Review of ROLEX Submariner WM9 v1, the "Super Sub"

[By-Tor]

Now I hear you all screming: "Oh my God, not another Submariner review by By-Tor! Please no more!"

Well, to my defense I have to say that it's been a while. I thought I'd never buy one again, but... like the old mafia saying goes: I tried to quit, but they keep dragging me in! And besides owning countless of rep Subs in the past, I didn't have one in my collection anymore. At the end of the day none of the previous models satisfied me. I actually prefer the GMT II and Explorer II over the Sub, but you can't deny the attractiveness of the Legend.

It was actually Ublquitous' amazing pictorial of his WM9 that finally convinced me to buy this rep. Of course mine isn't that nice (as Ubi has performed many hardcore modifications), but if this rep is good enough for "Mr. Perfection", it's definitely good enough for me. Ubi's WM9 was also the only rep Submariner that our membership (who detect reps and gens almost for living) couldn't "call out". Tells you something about the potential of this amazing forgery! I'm sure it's reps like this that Montres Rolex S.A. wouldn't want to see.

Another Rolex man of ours, Stephane, also built a "Super Sub" of his WM9. Another veteran of many gen Rolexes, Watcher, chose the WM9 too, so it's quite safe to say that this particular rep model is the "Choice of the HC guys".

This is not going to be an excessive review, because there has been so many writeups of these watches. And I couldn't compete with sd4k and Toadtorrent's amazing "mini novels" anyway. "Brief and striking" has always been my attempted style.

HISTORY OF THE "WATCHMAKER9 SUB":

I have owned/reviewed every single important Sub model (except for the new Euromariner) over the years.

About a year ago we saw the first pictures of the "WM9 Submariner". The release of this model caused a small sensation in the community. It was hands down the best Sub we had ever seen. Some people didn't like the idea of an off-site dealer offering something that our "star dealers" couldn't source. Well, it really took surprisingly long for our dealers to source this watch, but now it's here! The cost is very reasonable, at least compared to George's (WM9) greasy prices.

It is largely speculated that this replica is the "sequel" to the old, legendary TW Best/MBW model, which was in production for over a decade. At least that familiar (ugly) green sticker and solid midlink bracelet are similar. The reason our dealers couldn't source this earlier might have something to do with the departure of Eddie Lee and River, who were the main sources for the "TW models" in the old days.

Our superb EU-based dealers, Precious Time and Eurotimez, were both able to source the "WM9" already, but I wanted my watch without the engravings. I simply hate them, it's yet another new Rolex design "innovation" which just plain sucks. And besides, the engravings look less than stellar on both of the current "top Subs", WM9 and Euromariner. They're are also the weakest link on the otherwise "almost perfect" Ultimate GMT IIc.

I requested Precious Time to encourage the factory to make this model without the engravings, and here it is, available again! Actually I convinced him that he will sell all the 30 pieces he gets. I'm 100% he does. I'll hereby promise to buy one of those weird looking Panerai watches if he doesn't! Seriously, there's no guarantee that the production of the non-engraved version is going to continue, so grab yours now!

WHY DID I CHOOSE THE WM9 INSTED OF "EUROMARINER"?

Simple: The crystal and crown are better on the WM9. The rehaut appearance and thickness (from front and side) is unmatched on the WM9, which is important to me. It's the only "otb" Rolex rep which looks absolutely sensational from this angle. I have explained more about this "look" in my other Rolex reviews so I don't want to go there again. Short: It's the "metallic" and smooth appearance, and the "dent" right below the crystal. Here you can see the WM9 compared to my genuine GMT Master II. Rehaut depth is slightly deeper on WM9 than my gen GMT (like it should), and it's perfect. Notice the red marked area. That shows the cylindrical "bevel" below the crystal. Notice also the amazing SELs on the WM9.

Euromariner utilizes the perfect Noobmariner dial, which the WM9 can't quite compete against, but then again I prefer the "flat S" for some weird reason. This is not to say that the WM9 dial isn't good, it definitely is... but the Noob dial could be the best Rolex dial that factories have ever produced. Euromariner also has excellent hollow link bracelet, and the links are solid on the WM9. Tribal has modified his Euromariner to almost perfect condition. After exchanging the crystal on the "Euro", the rehaut thickness and correct bevel seem to be there. So looks like the whole "rehaut thickness" thing is mainly a crystal/gasket issue.

Here's the WM9 dial, which is very respectable. The only real issue is the oversized crown etching on the crystal, which these large pictures (of course) exaggerate.

STATS:

Pluses and minuses on WM9 and Euromariner:

(Both watches have excellent, well fitting SELs and gen-like bezel constructions. The crown guards on both watches need just very minor work. Mine has already been done (in the pictures)).

WM9:

+ Best rehaut thickness & crystal "bevel" appearance of any Rolex replicas, ever. Without any modifications.

+ Almost perfect crown.

+ "Flat S" for the geeks that prefer it.

- Solid link bracelet.

- Very good dial, but can't quite match the Noob/Euro.

- Not a great pearl.

- Not necessarily available without the engravings, long term.

- Oversized etched crown on the crystal.

Euromariner:

+ Perfect dial.

+ Hollow link bracelet.

+ Available with and without lugholes.

+ Available continuously without the engravings (confirmed).

+ After crystal/gasket exchange the rehaut thickness looks as good as WM9.

- Worse crown.

- Worse rehaut thickness and the cylindrical crystal/rehaut appearance (without crystal/gasket exchange).

MY PERSONAL IMPRESSIONS:

Like I said, none of the previous models fully satisfied me. Noobmariner suffered from the short rehaut, "matte" crystal and that gigantic, ridiculous "Jumbo" crown. The old TW Best model had awful SELs, bad dial and numerous other inaccuracies. MBK had bad rehaut thickness, too deep rehaut, bad dial, way oversized date magnification and very high price.

The WM9 is quite pricey for a ETA Sub, in the $335 range... but for what it offers it's a genuine bargain (by today's price standards). This is the very first otb replica Sub that really feels like the gen. That's something that even the pictures can't quite capture. WM9 is light years better than the MBW and old TW models, and a slight improvement over the classic Noobmariner (which I still consider very good replica).

If you forget the solid bracelet, it's just as good as "otb" as the Noobfactory black Explorer II (which I personally consider the best ever modern Rolex replica). I love the WM9, and since the basic appearance is so good, it's a perfect base for mods. I doubt I'll do many mods though. Things like the etched crown and solid link bracelet don't really bother me.

WHO HAS THE BEST SUB?

Just like in the old days, when we had the CN vs. TW Best, and later Noobmariner vs. MBW debates, we now have the WM9 and Euromariner debates. There is no definite answer, both have their strong points... but now the quality has taken yet another leap towards visual perfection. Both watches are extremely close "otb", and both can be modified to almost perfect visual condition. Impossible to say which is the better one (when all possible modifications have been performed).

The link to Tribal's pictorial indicates that Euromariner might be the better (and cheaper) alternative for the "builders". I chose the WM9 because I don't really feel like doing any mods (besides very basic ones like cg's). Also, the crown and rehaut thickness/crystal bevel appearance is very important to me. Well, just pick your favorite, both products are excellent. This time we can say: First choose your Sub, then choose your dealer.

CLICK HERE FOR WM9 WALLPAPER

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[HauteHippie]

By-Tor the WM9 is a keeper... Did I recently read that they're out of production too? Those SELs alone make my old school TW best look inadequate with it's noob bracelet.

[pfran42]

Great review. I thought you had purchased a Euromariner at some point? It would be interesting to see these two watches compared (with pictures of both) in the same review vs. gen.

One thing I did not see addressed is the date magnification. There were several intensive threads re: the cyclops strength vs. date wheel font size vs, distance of cyclops from date wheel. Is this as good as gen on the "WM9"? Chris at Eurotimez put a lot of effort into getting it just right in the Euromariner. Would you say that the Euromariner and the "WM9" are exactly alike in this regard?

So let me get this right, in order to build the perfect "WM9", all you need to do is:

1. Shave the CGs a little

2. Replace the pearl

3. Source a Noob bracelet

Will a Noob dial fit in this watch...anyone tried it yet?

[Stephane]

Another very usefull review By-Tor.

Maybe some will find there are too many subs reviews, but your opinion is an absolute reference for our community.

So thanks for putting this one toghether for us.

I can't speak for the Euro but the WM9 is a keeper for sure.

Cheers

Stephane

[b16a2]

Great review By-tor. It's going to be very difficult choosing between this and the Euromariner!

[Cats]

Great review thanks By-Tor.

Still it's a difficult decission which one to choose.

There is a difference of 140 dollars between the WM9 from PT and the Euromariner from Chris. ( for a dail and braclet )

By the way what is the lume quality on the WM9 form PT.

Carpe Diem

Cats

[elprimerozen]

One more ...of the best review....!! Thanks!

[Tribal]

Great review as allways

Its really a damn good Sub

I love it

As I can see on your Pics the CG's looks the same as on the Euro

little bit too long and slightly wrong shape

so I believe its the same base Case

Here is mine

Gen Crystal ,Gen Date wheel, Gen Insert, shaved CG's, Noob Dial and Bracelet

So next step is a better SD

[its_urabus]

great great review. thank you for all your hard work. Your comment on the rehaut is interesting. I also feel that crystal cut effects rehaut perception.I believe it is why the ssd rehaut looks so off.

For me, I want lug holes. but I do love the flat S. If you ever want to trade, I have a noob dial I would consider swapping with ya ...

Great watch, great review, and a great member.

[jamesg]

Great review BT. Thank you.

And yes, we need lug holes!

[ubiquitous]

Great review as always! Quick to get down to business and nice and concise! The classic BT style!

It's amazing that it's taken this long to get a Submariner rep of this quality. Only 2 decades into the genuine 16610's production run to get it right...

At any rate... I love mine! It now has a permanent home in my collection...

[flyskate]

Very good reveiw! This is exactly why I came to this forum. As someone that lacks the skill to do any mods, it was important for me to get the best otb sub available. Both the Euromariner and PT's RLX Submariner 2008 Supreme Edition 1:1 (WM9)?, I assume that this is the watch you reveiwed, were as good as it gets for otb reps at this time. Your reveiw has tipped the scale for me, as I don't intend on doing any modding to this watch........ at least for now!

Thanks again for a great reveiw,

Fly

[MAHLER]

Thanks By-Tor, I'm waiting for my toy from PT

[triplehd]

Awesome review and great pics BT. Your reviews are second to none and always a great read.

I went ahead and ordered PT's Ultimate Sub. However, last week, he did inform me that he did receive some Subs withOUT the engravings, so I asked if I could switch. He said no problem and now I wait for my new baby to arrive.

Can't wait !!!!

[By-Tor]

Great review as allways

Its really a damn good Sub

I love it

As I can see on your Pics the CG's looks the same as on the Euro

little bit too long and slightly wrong shape

so I believe its the same base Case

Thanks Tribal. Yeah, the cg's are similar, but some people say it's the same case, some swear that it isn't. I have to say I'm a bit confused here.

Just as I wrote, if it's the same case it's the crystal and gasket that are definitely different. Your watch has excellent "front appearance", but the default Euromariner doesn't. The "thickness" isn't there.

The WM9 looks absolutely perfect in this regard (when I put it next to my gen).

PS: Thanks all. Much appreciated. It takes a lot of effort to put these together, and a response like this from the members is the best reward. I always want to make my writeups "easy to access" and as useful as possible.

[JohnCraig]

Thanks BT, I have spent more time reading your posts than any other on this forum for good reason - always excellent.

This one ruined my pledge to never buy a sub rep.

JW

[By-Tor]

great great review. thank you for all your hard work. Your comment on the rehaut is interesting. I also feel that crystal cut effects rehaut perception.I believe it is why the ssd rehaut looks so off.

Thanks man.

Yes, that's what I've been saying all along. The "front appearance" ruins the SSD completely... it looks nothing like the gen. I'm always amazed that many members are so worried about things like pearl and crystal height over this. The rehaut/crystal thickness is an essential Rolex feature, and it's similar on all sports Rolexes (except for the Sea Dweller where the "cylindrical appearance" is even thicker and more apparent).

On the SSD case, it's not just a crystal issue. The whole rehaut is screwed up. It's WAY too deep and has completely wrong shape. It's very, very obvious. This has never gotten the attention it deserves, although it's probably the single most important thing to get right (at least for me). The "Noob" watches (GMTII, ExpII, Noobmariner, GMTIIc and Daytona) are very good in this regard, but even they have a bit too "matte" crystal gasket.

Like I said, the WM9 is the very first Rolex rep that got this done "spot on".

[Tribal]

Thanks Tribal. Yeah, the cg's are similar, but some people say it's the same case, some swear that it isn't. I have to say I'm a bit confused here.

Just as I wrote, if it's the same case it's the crystal and gasket that are definitely different. Your watch has excellent "front appearance", but the default Euromariner doesn't. The "thickness" isn't there.

The WM9 looks absolutely perfect in this regard (when I put it next to my gen).

PS: Thanks all. Much appreciated. It takes a lot of effort to put these together, and a response like this from the members is the best reward. I always want to make my writeups "easy to access" and as useful as possible.

You are right about the crystal,

because factory put the same crystal on it as on older

Mbk Subs.

Chris replace them now to right Crystal and Gasket so

this issue is solved in the future.

When you look at mine now with the new Crystal it looks identical to Gen.

So the issue is only by the crystal and gasket not by the Case.

[vizsladog]

You are right about the crystal,

because factory put the same crystal on it as on older

Mbk Subs.

Chris replace them now to right Crystal and Gasket so

this issue is solved in the future.

When you look at mine now with the new Crystal it looks identical to Gen.

So the issue is only by the crystal and gasket not by the Case.

I'm not looking to mod mine, and the look is what im conserned about (depth ect.) so i guess i should go ahead and order a non engraved one From PT.

Thanks for your info.

[dluddy]

Great review, as always BT.

Finally a good explaination of the difference between the Euromariner and the WM9 that I actually understood

[liquid-air888]

I received my supreme sub from PT just yesterday

Being somewhat of a noob (compared to many of the veterans in this forum), the one thing that strikes me was how "wide" were the strip markers (5, 15, 25 and so forth) on the bezel insert compared to other bezel inserts on other reps. I placed a watchmaterial bezel insert right next to the Supreme Ed sub to compare and the width difference is quite apparent.

So I went on the Bay to compare photos of the gen version. From the photos, it seems the strip markers on the "M" model are in fact wider than the previous models.

Is this true or are my eyes just playing tricks on me?

Thanks.

[triplehd]

Hmmm not too sure about the markers, but here's a pic of a gen sub that has thicker markers on the insert

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm...-Submariner.jpg

[emuozz]

Great review, as always. Since I

[triplehd]

BTW - did I mention that......

MY ULTIMATE SUB FROM PT JUST GOT DELIVERED

Sized up the bracelet and slapped it on. Already thinking of mods - maybe gen crown & tube, CGs, WM Pearl. Im not too worried about the dial not being 100% the same as the noob dial, but good enough. Unless the etching gets to me, I'll grab a Clarks crystal.

Happy Happy Joy Joy

[red]

not a sub fan, but this review has me thinking. thanks bt.