TTK's Status on RWG

[offshore]

If anyone knows the sports teams adage "what happens on tour, stays on tour", then you will appreciate the sentiments of the group who are your admin team.

I am an 'old timer' as far as the boards are concerned, probably only predated by T, and a couple of others, including TTK!

My time around the boards, particularly over the past 2-3 years, has been spent, more in admin duties, than as a regular contributor.

Categorically, I have never been more fortunate, in working with a group of people, than I have been, to work with the RWG team. (Only wish my day job had such great personnel)

This group is unified in its desire to offer its members the best possible arena for discussion of watches, and specifically replica watches. In this quest, the group that formed as the admin team, are now the most like minded, and collectively like-thinking group, I have ever had the pleasure of associating with.

We discuss many matters, and don't always all totally agree, however we do agree on one point.

Once a concensus is reached, that is the view of the collective. And wobetide anyone who attacks a member, or the group.

This board has no place for aggravation, personal attacks, threats, racism... I believe most understand the boundaries, and your team will, as a group, deal with these types of unacceptable behaviour.

This is not an "open" forum, it is not the wild west, it is an area to discuss watches in an amicable manner.

So those who seek to disrupt, to "stir the pot", or attempt to put unacceptable agenda, are well advised to seek other arenas.

And those who feel inclined to attack, threaten or berate the admin team, who are only working for the good of the forum, should also find other platforms, as they are not required in our camp.

Off my soap box now.... we will always as a group, do what we consider to be the best for the forum and its members.

Enjoy your time with us, or move on if you are not happy with these ideals.. It's all actually pretty easy!

Offshore

[Watchmeister]

I am pleased to see the membership at large understands. Neil has been and is a friend to many folks here. Unfortunately he has basically self-destructed at RWG as he has done at 3 out of 4 forums and there is no turning back. The admin team tried to do the right thing by him and the forum by asking him to take a breather from dealing to allow him to catch up with his prior obligations and regain his health. Unfortunately his response made the decision inevitable. As has been said innumerable times before threats to T or any member of the admin team will not be tolerated.

IMHO, way too much time was spent on trying to figure out how to fix the original issue. His response made it a necessity. And yes I do wish him the best and a rapid return to health. Hopefully he will change his attitude at the one remaining forum where he still has posting privileges. We were not the first who were forced to resort to this. Hopefully we will be the last.

[fendushi]

I've always appreciated how lucky I am to have access to these forums... even as a non paying member.

Thank you so much RWG Admins and Mods...

[nelly]

I again state that I abide by the ruling of the admins and their collective decision, this forum only thrives because they have successfully moderated the usual descent into abusive chaos that reigns in many other parts of the net.

I made my point about personal responsibility, I will now leave it well alone before I get tagged as a troublemaker

Edited March 13, 2008 by nelly

[TeeJay]

Teejay,

This is somewhat my point.....

Members had ample opportunity to read Neil's posts, so if they ordered from him then they took the risk that they too would be on the end of one of his scathing posts, complaining about "bullying" after the fact just smacks of the "it's always someone else's fault" syndrome that is infecting our society.

I can see the point you are making, yes, people did have the opportunity to read Neil's posts, and, that was why I never wanted to do business with him. I agree, there is way too much "blame someone else" syndrome in society today, but, that does not justify the behaviour being complained about, in the beginning, and to be honest, it almost comes across as saying "If they hadn't let themselves be bullied, it wouldn't be a problem..." Wether someone allows something or not, is irrelevent, as it is never acceptable for someone to bully or otherwise treat someone else with disrespect, be it in business, educational, or personal interactions, in the first place. The bullies are the ones at fault here, not the people who wind up being victimized by them. I appreciate that Neil's status was not revoked because of his attitude towards others, but, given the rules about treating others with respect, I am surprized that his attitude was tollerated as long as it had been.

[andreww]

I like TTK, in fact I bought my first watch from him. He has always been good to me, he's had my back when I've been in trouble, and I consider him to be one of my best online friends. However, like everyone, he has flaws. He is very opinionated, and once he has decided on something, changing his mind is impossible. He seems to have temper issues, and I think that is his biggest problem. As others have said, when you talk to him personally its hard to believe that you are talking to the same person that we see online every day. Recently I've noticed that TTKs fuse has grown much shorter. I've witnessed the disintegration of his friendship with Pugwash, his lack of concern for his customers, and now total disregard for the administration of this board. I can't help but feel that he is simply venting his his frustrations over personal issues, but who knows. I stand by the Admin Team's decision, but I also hope that something can be worked out in the future if TTK comes to terms with his deeper issues. Whatever you feel about him, his contributions to these boards cannot be denied.

[scoobs1971]

I've never had the opportunity to deal with TTK in person, so I only can judge him from what I've read on the forum. I've always wondered after reading so many negative posts from and about TTK why people wanted and still want to do business with him. But I guess to each his own.....

Anyway, the facts are very clear: we cannot tolerate any personal threats from any member on this forum. A big thanks for the Admin/Moderating team for making such a hard, but inevitable decision. This is what RWG is about: protecting it's members. And sometimes that means drastic but necessary solutions. That's why I also agree on the initial decision to temporary suspend the collectorship.

Just my 2 cents.

[Pugwash]

Well said, Andreww. I still hold out hope for TTK, both on this forum and as my friend, but he burns bridges far too easily and has never apologised to anyone for anything. If he can just swallow his pride and for once admit his mistake, he can start earning the forgiveness of the admin team, but I don't know if he has it in him.

Its a shame and a loss, but there' only so much leeway a valued contributor can expect.

I wish him good health and an epiphany, the health being more valued, of course.

[LordRasta]

Well said, Andreww. I still hold out hope for TTK, both on this forum and as my friend, but he burns bridges far too easily and has never apologised to anyone for anything. If he can just swallow his pride and for once admit his mistake, he can start earning the forgiveness of the admin team, but I don't know if he has it in him.

Its a shame and a loss, but there' only so much leeway a valued contributor can expect.

I wish him good health and an epiphany, the health being more valued, of course.

Well put, my sentiments exactly.

[TwoTone]

The wounds go deep...

Much deeper than what's been publicly disclosed...

Double T

[nelly]

I've never had the opportunity to deal with TTK in person, so I only can judge him from what I've read on the forum. I've always wondered after reading so many negative posts from and about TTK why people wanted and still want to do business with him. But I guess to each his own.....

Anyway, the facts are very clear: we cannot tolerate any personal threats from any member on this forum. A big thanks for the Admin/Moderating team for making such a hard, but inevitable decision. This is what RWG is about: protecting it's members. And sometimes that means drastic but necessary solutions. That's why I also agree on the initial decision to temporary suspend the collectorship.

Just my 2 cents.

Scoobs,

As you say to each his own....there are two sides to every story and here is a little piece about why I personally decided to deal with Neil.

I have ordered many watches from Neil and despite taking a wee bit longer than some other dealers to arrive, they always DID arrive. So I decided 8 months ago to order two of the MBK watches he offered, the PP Nautilus and the AP RO. These were subsequently confiscated as part of the Thai customs crack down, however as Neil stated at the time he had given his commitment on these shipments so he would make good. I subsequently tried to order a watch as part of the group buy, but Neil told me he would send it to me gratis in return for patiently waiting for the MBK replacements, that he also had the PP in house but was still looking for the RO as he knew that I wanted the one with the closed back and the only ones currently available were open backed.

Well one week ago I received the replacement PP from Neil via Narikaa and in this morning's post I opened up a parcel to find the gratis group buy watch sitting in one on Neil's trademark gold bags.

So far he has remained a man true to his word and that's why at least some of us were happy to deal with Neil.

[hiker01]

Scoobs,

As you say to each his own....there are two sides to every story and here is a little piece about why I personally decided to deal with Neil.

I have ordered many watches from Neil and despite taking a wee bit longer than some other dealers to arrive, they always DID arrive. So I decided 8 months ago to order two of the MBK watches he offered, the PP Nautilus and the AP RO. These were subsequently confiscated as part of the Thai customs crack down, however as Neil stated at the time he had given his commitment on these shipments so he would make good. I subsequently tried to order a watch as part of the group buy, but Neil told me he would send it to me gratis in return for patiently waiting for the MBK replacements, that he also had the PP in house but was still looking for the RO as he knew that I wanted the one with the closed back and the only ones currently available were open backed.

Well one week ago I received the replacement PP from Neil via Narikaa and in this morning's post I opened up a parcel to find the gratis group buy watch sitting in one on Neil's trademark gold bags.

So far he has remained a man true to his word and that's why at least some of us were happy to deal with Neil.

I wish I could say the same! Maybe one day! Keep hope alive! and I believe that goes for ssurfer, Sailinjack, mentalists and the rest who are still waiting and hoping!

[jsmith11]

I fully support the admins decision here and quite frankly it should have come a lot sooner. Yes TTK may provide good watches but the bottom line is that he is not friendly and often degrades people who don't agree with him. And it seems when he has a group buy or a number of sales he doesn't provide good service.

Hopefully he takes care of his health issues. I don't wish ill will on any human but at the same time he wasn't a real friendly person who was a pleasure to get to know on these boards.

Really no good comes of this decision so lets just move on and get stronger as a community.

[TwoTone]

As Twotone has pointed out, there is MUCH more to this story than is being shared on the board...from both parties.

Suffice to say (having spoke to TTK) that those Repgeek members still waiting on a watch from him will still have your delivery.

Those members here at RWG will sadly not have your watch. He now has no access to your info stored in a folder in his PM here at RWG, so this ban has had an adverse effect on the few still waiting for a watch.

I'm sure that once TTK is feeling better (probably after he returns home to Scotland and receives proper care) he'll reach out and apologize to the Admin here at RWG, which could facilitate access to info contained here for pending orders and fulfill his obligations, as he takes pride in the fact that he's never scammed anyone.

Star:

Please PM me on the access that TTK needs and I will grant it...

That should solve the RWG GB issue here...

Also, for those with outstanding orders here, TTK can also be reached at Rep Geeks...

Send him a PM there with the info he needs to fulfill his obligations...

There is ZERO reasons for folks not to get there Watches...

TT

[sam_tgg]

Just a point, not knowing what was said to the Admin team:

Being ill, in stress for not going well everything with his bussiness (the group buy, the suppliers, etc), in a foreing country (even if it is great), having fear (at least, if I have a problem with my eyes, I will have), and people saying that you are a scammer, people like me, not doing the correct things explaining all correctly at first time, and someone, saying that you ar lying with your illness... I think may be I will be also agresive. Just talking, writting, but I will also do stupid things, and saying stupid things to the worng person (I have done last year, for other ciscunstances, but the result was the same).

I admit, accept, and agree with the Admin. They are doing a great work, and they can not accept someone to be making threads. But I also hope like as Pugwash and others, that TTK could get better, have a clear mind, talk with the Admin, and solve it.

I have some money there. May be is lost (as Star say), may be not. But I want have a nice time with my watches and board friends, even personally meeting some of them, not stressing me, being in the middle of wars, accusations, etc.

I say it: writting in internet (emails, skype, boards), is very impersonal, and is easy to be nasty (as I can see everyday in my work).

Sam

[roeod4]

Let me "contribute" by clarifying my statement from last night.

When I say that I don't see what the big deal about this is, I mean just that. Neil has been banned from forums before and he as either been let back in or he hasn't. It has never meant that he has stopped being involved in the rep community or that he has really ever stopped being a dealer, collector, watch expert, enthusiast or whatever everyone is calling them these days. It has also not ever slowed or changed his way of doing things. I have seen Neil blow up at Admin and Mods of just about every forum he has been on. For just about every reason you can think of. He has bashed members of the same forums over and over again and he is still around. He has stalked members of different forums and attacked them for anything that they say. People have yelled from the roof tops that Neil is a terrible dealer and people have still bought from him. People have yelled at the other people yelling that Neil is a fantastic dealer and people have still bought from him. People have complained about the amount of time it has taken him to deliver and other have still bought from him. People have completely flipped out and posted on every forum that Neil will not contact them and others have still bought from him. There are those that hate Neil with every fiber of their being and there are those that are faithful TTK loyalists to the end.

So what has really changed? Neil won't be on THIS forum. He didn't die and he hasn't stopped being involved with watches. He will probably continue to be the same person on whatever forum he is on and he will probably continue to offer the same amazing/crappy (depending on your view) service that he is famous for. The people that hate him don't have to deal with him, here at least, and those that are so very fond of him can still get in touch with him via skype, email or other forums. Now, some of you know me and some of you don't have any clue who I am, either way it doesn't matter. I have not been on the forums in close to a year (long story), but I can tell you one thing with out reading a single thread besides this one. Things have not changed and I somehow doubt that they will all that much.

For what it is worth, I respect the decisions made by the Admins. I think you guys probably put up with far more crap than I ever would have and threats against anyone are never a good thing. So, congrats on taking care of the membership and hopefully everyone involved can move on from here.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled rant/b*tching/justification already in progress.

Edited March 13, 2008 by roeod4

[Daytona4me]

I buried the hatchet a long time ago with Neil...

But I cannot not make a comment in this thread.

We at RWI were CRUCIFIED here and on RWI for making this very same decision.

His dealer status was removed for the same reasons as here, then after a 2nd round of threats (the first coming when he threatened Tim and his family) and the second when he publicly made the threats to me we had to ban him as RWG did.

I hope that one day, if I ever threaten you and your family and your friends and the forum for which you love and all the hard work that you have put into it that all of you react the same way... with compassion and understanding and with a sincere desire that I get better... or at least give me some of the drugs that you are taking.. because that will numb the pain of pulling my hair out.

And the people who say... I know you were just threatened.. and a number of your staff, and the tools that you use to fund the forum, and the forum itself... but... "what about my hundred dollar watch".. OMG.. let me say it again... OMG..

As stated in a private pm to an RWG admin... RWI offers it's support in any way we can, even if it's just a word of encouragement.

The best thing RWG can do is get past this.

[Mickey Padge]

I never dealt with TTK as a buyer, I never really liked his attitude.....

Plus he lied to me on these forums, about selling knives to the UK. He said they were within the UK law, but there were some that were either automatic or locking, both of which are not legal in the UK...

Anyway, nobody has asked this question:

The forum has a place open in the collectors section, I wonder who is waiting in the wings to fill that void?

[roeod4]

And the people who say... I know you were just threatened.. and a number of your staff, and the tools that you use to fund the forum, and the forum itself... but... "what about my hundred dollar watch".. OMG.. let me say it again... OMG..

For some reason, when I read this I can only hear Mathew Perry's voice in my head.

[nelly]

Let me "contribute" by clarifying my statement from last night.

When I say that I don't see what the big deal about this is, I mean just that. Neil has been banned from forums before and he as either been let back in or he hasn't. It has never meant that he has stopped being involved in the rep community or that he has really ever stopped being a dealer, collector, watch expert, enthusiast or whatever everyone is calling them these days. It has also not ever slowed or changed his way of doing things. I have seen Neil blow up at Admin and Mods of just about every forum he has been on. For just about every reason you can think of. He has bashed members of the same forums over and over again and he is still around. He has stalked members of different forums and attacked them for anything that they say. People have yelled from the roof tops that Neil is a terrible dealer and people have still bought from him. People have yelled at the other people yelling that Neil is a fantastic dealer and people have still bought from him. People have complained about the amount of time it has taken him to deliver and other have still bought from him. People have completely flipped out and posted on every forum that Neil will not contact them and others have still bought from him. There are those that hate Neil with every fiber of their being and there are those that are faithful TTK loyalists to the end.

So what has really changed? Neil won't be on THIS forum. He didn't die and he hasn't stopped being involved with watches. He will probably continue to be the same person on whatever forum he is on and he will probably continue to offer the same amazing/crappy (depending on your view) service that he is famous for. The people that hate him don't have to deal with him, here at least, and those that are so very fond of him can still get in touch with him via skype, email or other forums. Now, some of you know me and some of you don't have any clue who I am, either way it doesn't matter. I have not been on the forums in close to a year (long story), but I can tell you one thing with out reading a single thread besides this one. Things have not changed and I somehow doubt that they will all that much.

For what it is worth, I respect the decisions made by the Admins. I think you guys probably put up with far more crap than I ever would have and threats against anyone are never a good thing. So, congrats on taking care of the membership and hopefully everyone involved can move on from here.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled rant/b*tching/justification already in progress.

One of the calmest, most rational posts I have seen on this subject.

Long may the ranting/b*tching and justification continue, many of man's finest achievements have been fueled by it.

Let's face it, if we all agreed with each other the world would be a very dull place

[andreww]

Well put D4M. And good to see you back Roeod4

[coolfire]

Had it not been for the steadfastness, commitment & collectiveness from T & the rest of the Admin Team, RWG would have gone down a long time ago, just like RWG1 did...

My utmost respect to the Team.

[Emmzy]

Star:

Please PM me on the access that TTK needs and I will grant it...

That should solve the RWG GB issue here...

Also, for those with outstanding orders here, TTK can also be reached at Rep Geeks...

Send him a PM there with the info he needs to fulfill his obligations...

There is ZERO reasons for folks not to get there Watches...

TT

Of course there is no reason for people not to receive their watches.....if they don't he will be a definite scammer......don't you think?

[Richard Tracy]

I am pleased to see the membership at large understands. Neil has been and is a friend to many folks here. Unfortunately he has basically self-destructed at RWG as he has done at 3 out of 4 forums and there is no turning back. The admin team tried to do the right thing by him and the forum by asking him to take a breather from dealing to allow him to catch up with his prior obligations and regain his health. Unfortunately his response made the decision inevitable. As has been said innumerable times before threats to T or any member of the admin team will not be tolerated.

IMHO, way too much time was spent on trying to figure out how to fix the original issue. His response made it a necessity. And yes I do wish him the best and a rapid return to health. Hopefully he will change his attitude at the one remaining forum where he still has posting privileges. We were not the first who were forced to resort to this. Hopefully we will be the last.

If anyone still thinks after reading the above post, that there were personal vendettas against Neil, or somehow this is unfair, they should realize that their own personal limited experience and history with him, leaves out a whole

spectrum of information, and interactions that should to be factored into your feelings.

These problems with Neil have been going on for years,..and through many boards.

Also as was mentioned before, some situations have been kept private for the sake of peace on the board and personal

friendships, I know this for a fact.

There were times when the boards bent over backwards, then were forced into cutting him off, and others when they

allowed him back dispite their knowing that the situation would deteriorate eventually, as it always has, a cycle that repeats itself like seasons.

Yes, he may have treated you personally just great, however isn't it better to take the mindset that what hurts some of us, hurts us all ?

Until we can get to that point of view, then we are not much better than the outside world where it's dog eat dog imho...

[Shundi]

If anyone knows the sports teams adage "what happens on tour, stays on tour", then you will appreciate the sentiments of the group who are your admin team.

I am an 'old timer' as far as the boards are concerned, probably only predated by T, and a couple of others, including TTK!

My time around the boards, particularly over the past 2-3 years, has been spent, more in admin duties, than as a regular contributor.

Categorically, I have never been more fortunate, in working with a group of people, than I have been, to work with the RWG team. (Only wish my day job had such great personnel)

This group is unified in its desire to offer its members the best possible arena for discussion of watches, and specifically replica watches. In this quest, the group that formed as the admin team, are now the most like minded, and collectively like-thinking group, I have ever had the pleasure of associating with.

We discuss many matters, and don't always all totally agree, however we do agree on one point.

Once a concensus is reached, that is the view of the collective. And wobetide anyone who attacks a member, or the group.

This board has no place for aggravation, personal attacks, threats, racism... I believe most understand the boundaries, and your team will, as a group, deal with these types of unacceptable behaviour.

This is not an "open" forum, it is not the wild west, it is an area to discuss watches in an amicable manner.

So those who seek to disrupt, to "stir the pot", or attempt to put unacceptable agenda, are well advised to seek other arenas.

And those who feel inclined to attack, threaten or berate the admin team, who are only working for the good of the forum, should also find other platforms, as they are not required in our camp.

Off my soap box now.... we will always as a group, do what we consider to be the best for the forum and its members.

Enjoy your time with us, or move on if you are not happy with these ideals.. It's all actually pretty easy!

Offshore

Whooops... hit "Disagree," meant to give you a gold star!