Noel Fleischer Posted July 28, 2011 Report Share Posted July 28, 2011 I have to agree with the the point about the rep sales prices. Alot of people expect to sell a used rep for 90% of what they paid a yearr ago. Besides collectables, what products maintain their value like that. For ex; think of a new car right out of the showroom and the depreciation factor. Some of the dealers are guilty of this as well- 'slightly beat up UPO, $220 instead of $250! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankt Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 I thought it was just me..... But when I started reading this thread, I was amazed to see some of the "old guard" posters joining in the reunion!.... The hobby has changed dramatically, with a lot of new folks adding a lot of new ideas, and a lot of new reps showing up, for a WHOLE LOT of money by the standards of just a few years ago!! As I type this, I'm wearing my Arktos 21J that I have worn often over the past 4 years, that only cost me $70.00, and it still is tight, clean, and accurate... The only watch I have bought recently in my 21J Ploprof, and I only bought that because I've been looking for one for @ 30+ years, and at $149.00, it was a steal!!! I'm amused at how anal many of the new guys are about such mundane stuff as a/r colors,and lume brightness.... and watching the "Planet Ocean Follies" evolve over @ 5 years, has become a daily source of entertainment for me...My $75.00 edition from '06 still looks almost as good as any of the dozens of iterations I have seen evolve over that period... So I'll keep on reading, and maybe posting once in a while....And maybe even buy another watch or two...Who knows.... And maybe someday the words "franken" and "ultimate" will revert to their true meanings...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollux1 Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 Make this place fun again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollux1 Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 What really rubs me the wrong way these days is the constant harping on the most minute of flaws. I've seen very good reps absolutely panned by the membership for having the tiniest flaw. My favorite watch is still my Navitimer, a watch that I bought many years ago, and although it is far from perfect, I have never been called out on it. I have reps in my box that approach perfection (Graham Tech Seal, V1 Seamaster Chrono, etc.), but the watches that I wear the most are probably the least accurate of the lot, simply because those are the watches I love and I just don't sweat the small stuff as far as details go. Back in the day I used to write some pretty extensive reviews. These days its pretty hard to actually contribute anything of relevance. It seems that within hours of a watch's release the skeptics have already studied it, identified the one minor flaw, and decreed that the watch is not worth buying until that flaw is fixed. By the time any of us actually get the watch in our hands, it has been discussed to death, and their really isn't anything new to say about it. This happened when I got my V3 Skyland. I spent days writing a lengthly review, taking pics and studying gen pics. Once complete I gave it a final read and just felt disappointed that their was nothing in it that hadn't been discussed a million times in a million threads. The review never saw the light of day and I've never attempted another. Another shift I have seen over the years in the forums is that people seem to be less generous than in the old days. What ever happened to buying a watch, wearing it for a year, then selling it for half of what it cost you? It astounds me that people will buy a used watch from a complete stranger, take all the risk, simply to save ten or twenty dollars (sometimes not even that). In the old days there was more of a giving spirit (as seen by Ubi in this very thread) that was rampant throughout the forum. If someone posted that they'd lost or broken a part, it was generally answered fairly quickly with "I'll send you one". These days its more likely to be ignored or replied with "email Josh, he'll sell you one". As to what we can do to liven things up around here? Thats a more difficult question. This hobby isn't as underground as it used to be and finding quality reps is far easier than it was. Reps are in most cases 1 to 1 so building a franken is more an exercise in spending money more than a show of craftsmanship. Once elusive straps are now being produced everywhere. I think because of these factors the need for sites like ours has simply diminished. Fewer questions, fewer answers, results in slower traffic. Maybe its time to invite Neil back +1 on that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 I thought it was just me..... But when I started reading this thread, I was amazed to see some of the "old guard" posters joining in the reunion!.... The hobby has changed dramatically, with a lot of new folks adding a lot of new ideas, and a lot of new reps showing up, for a WHOLE LOT of money by the standards of just a few years ago!! As I type this, I'm wearing my Arktos 21J that I have worn often over the past 4 years, that only cost me $70.00, and it still is tight, clean, and accurate... The only watch I have bought recently in my 21J Ploprof, and I only bought that because I've been looking for one for @ 30+ years, and at $149.00, it was a steal!!! I'm amused at how anal many of the new guys are about such mundane stuff as a/r colors,and lume brightness.... and watching the "Planet Ocean Follies" evolve over @ 5 years, has become a daily source of entertainment for me...My $75.00 edition from '06 still looks almost as good as any of the dozens of iterations I have seen evolve over that period... So I'll keep on reading, and maybe posting once in a while....And maybe even buy another watch or two...Who knows.... And maybe someday the words "franken" and "ultimate" will revert to their true meanings...... They're scared of getting called out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baryonic Matter Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 One of the things I find interesting is the question of what, exactly, people expect from a rep watch, what matters most to them. Does it have to match EXACTLY the real thing to be satisfactory or is it good enough if it looks similar but otherwise looks good and works well. I think how you see a rep determines to a great extent what you get out of it. I might think my rep is good because it looks good, the printing on the face is sharp and well aligned, all the parts fit together reasonably well, the buttons work and it keeps reasonably good time. If the date wheel is in the wrong place or the sub dials have different numbers on them is of secondary value. So, I guesss the question is, what do you want out of rep watches and what does it take to keep you interested? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkarpas Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 i miss the old times too.. i still remember my first good sub, my first pam and off course i miss the days that i had to read something interesting everyday in rwg. I am still here after all this years and this forum gave me much in terms of knowledge.. now times have changed good reps are expensive and my cc card is on its limit i am happy i see a lot of oldtimers still here and this keeps me coming back everyday to check the new posts. Lets do something for this , lets get this spark firing again in this place! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamdot Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 Ok. I did not read this whole thread yet but it's interesting to see the history. I have a way for you "bored old timers" to find joy on this again. Sell all of your watches and start over. Out with the old. In with the new. Anyone up for the challenge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pane Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Great Topic. In the last time i thought a lot about the old times. I remember that i bought my first watch at a Black "AD" in a small village in Italy. I wear this watch the whole Holidays and after 1 week my arm was green and the colour of the back of this watch was lost it was Breitling Chronomat with UTC what a crank watch. A friend of me said you have to spray a clear nail varnish or Hairspray on the back of the watches and the colour stands more than a month wow My first good replica i bought on a watches stock in Munich it was a submariner with serti dial and a 14k double wrapped to two tone bracelet and a gen ETA inside. I have this watch still in my drawer and wear it also and now it is 13years old the price was 500 DM (approx. 250€) and the gold is still on the bracelet and also on the bezel and crown. The second one i have bought was a Roley Yachtmaster also in twotone with ETA and this one is also still running i would say the quality was better but with more flaws, we dreamed about a automatic chrono and it takes a lot of time the first Breitling comes with real 7750 i have bought mine in Antwerpen together with a solid golde 18k daydate i have paid for both watches 4000DM (2000€. But i love this hobby still. There were no reason form me to say stop ths hobby because i need all month a new watch i have bought and trade some nice pieces here in the forum and have in the most of all deals a really friendly and great expirience. So kee this place an this hobby alive it is for me much more importatnt than a daily newspaper because i'm loooking allways min. 2 times a day in this place!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 One of the things I find interesting is the question of what, exactly, people expect from a rep watch, what matters most to them. Does it have to match EXACTLY the real thing to be satisfactory or is it good enough if it looks similar but otherwise looks good and works well. I think how you see a rep determines to a great extent what you get out of it. I might think my rep is good because it looks good, the printing on the face is sharp and well aligned, all the parts fit together reasonably well, the buttons work and it keeps reasonably good time. If the date wheel is in the wrong place or the sub dials have different numbers on them is of secondary value. So, I guesss the question is, what do you want out of rep watches and what does it take to keep you interested? I would say that you've essentially summed up my feelings towards reps. I don't demand 100% 1:1 accuracy in replication, because I don't ever intend to try and pass the watch off as genuine, so it doesn't have to be 'perfect', from that perspective. From my point of view, as long as everything on the dial is clear and correctly spelled, the watch does what it needs to do, and I like how it looks, that's perfect for me It's like a couple of my planned projects, a 1665 and 16800, I know I'm not going to get them 100% perfect to the originals, so I'm just going to do what I can to make them at least look 'historically accurate' to be identifiable as their correct model to another enthusiast. I couldn't care less if a member of the public sees the name on the dial, infact, I prefer it when they don't see the R Word on the dial, as that is then inviting the question "Is that a real Rolex?"... While I would never say 'Yes', I prefer to just fly under the radar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offshore Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Someone said that we could use some new blood. I totally agree. Redwatch and Freddy have been very good additions to the admin team. Maybe we should shake things up a bit more? Hmmmmm If a search is made of the number of attempts and time that it took to get some new blood into the admin team, you will find that it will be the next millennium before any other changes occur! There was only 1 moderator who pushed for change, and he is now long gone. New blood should be the life blood of this place, and unfortunately the lack of new inspiration leads to threads such as this. Offshore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baryonic Matter Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Hmmmmm If a search is made of the number of attempts and time that it took to get some new blood into the admin team, you will find that it will be the next millennium before any other changes occur! There was only 1 moderator who pushed for change, and he is now long gone. New blood should be the life blood of this place, and unfortunately the lack of new inspiration leads to threads such as this. Offshore Very important point! As I've said before, I run a forum, so I have a good idea of what goes on behind the scenes. Just like you need a constant flow of new members to keep things going you also need, from time to time, a new face or two on the moderator team to keep the ideas going and help keep the place up to date and interesting. Importantly, the new people should be allowed to have their say and be taken notice of. No point getting a new guy on the team then telling him to shut up, sit quietly and do things the way they've always been done! So much for today's lecture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miagi Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 I find this bord to be the encyclopedia of watches. Where on the Gen forums, the members have paid rolex or whatever-brand-they-desire for more or less perfection, whereas the members here counter money with research, mods and manufacturing of parts. the knowledge and just generally GREAT people housed in this forum is just one of a kind. I guess i dont participate much in the daily talk in the forum, and maybe that should be adressed, but i dont hold the knowledgebase that some(many) of you guys do. I do however let myself facinate about the comradery and helpfulness amongst the members, and the lenghts that some go to to make the perfect watch. I love reading indepth about the projects and horological adventures many here set out on! im a constant lurker and reader.. I do miss Lani and RobbiG as they shook up the place with lots of postings and made for great discussion/read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie_Rain Posted August 14, 2011 Report Share Posted August 14, 2011 Hello, I am new to Replicas, but I always loved mechanical watches. My Panerai Replica is very accurate with its Asian 6497 and I think the Chinese quality is increasing fast... To all you who think you have seen it all and think about old times - maybe you miss a challenge. Here in Germany where I live it is a pain in the .... with customs. I have to choose triangle-shipment and my ordered Omega watch is lying since one full week in England and I hate it. I wish I would be bored a bit, but I am waiting so anxiously for it to arrive. Regards, Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornerstone Posted August 14, 2011 Report Share Posted August 14, 2011 Welcome Bernie! The enthusiasm is great to see! Hope your watch arrives soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotoman Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 I'm not sure why this thread popped up in my search, but, if you read it, almost all of the forum all-stars are lamenting about exactly the same things I did. Although mine was more raw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tribal Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Maybe the spirit of the old times is gone. There is no underground feeling anymore. Good Reps are way easier to found today, no more mysterious Dealer etc. Hey that's the route of life I think. I also had my time I was bored of Reps and visit the Forum. But I'm already here and I love it. I meet a lot of nice members here, some in person and I'm thankfull for that. We made friendships here. It's a great community. Just my 2 cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotoman Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Never a better time to buy reps, some very good people here. Real enthusiasts. But that's not what the forum is about here, anymore. IMHO It's just not as fun I wonder if mastrmind thinks this is just old useless people wining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vandal.tbh Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 I don't know about you, but I miss the "earlier days" of this hobby. Reps weren't so accurate but they were cheap as hell. Paul was selling ETA-powered reps for $170 and people were buying like crazy. Lots of traffic in the forum (although back then the community wasn't divided into 5-6 different camps). Personally, I never understood why we need all those forums but that's another story... We had only a handful of great replicas. None of them would qualify as "super reps" now... not even close, but they were still great: initial Seamaster Pro, TW Best Sub, those extremely inaccurate MBW's (that had mythical reputation), glass back Moon Watch, etc. etc. Remember watcher's China Sub vs. Gen comparison in the original RWG? People praised the rep and it was amazing how accurate it felt back then. Now people would laugh at it. Pictures of modded WM9's can fool even Tribal and Ubi. I remember how happy I was with my fantasy Speedy. Now that kind of new release would get hammered by the membership. We have some replications that are literally 98% (visually). Are we happier now? I don't think so. Back in 2005 people were enthusiastic. All out-of-the-box reps got praise from the members. Now we need a $3000 frankenwatch to get any kind of discussion going. Don't get me wrong, it's great that we have those amazing watches (and builders) among us, but what about ordinary buyers who don't have the money/skills? Is anyone still interested in their new purchase? Ubi wrote that he feels bored. I don't feel bored but I simply don't have anything to buy, or any reviews to write. What to write about? We have seen it all. I haven't even picked up my camera in a LONG time to photograph the watches. Maybe we older members have simply "raced" it all and reached our goals? Have we become "elitists", just like the gen watch snobs? I mean seriously, have we lost some members because of that kind of attitude? This isn't supposed to be a negative post. I'm just wondering what we could do better to return this forum into its original glory. We have been discussing this in the admin room but I'd also like to hear some ideas from the membership. I'm writing this response without reading the 3 or 4 pages of replies first because I felt strongly about what you said in the first post. I'm guessing many people have already said the same thing. I've only gotten into this recently. I purchased a few quartz reps a couple of years ago in Bahrain. They look pretty nice and I wear them a lot. They could be immediately called out by anyone who knew watches, but they have kept perfect time and they look nice so I don't care. I've always had a fascination with watches, especially mechanical watches. I was going to buy a gen PO, but then I found out how incredible reps had become. I ordered one, then immediately ordered two more. I'm not sure I ever would have purchased a rep without this forum. I was too skeptical that I'd get ripped off or be extremely disappointed. In fact By-Tor, it was your review on the UPO that convinced me to get it. It was a great review and was exactly what I was looking for. I looked up every review I could find. I wanted to see everything that was written about these reps. When my watches arrive, I'm going to write my own reviews. I'll just say, that maybe you're right about the more experienced members being bored or jaded. But to those of us that are new to this, it's exciting. I'm like a kid the night before Christmas, waiting for my watches to arrive. But I have realistic expectations and plans. And that's because of you and the other experienced forum members. I thank you guys for that! The power of forums is awesome. I have saved an incredible amount of time and money by doing research on forums. I literally rebuilt a jet ski by following tutorials on a Sea Doo forum. Now it's one of the sweetest skis on the water. I'm glad reps have developed into what they are today. I'm excited to have found an affordable way to immerse myself in something I love. And I'm grateful that forums like this exist so that we can all share the knowledge of experience. I'm hoping someday I can be the old guy helping out the new guy on this forum! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotoman Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 I have no doubt you will enjoy helping many members. But your avatar is still giving me nightmares jk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotoman Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 By the way, enthusiasts love helping. I have always thought the main attractor to this was the hunt. Not so much the thing sitting on your shelf. To come up with new stuff, new ideas - for which I have made some custom projects, sourcing movements and cases. All of these cool straps. I like staring at my wrist, but I have the same joy for helping someone who wants to dive in serious and is excited. It reminds us, of the waterfall of information and emotion that we all had. I'm not sure I know of anyone that founded or predates trc so, all of us were a newb at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SportsterRider Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 I took a good bit of time off from the hobby for many of the reasons cited here. But for me, it's been cyclic since the beginning. I've been into watches since I was a kid and received my first watch when I was 5 or 6. It's been a part of my life for the better part of ~36 years. But it's not been a non-stop hobby as I've gone years without a new watch, or a strong interest in watches. It's nothing in particular, it's just that other interests take priority and my watch passion takes a back seat. I got my first rep in 1984; an all gold Rolex Presidential with a quartz movement. I absolutely loved that thing and it was the watch that started my interest in replica's. I've had every kind of rep under the sun and without a doubt, today's offerings are absolutely stunning in their accuracy and build quality (just received the latest 42 mm PO - excellent rep!). But as good as they are, they're still not gen's and there is still nothing like owning the real deal (I've owned two gen Omega's and one Rolex). So the seach will likely never end in that regard. I guess what I'm getting at is sometimes passion for a hobby can wane. It doesn't mean you no longer like whatever it is you've lost interest in, it usually just means that either something else has taken over as your primary interest, or as others have noted perhaps your collection really is 'complete' for the time being and there's nothing left to search for at the moment. In that case, you just move on to something else for a while. I miss the old days too. More specifically, I miss the old posters like By-Tor, Pug, Ubi, etc.. They're well spoken, articulate and community oriented. But as usually happens, a new generation of folks will fill in the void and, hopefully, the community will go on until their interest is reignited and they become active posters again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upland Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 Arghhh! " miss the old days, miss the old days, miss the old days.. " What a mantra . The " old" days started freaking 6 years ago. Stop crying ppl, RWG to young for PMS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gran Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 Arghhh! " miss the old days, miss the old days, miss the old days.. " What a mantra . The " old" days started freaking 6 years ago. Stop crying ppl, RWG to young for PMS. Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.......has it been only 6 years ....you have a point there 09er ....but some may be refering to the pre 2006 days....yes even consideringthose days thast ikinda early for having your menstruation (if your female and a human) ....mabe RWG is another type of beast .....a cat or a eagle maybe? and those get their period in a very short time ..and plaese do not tell anyone to "shut up" when having their cycle ...guess yore not marriedupland ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotoman Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 Arghhh! " miss the old days, miss the old days, miss the old days.. " What a mantra . The " old" days started freaking 6 years ago. Stop crying ppl, RWG to young for PMS. I think some are mis- interpret What were saying. What me mean is that the hobby has changed with super reps. It has nothing to do with what we think of newbs - the changes in industry have changed the culture. I think people were closer. It was a time that rep projects were the game, now having an excess of, hey., don't buy the rep, it's a hair off something. The "no recessed pin" didn't stop us from buying the rep. But we looked to improve. And different guys would post experiments. Also an inordinate amount of time on rolex cgs and pearls. Times change. What we mean, which has nothing to do with the newer members. It just means we miss a different time. It's called reminiscing not whining. Were not complaining either. We all love super reps. Hands down, issue is not AGAINST newbs. Its remembering a different time. A different sense of comrodery, (sp)? It is what it is. Please don't take offense newer members Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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