alt.watch.obsessive

Just kidding with the title of course, but this does read as if posted by one of us. http://cgi.ebay.com/Genuine-Rolex-Black-Di...1QQcmdZViewItem Why would this seller give away all the secrets? Surely his item would be worth more if the uninformed thought it was beyond their abilities to put something like this together. Of course, good luck fitting the 2836 in a 16200 case!

Nice! The bezel insert cracks on all of them apparently. BTW, over $1200 on the fake already. Cheers.

Yes, I too have a genuine dial that fits a 28xx series eta. It will be going in something sooner or later

Asked and answered! Thanks for the info. It is unfortunate these are being sold as genuine.

The AS has fairly crappy finish...I'm under the impression that the movement is correct (or at least very close).

This auction is for a fake fifty fathoms: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...A:IT&ih=014. Does anyone know where these are comming from? Most of the sellers seem to be German or Swiss. The last one went for over $1200. It is not (as far as I can tell) using an MK II case. Nor is it franken (nothing original). I'd like one if we could get an honest price. p.s. In case the link fails, it's item: 330186333720

I have the watch in hand. It's nice. The CGs are a problem since they are SO tight to the crown. When you file them, it's hard (impossible?) to get the midpoint of the CG away from the crown without the CG becomming too thin. That's my major beef. Pearl is not as bad as photos, but needs replacing. Rehaut does not look exact by any means, but the bevel on the glass makes it hard to see what's going on in that area, so I wouldn't worry about it. Springbars on mine do need just a bit of a bend to hit the holes, which I don't like. The crown tube is GLUED in there! I would say this is a step up from the noob for sure. Next purchase will have to have the CGs exact from the factory.

I think there would be a market. Is the subdial spacing correct? I assume the "jog" for the assymetric pusher is in the case somehow?

Thanks Stilty. Let's hear from others. BTW, our wholesaleoutlet friend has aftermarket hands--listed for eta 2671 rather than "Tudor." I'm currently compiling a bunch of really cheap parts (dented and damaged) to get them in my hands to make measurements re. the stem position. Cheers.

Hi all, I was hoping we might be able to compile some resources about frankenwatches for women. The most obvious solution seems to be to fit a Rolex dial to a Tudor Princess, which can be had fairly economically. However, let's assume we want to do this from the ground up. It looks to me as if the sizes for the womens watches are fairly standard. I just acquired a beat up 6917 26mm case as a starting point. It also looks as if the date/datejust/no date dials are all the same size--roughly 20mm--although I'm not entirely sure about the no date. I would like to fit an ETA 2671 automatic movement, which should be what is in the Tudor watches (along with 2651's and maybe others). I have no idea if a spacer is required...I checked the day-date version of the ETA (2678 as I recall) and it did not appear to have an enlargement ring available ...so one may have to be built. I assume the case can fit an ETA based on the Tudors. Finally, the sticking points: (1) I do not know what the date window situation is...same as ETA? (2) Does anyone know a source for the hands. The ETA takes 70/120/20. It does not seem like Tudor hands are as freely available as for the men's watch. Waiting eagerly

Looking at the CGs I think that's the new ultimate seadweller from Angus. 1 to 1

The first pic has nice thin dial print. If that's real, I feel better!

The gen bezel I believe is slightly more "outward sloping teeth" area than whatever you would call the inward sloping area when you look at it from the side. That looks reasonably accurate. If the rehaut is not too "wokky" I'm certainly game. BTW, review King's pictures on the first page of this topic carefully. The top of the bezel is in shadow, which exaggerates the lighted portion--i.e. the inward sloping portion. Miss the lugholes though

I'd give it a full wind before reaching any conclusions.

Famous primarily for Camaros with "Foxy" bumper stickers no less!

If you do get a really good spacer, I'm sure you could sell them on Ebay for a good sum. You might want to make a run. I know I'd buy one. I think Stilty mentioned doing this for the 2892.

Hi Freddy, I was just reading your several month long Newman/DW/V72 saga and I think we're ALL a bit nuts. Someone should respond to the guy and say that the watch is a bit "small and feminine." That'll really set him off. Cheers.

Is it really 7750 based? And $25,000? Must be quite heavily modified. It's actually cool looking I suppose...just think it's funny to imagine an F1 driver trying to use an all black watch while driving. But hey, it's got the split seconds and he has a whole lap to peak down and try to figure out what it says.

Very nice. Thanks!

Unfortunately, those pictures appear to be somewhat under-exposed. It almost looks like a watch with a black face, black hands, black markers, and a black signature.

Thanks! Apologies for hijacking the thread.

I got it thrown in with a MBW I bought from a member. To be clear, mine looks like it wants to be peeled apart--but I want to confirm that this is in fact a backing that I'm supposed to remove. Thanks again. Steve.

Hey Freddy, While you're here--I recently acquired a Watchmeister overlay which I know nothing about. If it's a sticker, I assume I remove the backing? I didn't want to try before knowing what I'm dealing with. Thanks, Steve.

"@The Zigmeister What happened to you and Joe? You were friends at one time. Something tells me this discord goes deeper than your strong feelings toward protecting the good people of this forum. And that is an outside observation, I really do respect you and your knowledge and the work you do for people." That's the problem Sean, it doesn't. Overpriced work, often poor quality, usually dreadfully slow. If you can't spot "he tells me they're genuine" as the equivalent of "received this as a present" on Ebay, you're not paying attention. Plus I love the water test as he described it, dunk it in a garbage can (RWG1 days). A rolex case without gaskets would pass that just fine. It's a jar for f sake. Anyhow, old news. Anybody want to talk about Jetmid?

INVISIBLE HAND How Top Watchmakers Intervene in Auctions Luxury Timepieces Get Pumped Up in Bidding; 'It's a Bit Dangerous' By STACY MEICHTRY October 8, 2007; Page A1 GENEVA -- In the rarefied world of watch collecting, where Wall Street investment bankers and Asian millionaires buy and sell at auctions, a timepiece can command a higher price than a luxury car. At an April event here, a 1950s Omega platinum watch sold for $351,000, a price that conferred a new peak of prestige on a brand known for mass-produced timepieces. Watch magazines and retailers hailed the sale, at an auction in the lush Mandarin Oriental Hotel on the River Rhone. Omega trumpeted it, announcing that a "Swiss bidder" had offered "the highest price ever paid for an Omega watch at auction." What Omega did not say: The buyer was Omega itself. Auctioneer Osvaldo Patrizzi, president and co-founder of Antiquorum, left, and Stephen Urquhart, president of Omega, at the Omegamania auction in Geneva on April 15. Demand and prices for expensive watches have been surging, fed by global economic growth. But there's another factor behind the prices: an alliance between watchmakers and a Geneva auction house called Antiquorum Auctioneers. Antiquorum sometimes stages auctions for a single brand, joining with the watchmakers to organize them, in events at which the makers often bid anonymously. This is a technique of which Patek Philippe and other famous brands, as well, have availed themselves. "It's an entirely different approach to promoting a brand," says the cofounder of Antiquorum, Osvaldo Patrizzi, "Auctions are much stronger than advertising." Mr. Patrizzi worked with Omega executives for two years on the auction, publishing a 600-page glossy catalog and throwing a fancy party in Los Angeles to promote the event. "We are collaborators," he says. But now there's ferment in the world of watch auctions. First, they're starting to raise ethical questions, even within the industry. "A lot of the public doesn't know that the biggest records have been made by the companies themselves," says Georges-Henri Meylan, chief executive of Audemars Piguet SA, a high-end Swiss watchmaker. "It's a bit dangerous." More unsettling, Antiquorum's Mr. Patrizzi, who essentially founded the business of watch auctions, is under fire by the house he cofounded. Its board ousted Mr. Patrizzi as chairman and chief executive two months ago -- and hired auditors to scour the books. The business of auctions for collectibles is not a model of transparency. The identities of most bidders are known only to the auction houses. Sellers commonly have a "reserve," or minimum, price, and when the bidding is below that, the auctioneer often will bid anonymously on the seller's behalf. However, the most established houses, such as Christie's International PLC, announce when the seller of an item keeps bidding on it after the reserve price has been reached. Omega Omega's president, Stephen Urquhart, says the company is not hiding the fact that Omega anonymously bid and bought at an auction. He says Omega bought the watches so it could put them in its museum in Bienne, Switzerland. "We didn't bid for the watches just to bid. We bid because we really wanted them," he says. Omega's parent, Swatch Group Ltd., declined to comment. Through the auctions, Swiss watchmakers have found a solution to a challenge shared by makers of luxury products from jewelry to fashion: getting their wares perceived as things of extraordinary value, worth an out-of-the-ordinary price. When an Omega watch can be sold decades later for more than its original price, shoppers for new ones will be readier to pay up. "If you can get a really good auction price, it gives the illusion that this might be a good buy," says Al Armstrong, a watch and jewelry retailer in Hartford, Conn. Niche watchmakers have used the auction market for years to raise their profiles and prices, mainly among collectors. As mainstream brands like Omega embrace auctions, increasing numbers of consumers are affected by the higher prices. Omega and Antiquorum got together at the end of 2004. The watchmaker was struggling to restore its cachet. Omega once equaled Rolex as a brand with appeal to both collectors and consumers, but in the 1980s, Omega sought to compete with cheap Asian-made electronic quartz watches by making quartz timepieces itself. Omega closed most of its production of the fine mechanical watches for which Switzerland was famed, tarnishing its image. A decade later, Omega tried to revive its luster by reintroducing high-end mechanical models. It raised prices and signed on model Cindy Crawford and Formula 1 driver Michael Schumacher for ads. When this gambit failed to lure the biggest spenders, Omega turned to a man who could help. Mr. Patrizzi, 62 years old, had gone to work at a watch-repair shop in Milan at 13 after the death of his father, dropping out of school. He later moved to the watchmaking center of Geneva, at first peddling vintage timepieces from stands near watch museums. He founded Antiquorum, originally called Galerie d'Horlogerie Ancienne, in the early 1970s with a partner. At the time, auctions of used watches were rare, in part because it was hard to authenticate them. But Mr. Patrizzi knew how to examine the watches' intricate movements and identify whether they were genuine. At first, prominent watchmakers were wary. Mr. Patrizzi approached Philippe Stern, whose family owns one of the most illustrious brands, Patek Philippe, and proposed a "thematic auction" featuring only Pateks. The pitch: Patek would participate as a seller, helping drum up interest, and also as a buyer. A strong result would allow Patek to market its wares not just as fine watches but as auction-grade works of art. The first Patek auction in 1989 featured 301 old and new watches, with Mr. Patrizzi's assessments, and fetched $15 million. Mr. Stern became a top Patrizzi client, buying hundreds of Patek watches at Antiquorum auctions, sometimes at record prices. The brand's retail prices soared. Over the next decade, the company began charging about $10,000 for relatively simple models and more than $500,000 for limited-edition pieces with elaborate functions known in the watch world as "complications." Patek began promoting its watches as long-term investments. "You never actually own a Patek Philippe," ads read. "You merely look after it for the next generation." Mr. Stern says he bid on used Patek watches as part of a plan to open a company museum in 2001. Building that collection, he says, was key to preserving and promoting the watchmaker's heritage, the brand's most valuable asset with consumers. "Certainly, through our action, we have been raising prices," he says. Auctions gradually became recognized as marketing tools. Brands ranging from mass-producers like Rolex and Omega to limited-production names like Audemars Piguet and Gerald Genta flocked to the auction market with Antiquorum and other houses. Cartier and Vacheron Constantin, both owned by the Cie. Financi