alligoat

Of course they are- it just upsets TTK because he was the first out w/ the noob and coined the name, so he thinks it's his exclusively. Exclusive naming rights to a counterfeit watch- that's a good one. But these watches all come from the same factory in China, whether with an asian 21j, eta copy or a true eta movement. We could call it the F520117, but that would be confusing, because the same case is also used for the Yachtmaster and now according to L-dizzle, the Daytona at 6 uses the same (modified with pushers added) case. And we do see some variations from batch to batch on this watch. Like the "zit" pearl and the thick date font on some Beginmariners. Production isn't static in China- things change from time to time.

I refer to a noobmariner as any watch with the F520117 case serial number. This may upset TTK, but most all of the other dealers carry it, so that's reality for you. Here's Andrew's w/ asian 21j (no pic of the movement): http://www.trustytime88.com/index.php?main...products_id=257 River has what I think is a great deal- the noob case w/ the asian eta copy movement for around $120. I've owned four noobs and this is my current go to sub- I put a gen crown and aftermarket tube on it, a watchmaterial pearl which got busted out on a hunting trip and trimmed the cg's. A great WR beater w/ a Raymond Lee pearl now! http://s22.photobucket.com/albums/b327/riv...TA%20Submarine/ And if it's endorsed by ByTor, enuff said!

freddy, you might want to check justasgood's post about the new case he's looking at for his 5512 and Rolex movement. He had quite a few problems fitting the 1570 into the MBW 5513 case, shimming, breaking crowns... But it might be the fact that it's a different movement, I think (no date). I don't know how easy it is to fit a 1575 into an MBW DRSD case. The last one I remember was torresp's w/ a J&W case. I do recall a few mods to the case are necessary if you're using an MBW case. The dial looks nice but I wouldn't hesitate to cut the feet and put it in the MBW case w/ the 2846. Unless you're on a mission to create a franken. Heck, it's only money!

Lonnie's right, a movement pic would be nice. But this watch is also $10K overpriced. If you check Antiquorum, you'll see that these watches are running $30-40K. But I guess someday it'll be worth $50K- in a year or three.

Of course, 280, 380 and 580 are correct for the 1665, with the 580's being the last (585 was used on GW 1665's). I think the 455B's will fit, I have them on my WM1680, and my frankenjust w/ old style oyster band w/ the safety clasp. It's tough to find the correct 580 end pieces w/o the little cut-out notches on each side. I've got a couple of hollow mid-link bands w/ 580 end pieces- but they have the notches. I'd love to find the correct 580 -no notches- end pieces- short of buying gen.

Here's a sub from Josh for $358. I don't know if this is the TW/MBW case or not. Date window does not appear to be too far right, as is the problem with his $218 'Classic'. http://www.pc-80108.com/rlss10005-perfect-...362-p-3439.html Also, when you can get them, doesn't TTK sell the MBW modern sub for $350? Of course getting one is a challenge in and of itself!

Can't tell you about the 8mm Rolex and Tudor Brevet crowns- all I have to go by is the Daytona book and it's crown table from 1970. Sounds to me like you need a vintage Rolex watchmaker. Good luck!

This is Josh's 'classic' LV sub, good rehaut, but the date window is too far to the right, case #D320640 And although I like the noob, the rehaut is slightly shallow in addition to the bulbous crown and not so great pearl. I was very impressed w/ the SSD that my nephew got. Now I just wish he'd let me take it apart, and play with it. I'd really like to check out the crown and tube assembly- they may be a copy of the gen assembly- the crown matches up w/ my gen crown and the tube is thicker like the gen tube. overall, I think it's a very nice watch

http://www.jewelryandwatch.com/ This is Phong out in Arizona- the Vietnamese connection, so to speak. So I guess the next question would be, if this isn't a J&W case, where did it come from?

I'm with Pug on this, THE DOLLAR SUCKS. But I also think that the quality of reps is improving, like the SSD. And thanks to TTK, the cost of MBW's/MBK's is coming down. So, all in all, things aren't that bad.

That case is the noob- F520117 SN. A good watch, especially w/ the eta- crown's too big, but stay tuned, bklm1234 may have a new rep crown which is the correct size and fits the rep case tube- could be an easy swap. BTW, what is RLSS10003?

So I guess this is a Jewelry and Watch case. If you're going to go to the trouble of putting a 1560 in there, a J&W case certainly makes sense- especially in light of the problems you had w/ the MBW case. It's a very nice watch and you've certainly gone to the highest level- a true franken! Congratulations.

The case back stampings look ok to me. Comparing the bezel teeth to my gen 1680, the teeth are cut too far thru to the bezel insert on your 5512. They look softer which is ok. My gen bezel teeth and my WM 1680 both have smooth and well worn bezel teeth which only go 1/2 way into the bezel itself, like your 5513, only softer. But looking at Skeet and Urul- Vintage Rolex Sports Models- most of the bezel teeth appear to be cut thru to the bezel insert- but their pics are those damn computer retouched photos. From the back, your 5513 looks like the case got wallowed out on the back side when you installed your gen tube- that happened to me on my noob!

Haven't you guys heard of the Super Sea-Dweller yet? Better do a search for it. As far as Subs go, well, try looking for the noobmariner. While you're at it, maybe you could donate some money and that will give you access to the collectors section where you can find all of these little goodies. And by all means, keep reading- there's months of watch knowledge here. Welcome aboard.

The crown guards are the biggest drawback. The insides are ok, but the thickness on each side is too much- just like the MBW. Also the top and bottom taper (slope) from the case out to the front of the guards is all wrong. It could be rounded over w/ a file and polished and it would look better. On the bottom of a gen case there is no taper on the bottom of the crown guards, they're relatively flat. Removing metal from the outside of the guards to thin them up would also help- I think Pug did this on his MBW. But heck, you got a 1560 movt in there, that's an accomplishment in itself.

In the book 'Rolex Daytona, a legend is born', a technical chart from 1970 refers to the 8mm crown with 110 Rolex thread size and 120 Tudor thread size. The Rolex crown is part # 22 and the Tudor crown is part# 24. Both are referred to as Twinlock. The corresponding tube was No 207- same for both. From this, you would assume that the thread for the stem would be 110, since Tudor would be an early eta movement at that time. Now the inside threads on your crown could be stripped out. This happened to me on my 1680 (1978) and I had to go with the update from the original 24-702 crown to the current 24-703 crown. The stem was ok and the watchmaker didn't have to replace it. Finding a stem for a 1030 movt- WOW, where do you start? Good luck.

As freddy says, the current 7mm crown for a Rolex sub- or SD for that matter. is the 24-703-0. The tube is PN 24-7030-0. The last 0 denotes SS. Earlier crowns, 700, 701 and 702 are not compatible w/ the 703, or the 703 tube. When Rolex services a DRSD (if they still would), they would undoubtably install a 24-703 crown and tube assembly. Older style tubes are about impossible to come by these days. Here's a Rolex crown from Mark Greenberg- moelarrycu in NYC http://cgi.ebay.com/SS-Rolex-Submariner-Se...1QQcmdZViewItem item # 22019253564 on ebay. Pricey, no doubt. He also has gen case tubes for around $46 or so. These from suissetime may or may not be 24-703-0 crowns- you have to ask: http://cgi.ebay.com/ROLEX-SUBMARINER-CROWN...1QQcmdZViewItem item # 230212466772 if the link doesn't work Here's an aftermarket tube from Clark's- these work, but are delicate- first you have to retap the case tube hole all the way, maybe countersink the case and finally install the tube carefully so as not to snap it off. Tools from ofrei will run close to $100 to do it correctly http://cgi.ebay.com/Case-tube-Ref-24-7030-...1QQcmdZViewItem item # 300165713453 if the link doesn't work. Putting a gen crown and tube (or aftermarket tube) in isn't cheap and it's not a task for the novice, but it improves the looks and function of the watch immensely.

That crown is NOT a 7mm crown- neither one, see the line under the Rolex crown in the second picture- that's a 6mm crown- stay away! Of course, it's not a bad price for a 6mm crown at this point- just wrong for a sub.

Jewelry and Watch uses the Valjoux 72 movement. This is a tri-compax movement, the same as used in the original Rolex vintage Daytonas. All three subdials are functional.

Nice to see that ebay pulled the auction.They're kinda slow sometimes.

New crystal?? That's not necessarily an easy deal- do you buy a gen, or a rep crystal? Need the gasket also. I hadn't heard about a WM9 needing a new crystal. The other stuff is standard. Noob bracelet, I don't know of anyone who sells them separately, guess you could buy a Noob or a Beginmariner and use the bracelet.

A couple of things here: Vintage Daytonas were a manual wind watch, not automatic. Original movements were the Valjoux 72 and its variants (i.e. improved movts like the 722 and 727). Case size was 37mm. If you want a vintage Daytona w/ an auto movt (the asain 7750), and 39-40mm case, just buy one from one of the collectors listed on this site. DW is David Wang and he has the correct 37mm cases with the assymetrical pushers. To build a vintage Daytona w/ DW case, dial, etc and a V72 will cost you around $2K, maybe more. Oh and I forgot, he used to sell a vintage Daytona w/ the asian 7750. Never checked the price on that one- maybe around $500.

The correct tube for the 703 triplock crown is 24-7030-0. The 6mm tube is for the Datejust 6mm crown. You can find aftermarket tubes at Clark Watch supply and Helfands, moelarrycu- Mark Greenberg sells the gen tubes on ebay for around $46. Here's Clark's tube- delicate but good: http://cgi.ebay.com/Case-tube-Ref-24-7030-...1QQcmdZViewItem Item # 300165713453 on ebay Delicate because you have to tap the hole all the way and install it carefully, or you'll snap it off.

Typical deal- crown guards are wrong, date mag looks like 2.0x, hologram is wrong- there still is no model 116613. Even the new SN M series subs- 2008- with the engraved rehaut are still only a 16610 model. Of course I reported, it'll be interesting to see if ebay acts. The guy did try to cover himself somewhat with the disclaimers

The price you paid is fair. I tried to buy a 16800 at $3250US and lost out last week at the last minute. I always figure a Rolex service when I'm buying a used Rolex- around $200. That watch isn't that old, so it should just be a simple service. Just look at it as an investment- in 5 years it will be worth a lot more- of course, the US dollar will also be worth a lot less! Nice watch, enjoy!