks]

For a while, I couldn't stand the reps that I have. Everytime I took a glance at my wrist, I saw a bunch of flaws and it bugged me. It bugged me really bad. And even though I hated those flaws, I constantly find myself giving in to reps. I am a fickle-minded person in some ways when it comes to purchasing stuff. So I like to try them on and see if I like them. And if I like them a whole lot, I would then go out and buy a gen. And that was what I did. I got a monster gen which I am very VERY happy about and I am already thinking which ones to get next.

I have owned previous gens before I got into reps. It is funny that those gens that I bought are just sitting there. The only reason why I am not giving them up is because of sentimental value. If I would have gotten the reps of the gens beforehand, NO WAY would I have bought them. Ah well.

If you like a watch very much, so much so that it drives you up the wall, can't stop thinking about it 24/7, by all means, if you have the ca$h, go splurge on a gen. I would do the same.

[swdivad]

Right now, I only wear my gens... I have been waiting for my two favourite reps for a very long time to come back from getting the works done on them...

I hope to wear them when I see them again, but I always seem to go back to the genuines, they just feel better

[ubiquitous]

And what about the excitement of modding a rep?

Agree 100%. That's what makes this hobby fun for me. Building and modding watches is far more interesting than just buying a gen

[hanswurst]

I owned two genuine Submariners: a Tudor, which I still have and a 16610 which I sold. My simple calculation is as follows:

I can buy a decent ETA sub for around €200 or less, if I even wanted to get my genuine serviced, I paid around €300-400 every few years (AD price) just to have a watch that keeps time! Yes, a genuine movement is not that much better in timekeeping if you wear it on a daily basis. After 3 years my genuine 16610 lost about 10 minutes every week.

If I buy reps, I don't have to invest €3500 and the additional €300 every few years and I can have a lot of different watches. Overall I am much happier with my reps, if it breaks, just get a new one!

It is as simple as that!

[chris5264]

Agree 100%. That's what makes this hobby fun for me. Building and modding watches is far more interesting than just buying a gen

I also agree. I've said this before, but there is something that connects you to a watch that you worked on. I like that I've put the hands on almost all my reps. I've had the backs off, most of the movements and dials off. I never touched a gen or had the back off, at least not a 4 thousand dollar one. An expensive gen may be perfect, but it is too impersonal for me. I just picked up a 600 gen watch and found a dust particle on the dial. If this was an expensive gen I would have to either pay someone to do it for me or live with it. It is no problem to take the back off, remove the movement and get the dial brush out. Think of it this way,,,how many of the gen forum (panerai in particular) have a section for repair and upgrading? They don't because unless you are an expert, it is crazy to work on a 10 thousand dollar watch. In the end, these types end up having an expensive collection and not really knowing about watches. Unless you take a movement apart and put it back together, (IMO) you will really never understand how a watch works.

[TJGladeRaider]

I read all the replies, but my perspective is a little different.

Thirty years ago, I could have bought a Rolex Sub in the Navy Exchange (store for US military) for about three times the price of a Seiko diver. Now, you can no longer buy them them in the Navy Exchange, because Rolex isn't going to let anyone buy their precious $500 watch for less than $4000.

In this Country, we have a federal law called the Sherman Anti-Trust Act which forbids artificial price controls that serve to raise consumer prices. For example, suppose Admin, Randy, Joe, Joshua and I own the five realestate companies serving SW Florida so we get together over coffee and decide that 6% sales commission is reasonable and we agree not to compete with one another - ladies and gentlemen, that is a crime, and I am describing a well known federal case where that is exactly what happened.

The concept is simple - market controls and predatory pricing strategies that serve to screw the consumer are unlawful.

I make good money, I own an expensive home, some expensive vehicles, and an offshore power boat; I can afford most of the things that I might want and I could afford a real Rolex if I chose to buy one. I do not. Instead, I have a pretty nice collection of counterfeits, and some gens that offer a good value that I am fond of as well.

I have probably invested somewhere between $15-20,000 USD in my collection.

I make no effort to pass my reps off as gens - quite the opposite, my friends all know they are reps, and they know that I buy reps more as a social statement than anything else.

Personally, I hope that Guangzhou Watchworks puts these arrogant Swiss bastards in the position where they have to choose between going out of business, and selling their product for what it is worth. Unless the Swiss have the political clout to get them shut down, I believe that to be inevitable.

I do have some gens. I have a box of Revue Thommens, several Ollech and Wajs including their MIII Mirage, the Seiko 5 40th Anniversary Titanium Diver, etc. - watches that sell for what they are reasonably worth on an open, competitive market.

In sum, the only reason that rep mans exist is because the gens they rep are an exercise in predatory price controls.

Just my .02

Bill

[Watchmeister]

Panerailord-

You are right that the avid rep buyer could easily buy a gen. It depends where you are coming from. Prior to coming to RWG I had only bought gens. And irrespective of cost, they all had their share of problems. AP, Breguet, Cartier, RGM, VC, etc. - they all ultimately needed service or repairs. And when they did need service or repair the authorized dealers and repair folks were pricks, overcharged and took advantage of the customer.

And I am not arguing that Reps are as good as gens. Gens are a prestige item. Reps are not. Wear you're gens proudly. But I come out where Quarks and Ubi do. If you find a watch you think you will want for the rest of you're life and can afford it, buy the gen. Otherwise enjoy buying and modding all of those reps. I know that I am prouder of, and take better care of, my modded 7753 196 and 187 then my wife with her $$$ Breguet.

[hanswurst]

Panerailord-

You are right that the avid rep buyer could easily buy a gen. It depends where you are coming from. Prior to coming to RWG I had only bought gens. And irrespective of cost, they all had their share of problems. AP, Breguet, Cartier, RGM, VC, etc. - they all ultimately needed service or repairs. And when they did need service or repair the authorized dealers and repair folks were [censored], overcharged and took advantage of the customer.

And I am not arguing that Reps are as good as gens. Gens are a prestige item. Reps are not. Wear you're gens proudly. But I come out where Quarks and Ubi do. If you find a watch you think you will want for the rest of you're life and can afford it, buy the gen. Otherwise enjoy buying and modding all of those reps. I know that I am prouder of, and take better care of, my modded 7753 196 and 187 then my wife with her $$$ Breguet.

Amen!

[fitmic]

I read all the replies, but my perspective is a little different.

Thirty years ago, I could have bought a Rolex Sub in the Navy Exchange (store for US military) for about three times the price of a Seiko diver. Now, you can no longer buy them them in the Navy Exchange, because Rolex isn't going to let anyone buy their precious $500 watch for less than $4000.

In this Country, we have a federal law called the Sherman Anti-Trust Act which forbids artificial price controls that serve to raise consumer prices. For example, suppose Admin, Randy, Joe, Joshua and I own the five realestate companies serving SW Florida so we get together over coffee and decide that 6% sales commission is reasonable and we agree not to compete with one another - ladies and gentlemen, that is a crime, and I am describing a well known federal case where that is exactly what happened.

The concept is simple - market controls and predatory pricing strategies that serve to screw the consumer are unlawful.

I make good money, I own an expensive home, some expensive vehicles, and an offshore power boat; I can afford most of the things that I might want and I could afford a real Rolex if I chose to buy one. I do not. Instead, I have a pretty nice collection of counterfeits, and some gens that offer a good value that I am fond of as well.

I have probably invested somewhere between $15-20,000 USD in my collection.

I make no effort to pass my reps off as gens - quite the opposite, my friends all know they are reps, and they know that I buy reps more as a social statement than anything else.

Personally, I hope that Guangzhou Watchworks puts these arrogant Swiss bastards in the position where they have to choose between going out of business, and selling their product for what it is worth. Unless the Swiss have the political clout to get them shut down, I believe that to be inevitable.

I do have some gens. I have a box of Revue Thommens, several Ollech and Wajs including their MIII Mirage, the Seiko 5 40th Anniversary Titanium Diver, etc. - watches that sell for what they are reasonably worth on an open, competitive market.

In sum, the only reason that rep mans exist is because the gens they rep are an exercise in predatory price controls.

Just my .02

Bill

Impressive collection!

[Pugwash]

I HAD SPENT A LOT OF MONEY TO REPLICA WATCHES

AND FINAL I DECIDE THAT DOES NOT WORTH

...but you had to buy that many reps to get to this point. It's all worth it.

[TJGladeRaider]

Impressive collection!

Just wait . . . I am going to have MORE.

BTW, since you know these gen mans must monitor these boards, would that qualify as a "[censored] slappin."

LOL

Bill

[collector21]

I read all the replies, but my perspective is a little different.

Thirty years ago, I could have bought a Rolex Sub in the Navy Exchange (store for US military) for about three times the price of a Seiko diver. Now, you can no longer buy them them in the Navy Exchange, because Rolex isn't going to let anyone buy their precious $500 watch for less than $4000.

In this Country, we have a federal law called the Sherman Anti-Trust Act which forbids artificial price controls that serve to raise consumer prices. For example, suppose Admin, Randy, Joe, Joshua and I own the five realestate companies serving SW Florida so we get together over coffee and decide that 6% sales commission is reasonable and we agree not to compete with one another - ladies and gentlemen, that is a crime, and I am describing a well known federal case where that is exactly what happened.

The concept is simple - market controls and predatory pricing strategies that serve to screw the consumer are unlawful.

I make good money, I own an expensive home, some expensive vehicles, and an offshore power boat; I can afford most of the things that I might want and I could afford a real Rolex if I chose to buy one. I do not. Instead, I have a pretty nice collection of counterfeits, and some gens that offer a good value that I am fond of as well.

I have probably invested somewhere between $15-20,000 USD in my collection.

I make no effort to pass my reps off as gens - quite the opposite, my friends all know they are reps, and they know that I buy reps more as a social statement than anything else.

Personally, I hope that Guangzhou Watchworks puts these arrogant Swiss bastards in the position where they have to choose between going out of business, and selling their product for what it is worth. Unless the Swiss have the political clout to get them shut down, I believe that to be inevitable.

I do have some gens. I have a box of Revue Thommens, several Ollech and Wajs including their MIII Mirage, the Seiko 5 40th Anniversary Titanium Diver, etc. - watches that sell for what they are reasonably worth on an open, competitive market.

In sum, the only reason that rep mans exist is because the gens they rep are an exercise in predatory price controls.

Just my .02

Bill

Well said!

[longshot]

The question for me is:

Do I just want a watch to wear, or do I want a fun hobby?

For a long time I have been into vintage Seiko dive watches. The act of finding a nice version of a particular model and then deciding to 'franken' it or to restore it to like new or to service it and do gaskets etc but to leave some 'wabi' was part of the fun. As was dealing with the experts who do the work, and the waiting, and the pleasure of getting that box back in the post and opening it up!

Then starting the whole process again with a different model

To me just having one nice gen watch is not really a hobby, rep collecting is!

Here's two examples of the same watch after the whole hobby process

[bkatbamna]

Great post. The problem with the gens is that I'm wearing a 192 that has been serviced and lumed. It's a great watch in its own right. If I wanted the gen, it would be $20,000 if I could find it.

[Drizznay]

The way I see it anyone with $4k can walk into a Rolex/Panerai/Omega etc. AD and buy a gen. There's nothing to it. When it comes to reps you really have to do your homework and up your education to make sure you are not getting screwed. It really turns into a search for knowledge as opposed to a search for the nearest AD. Besides especially with Rolex even if you have a gen many people will still ask/think that it's not real and the conversations with those people after you tell them it's a rep are much more fun than if it was gen.

My

[nonskeder]

Panerailord: Know the feeling. Having said that my reps get more wrist time than the gens that I own. The upside to reps is that you can feed the compulsive addictive side of yourself. What better self abuse than going thru the hoops of trying to figure out who has the best sub? Then there is of course the shipping, customs, and all sorts of delivery problems. And the buzz of getting the near perfect rep that has some kind of factory defect that forces you to send it off to you favorite watch guy. And while its there why not do the mod thing to it so it will be perfect (sort of). Sooooooooo you buy the watch, wait for delivery, do the mod thing and poof your into it for about a grand. But it is the near perfect rep. But it gets better. Now you need the newest and latest whizz bang edition of what ever watch you covet next.

When I bought my latest gen Rolex in the Cayman's, I thought I was done with the rep deal but Noooooooooooooooo! I had to do it again and again. I have 3 projects going on now. Two MBW's at Joes and a MBW red sub with Palpatine to turn it into a Tudor. After this Im done with it forever. No I mean it, I really do. Finished for good, this time is going to be different. Only gens from now on. But on the other hand the new Explorer 1 and vintage model of the same are pretty nice. NO NO NO I cant. This is all a bad dream, I know I will wake up soon.

[Richard Tracy]

This is a great subject...and as usual, brings out some of the most eloquent writers that we have..

TJGladeRaider,.. yours in an instant classic

I would like to add that I think this issue boils down to a persons expectations, and fortitude.

If you expect these watches to live up to genuine then you will disapointed,...at which point

you either quit, or fall into the mindset of those that continue to purchase from time to time

but will tell another that reps are toys,.. crappy toys at that...these latter half, I at times, wish

would quit the boards,..as they tend to bring down our hobby, with their negative vibes.

If however you possess the mindset of a creative problem solver that will not quit,.. then these watches

become a portal into a whole new world of design, mixed with watchsmithing of the highest degree..

Some use others to do the hands on work, which can be expensive, but to them worth it when

compared to the price of genuine.. others start from small steps and progress to learn how to do

just about everything themselves...which is a very satisfying experience to say the least and bridges

a connection with your watch, and your self confidence that cannot be purchased, at any cost.

[TJGladeRaider]

This is a great subject...and as usual, brings out some of the most eloquent writers that we have..

TJGladeRaider,.. yours in an instant classic

Thank you.

To me, this whole issue is a curious dynamic because it is one of the few legal/moral issues I ever encountered that I found difficult to resolve.

I think Guangzhou Watchworks has done the world a great favor, by demonstrating that "The Emporer Has No Clothes." Were it not for the fact that they produce a Pam with the same specs and same movement as the gens, Panerai might well be able to persuade people that there was an inherent value in their product that simply isn't there.

I most definitely do not agree with the notion of counterfeiting via theft, or based upon cheap labor, or as a way to perpetrate fraud. To steal a digital master tape and then sell copies is theft, making Reeboks cheap by using kids in sweatshops is no more a "fair competition" than what the Swiss do, and passing off a fake as genuine to an innocent buyer is fraud.

This, to me, is a far different thing.

Bill

[shultz]

I never went for reps until summer last year. I am collecting watches for 17 (seventeen) years. All watches are vintage chronograps in a damn nice shape. But when I took a look to some reps last summer and followed all improvements and furthermore the discussions on TRC and RWG I decided to buy my first rep which was a pannie. Folks, I was that impressed by the quality and the low prices and currently my rep collection includes 9 items, all fully modded by myself and for reluming work by the gurus. I guess a gen pannie (e.g.) isn't worth the money especially if you want to own more than one or two watches. But there is one rule (it is just my own ): I am just looking for really high grade reps which are nice basics for modds. It means: The right mvt. (e.g. 2893-2 or 7753), sapphire crystals, solid gold parts for the TT models and a lot more. Of course I am still liking my gen babies but hunting for the nicest rep and modding it to perfect while I know the gen costs about 1'000% more keeps me smiling

Just my 2 pence

[Watchmeister]

TJ and Schulz have said it all. Now, Panerailord - get back on that horse. By the way, if it makes you feel better if I took what I spent on reps in the last 14 months and bought gens I would now own a 187 and 111 or a 196, 183 and 118 or a ... But where is the fun in that.

[infinitime]

I HAD SPENT A LOT OF MONEY TO REPLICA WATCHES

AND FINAL I DECIDE THAT DOES NOT WORTH

from now i buy genuine

for exaple

if you 5 expensive replicas with reluminer ar-coating bla bla bla bla

you have spent at least 3500 euro or 4000$

with that money you will buy 1 panerai 24 submersible

or panerai 25 or any used panerai

and you wear a genuine piece and not a replica!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

what do you think?

True to a certain extent...but I think I would have more difficulties justifying spending $4000 on a genuine item, when you consider that the quality is not THAT much better, and in many case, almost on par with the rep w/ at least 90% of the parts. There is a replica industry because genuine manufacturers over-inflate their prices.

[stenofsweden]

A wise friend of mine once said that collecting reps is like masturbating…. The trill is to seek, searching, reading, thinking and finding that perfect piece, but the day after you receive it, you feel empty inside!

Then it all starts over again…