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The cartel has increased its power, and prices


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3 minutes ago, manodeoro said:

Some documents about Staybrite and Stainless Steel



thank you manodeoro.

unfortunatelly the link you shared is not working.

I have one of those cases (produced in 2006 / 2007) and it looks less porous than steel and has a silverish shine.


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28 minutes ago, manodeoro said:


EDIT 2 : links OK



Very interesting manodeoro.

thank you for sharing.

here, the detail of an early rolex 3646 (panerai) caseback


and here some shots of my 3646 case (unfortunatelly my watchsmith lost the rhodium disk that separated the bezel from the case body):






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2 hours ago, By-Tor said:

Yeah and the fun was that the reps were dirt cheap. Paul sold EVERYTHING for $100 in his CARZY SALE. Yes some of the reps were [censored] but some were really good... like the Bond Seamaster that even had gen-like bracelet with authentic construction (that tricky tube & pin system).


Bought this Noob TT Sub for $150 from a dealer. Amazing quality.




Here's my gen 16710 and Noob GMT Master. These were about $200. Wrong hand stack but who gives a [censored]. They were cheap and FUN.



Here's gen 16613 and the old Noob 16613 (these were going for $170  back in the day). I paid $150.



If you ever decide to let that Noob TT go ... :cupidarrow: my wrist is ready for her.


Guys !!!

The more I read your posts and the more I'm sorry for not having joined this forum earlier.

I joined November 2016, almost an "old man" already and quickly jumped into the build game (the first "watch" I bought was a 6538 case from Silix).

It feels like the game was more "have fun" than "show off" some years earlier, with all those cheap reps far from perfect but highly upgradable (is it an english word ? "upgradable" ?).

That's why I'm more in 5 digits and earlier, beyond the fact that these models were much more elegant ... I love reworking cases and drilling lugs, engraving, designing and building dials almost "from scratch".

38 minutes ago, madasboot said:

Very interesting manodeoro.

thank you for sharing.

here, the detail of an early rolex 3646 (panerai) caseback


and here some shots of my 3646 case (unfortunatelly my watchsmith lost the rhodium disk that separated the bezel from the case body):






You're welcome

and WOW !!! I love that caseback ... already uploaded the pic to use it as a template for engravings cause that 3646 could be one of my future build 

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"As a modder I get a ton of requests for gen parts, like they are so easy to find.  People have no idea really.  Especially the new kids."



Genuine parts for 4 digit models are quickly disappearing and what is left is becoming unaffordable for me. 

The MBK '5513' mentioned in the 'Building an MBW Sub' sticky above was $1300 about 7 years ago.  Same watch now would probably be $2500 or more.  Back then a 1520 or 1570 needing c/o, mainspring, rotor axle etc was $500 to $1000, now they are $1200 to $2000. 

Many high quality 55xx/1680 ETA powered project watches will go past $1300 today.


I bought a rlx 1556 DD movement in May 2013 and the guy asked what they were selling for...he had already scrapped the case and bracelet!

I said "$600 to $1200."

He said "Sold for $600!"

It's not that way now.  



"Noob GMT Master..."


I fell into four of these from 'Paul' waaay back.  He made me a 'Special Deal' on four so I paid for them.  About a week later they arrived from a used car dealer in Georgia USA, brand new and tight wrapped in plastic. (Georgia ??)  All had new swissetas with the whs non adjustable China 24 hour mod.  (I have told this story before)

Saw a watch trader friend wearing one Sunday before last.  He got it from Paul about the same time but it came from 'over there'.  He paid $159 delivered.

Same watch today with new swisseta 2836 would probably be $500 or more.


Bought some high quality GMT watches with DG 3804B movements a few years later...same dial etc but different reference number.  They have 'no hole' lugs where the other four have lug holes and they have SEL, hollow mid links, and shorty F/L clasps. 

Probably the last of the breed, the new GMT replicas have gone ceramic with the new type clasp.



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On 10/22/2018 at 11:25 PM, By-Tor said:

Not really. I have many nice gens of all models that I ever wanted (and more). But if I see a reasonably priced good, used rep, I might go for it. :)


Only those WM9/TC Subs might be worth a bit more than standard reps but a rep Daytona for $658? That's just absurd.


I agree, By-tor. I've got nice gens....lots of nice reps, but would pay the freight for a rep that really turns me on. Haven't seen that one yet.

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It's not just the dealers it's the factories that are worse than ever.

Noob could make a 116520 or 116520 with a better dial and bezel. There seems to be some tacit agreement with ARF that one factory will sell a good looking tona and the other will produce a functioning watch with gen thickness.

They knew between them that the price of gen parts would rocket so to throw together a decent Franken, not even with gen parts, you need to buy both watches. Then pay a modder to shave the dial.

I draw the line. [censored] that. We've suspected deliberate collusion for some time, this absurd scenario confirms it.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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  • 2 years later...

Yeah I was just thinking one day how is it going around here. :D


Haven't bought any watches in years though. Seems like some old veterans are still around.


So... is there a decent 1675 / 16750 rep yet or are they all still shite? :D


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B-T...been a while.  Check in more often!   :sun:


'twist an arm to lower prices...'


I do not keep up with replica prices very much because I stopped buying anything except from a member now and then, nothing from a pro seller.  I have more than enough already. 


Imho, the best way to cope with high replica watch prices is to stop buying them and change direction.  Besides being pricey, replicas are not known to be overly reliable and parts are hard to find or N/A.


I still keep a lookout for bargain priced vintage diver watches but usually not on eBay because of high prices.  There are a lot of them out there and when I find one for $50 or $75 and get it back in presentable condition for a few more bucks, they are a good value and will sell for more than they cost, sometimes a lot more. 

The snags are:

Finding an affordable watch in good condition to begin with.

Finding someone to do the necessary work or being able to do it yourself.

Locating needed parts.  As usual, parts can be a problem. 


This reminds me of the time I got revved up and went on a hunt for a Zodiac Sea Wolf, in a couple days I had one for $85, one for $75, and one for $0.  The one for $0 has an off white with orange markers acrylic bez insert and black dial with white H and orange M hand.  Not bad for $0.


Like this one:

Image result for vintage zodiac seawolf



Otoh, used replica watch prices tend to drop like a rock outside of forums like RWG etc because the Average Joe assumes all replicas are basically the same and sell for $50. 

Two exceptions being carefully assembled project watches and Frankensteins using quality parts. 


Imho the high prices now being asked for replicas depend on the current market value and popularity of the original.  The latest models of genuine rlx submariners etc are hot right now and commanding premium prices as are replicas of the same.         


Vintage dive watches do not seem to be falling out of favor and oem makers are cranking out vintage types trying to cash in on the trend.  There are also some very nice private label vintage style dive watches for sale now, Dan Henry, Baltic, Steeldive bronze SD1965S etc.  


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I still have my WM9 Sub v2 16610 with gen bezel insert and crown. But I also have two gen Submariners (16610 and 14060) so that WM9 is basically useless for me.


I could trade within the EU to a decent 1675/0 rep build if such thing exists. :o 


Just for the old times' sake. Haha. Or to the "best 6-digit Sub rep". Double haha. :D :D Who has the best?

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"Who has the best?" 


Do not know much (if anything) about 6 digit models but for five digit models...

Back when we were young, the WM9 and F520117 Noob were The Kings.

Owning a WM9 and F520117 makes us past servants to Long Gone Kings.  

Then TC shot them down 

Giant Ancient Cannon

...and was catapulted 

Image result for Catapult

...to Top Dog.

Top 10 Best Guard Dogs

Then TC left in a hurry, like a rock shot out of a trebuchet...

Image result for trebuchet

...rumored to have landed on the 'Isle of Genault'.


News : A Horological Detective Story - Ginault And The Curious Case Of The Counterfeit Rolex Watch Factory - Scottish Watches


The watches are not for rent...

...it looks like they are for sale.

               --In a Rush





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  • 2 weeks later...

Hey guys, 


Similar to By-Tor I have been offline for some years 😉 


I was checking on some of the "old-times" trusted dealers and could not find a single one! Is there something like a "buying guide" out there that is valid in 2021? :D I highly feel the need of buying one or two new reps and some replacements (bracelet etc.) for existing ones.


Any help is highly appreciated!


Thanks in advance.

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Nice to see some old names here again. All is quiet on this forum these days.
Things have certainly changed in the last couple of years. Prices are getting a bit silly these days on some of the desired models.
My go to dealers these days are either Sead(supernirrors) for his U.K. stock and Li at jtime

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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  • 2 weeks later...

So many familiar names... so many fond memories of the forum... mostly a long time lurker... it's been a while... sad to read about Neil... thanks for the memories... amazing the progress that's been made in "out of box" quality... but as everyone said,  the mods were what made the hobby so much fun... searching for a lil motivation for a new timepiece. Happy to see so many of you still on the forum. Stay safe and healthy! 

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  • 2 months later...

It's interesting to read thru  the posts, since I spent so much time here so many years ago.

It was  a hoot ... trying to get an MBW vintage was just crazy.   You had to work thru contacts, to find a guy who knew a guy, pay wait and hope.

Back then, everything came with a Swiss ETA movement ... I have reps from 20 years ago that work just fine.  Once the sources got to know you, you got first crack at things like the Rolex GMT with a 2893 movement, or the Panerai Sopras with the 2892.

There were guys (Like The Zigmeister) who seemed to know everything about everything.

I dunno how things are now, as I just got started reading thru some of the threads, but I'm sure glad to see some names I know here. 






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Maria: And so we meet again, Mister Bond.

TJG: You’ll never get me to talk!

Maria: I don’t want you to talk, I want you to BUY. Muwahahahaaaa

Ah the good old days! :tu:

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"Ah the good old days!"  :tu:


Yep.  In more ways than one.


Maybe it's like James Otto said:  "These are the good ole days."

...if you live long enough to look back.  Ha! 

It's lookin' like we might have some ruff days ahead in the USA.  Been there, but I was younger. 



Nice buncha watches!

Where you been?

We're still here, lookin' out the window.  

Image result for images of cat looking out the window





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