freddy333

You can call it anything you want, but I would watch the personal attacks.

Switched over to this for dinner Friday night & still wearing it after midnight (Saturday)

True. Because they do work for Rolex, they cannot convert models or repaint aftermarket dials. Though they do allow the customer some latitude with the details as long as the scope remains within the model spec. Since most vintage Rolex models were offered in white, silver or black dials, I think they just assume these are all within spec.

Which is exactly the way the watch was described towards the beginning of this thread ('my '42 is all gen except for the insert. Yes, I repainted the (gen) dial white instead of its original black, but the watch is certainly not a replica') & why I keep scratching my head over this debate Other than the documentation you receive from service, Rolex will not authenticate (certify) watches. The main reasons they no longer accept vintage watches for service is the lack of replacement parts, the liability issues that relate to servicing collectibles (they do not want to risk being held responsible for damaged/lost watches/parts) & they want to sell new watches.

Not exactly & this is 1 of those Rolex issues that does not lend itself to easy, black/white answers. Rolex generally sees service & custom dials as different animals. Service dials are made to Rolex specs (using Rolex dyes) either in-house (today) or by a select group of dial makers working under contract with Rolex (in the past). Rolex considers these genuine Rolex components (Rolex will generally accept a watch for service that contains a service dial). Custom dials are generally made using proprietary dye by unaffiliated dial refinishers or jewelers. For this reason, Rolex has, to the best of my knowledge, never accepted custom dials as genuine (Rolex will generally refuse to accept a watch for service that contains a custom dial). My dial does not really fall into either category, because it was made using Rolex dyes by a company that refinishes dials under contract with Rolex, but I requested that they reverse (customize) the colors. So the dial's designation is open to some degree of interpretation. While I believe that neither 'fake' nor 'oem' are appropriate, saying the dial is not 'genuine' is ridiculous. This is why I described the dial as a 'repainted gen dial', which is exactly what it is & why I continue to be amazed at how much (virtual) ink has been spent debating that fact.

Exactly correct. A service dial is either a new or repainted gen dial plate containing details that purposely differ from the original (so as to differentiate it from an oem dial). My gen dial plate was repainted with the original details (so as to liken it to an oem dial).

My watch has been inspected by 2 master watchmakers with Rolex accounts (1 of whom provided 1 of the 1036gmt parts). Both were surprised (jaws hit floors) when I revealed the watch's history. And this is precisely the problem. It is really only that tiny group of us who live & breath vintage Rolex who would even have the knowledge to classify such a watch as anything but gen. For watchmakers within the Rolex service network, if all the parts are genuine, the watch is deemed to be genuine.

Just my watch, or would you apply the same set of tongue-in-cheek monikers to this 1

Try this - It is a genuine 6542, but not an oem albino (or white dialed) 6542. Better?

Nicely done.

Actually, the owner is. And I do not understand why there should be any question? With the exception of the insert (it should be noted that the vast majority of 6542s referred to as 'genuine' have had their inserts replaced with service, aftermarket or 1675 replacements), every other part in that watch was made by Rolex in Switzerland. Had my dial been repainted its original black color, it would either have passed as just another '42 or referred to as a genuine 6542 with a repainted dial. However, repaint it to match a rare white variant of the GMT &, suddenly, the word 'fake' comes up. For obvious reasons, I will not reveal their ID here, but, again, the dial restorer has been doing this type of work for Rolex USA for a long time (using many of the original Rolex printing dyes). Is the repainted dial original? No. But it is not fake either. And, for the record, most of the dials referenced as 'service' dials and described (dismissively, yet properly) as 'genuine' on that same forum went through the same process my dial did. The only difference is that I had the restorer copy the color of a white dial instead of the usual black.

Ending the work week wearing my OPD

Perfectly. But my only concern was whether the word 'fake' was appropriate when referring to a repainted gen dial?

It came out of a cheap, 10+ year-old (at the time the article was written) Comex Sub, which was shown/described in 1 or more of the links within the text. I believe that model is still available today. Check our seller's listings for Comex Subs (other Sub models may contain working Hevs as well).

Here you go. Unfortunately, some of the pic links are broken (I no longer have the pics), but read through all the links in my posts, which contain additional sources/details (& possibly some pics).

I posted an Hev How-to a few years ago, but it may have gotten lost during 1 of the forum upgrades. I will have a look & update this if I can locate a link for you.

I did & maybe you are confusing my Phase 1 (a rep turned franken) watch with Phase II (all gen (& partially NOS) except the insert)? In the case of the Phase II watch (which is the 1 under consideration here), I took a gen, water-damaged 6542 dial (black) & had it repainted (white & by the same people who restore dials for Rolex USA). In that context, referring to the dial or watch as being 'fake', especially coming from someone who I know knows the difference (you), did not seem correct (or funny). Again, maybe just a bit of confusion all around?

I get the valuation differences between repainted vs original dials, but you said 'everyone is focused on the one element which is fake' & the dial is not 'fake' by any means. Or am I reading you wrong?

Funny?

I think that, ultimately, it was a snarky thing for us to do. Well, at least the way it was done. But, considering that the OP of that thread inquired about white '42s, it seemed logical for someone to toss my watch into the ring. And, again, for those who just tuned-in, my '42 is all gen except for the insert. Yes, I repainted the (gen) dial white instead of its original black, but the watch is certainly not a replica, so no rules were broken (Phase 1 '42 at right) It should also be noted that many of the senior members of gen forums routinely have their watches serviced by indy watchsmiths (Bob Ridley, Michael Young, etc), who must often swap defective parts for used or aftermarket parts, which, by definition, results in a Frankenstein watch. Had my watch been assembled by Bob Ridley, none of these gords would ever dare utter a discouraging word or complain that the pics were posted by someone affiliated with RWG. But because it was an RWG member that performed the same work, it gets some gen owners' (& those two-faced, double-agents) panties in a whirl. Bottom line - it was a well intentioned idea that probably should have been handled differently.

I think you mean (Turn-o-graph) Date-just. I do not have any experience with reps of these watches, but Trustytime is 1 of the better sellers. However, before you buy anything, I would strongly recommend that you read this.

It all depends on the specific example. Some are better, some are worse.

Nanuq is exactly correct. The watch in question was constructed (with the exception of the insert) out of gen parts, which is why we got a bit carried away. And, for that, I think we are all sorry.

Well said. But I think it also has to be said that, here, gens & reps are all treated equally.