True-Stu Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 I just read the thread on the West Palm Beach Rapid Reaction Force ---oh man, that is just too cool! It's nice to know that with a shared hobby, you can become a band of brothers and protect your own. I found this to be true in other hobbies, like high-end audio for instance. You can tell who really loves the stuff - who really has it in their soul. Those are the people who will treat you like a brother and would never dream of misrepresenting or scamming. Heck, they usually go way beyond the call of duty in helping you out. It's interesting to me that it is quite often dificult for men to really bond with each other and have any more than superficial conversations. The common interest, the shared hobby, is the casual and safe door opener that sometimes leads to really great friendships. I envy women in this one respect. They seem to bond so easily with their girlfriends. When this person first arrived, I posted a comment about them possibly not being on the up and up. Shortly after that, they sent me a very nasty PM and I foolishly tried to stay out of the way. I am sorry Maybe it's time we use the West Palm Beach Rapid Reaction Force again? They have already had plenty of time to sort their issues out.. Some kids don't learn.. what else can we do to help society that has to deal with them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devedander Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 I just read the thread on the West Palm Beach Rapid Reaction Force ---oh man, that is just too cool! It's nice to know that with a shared hobby, you can become a band of brothers and protect your own. I found this to be true in other hobbies, like high-end audio for instance. You can tell who really loves the stuff - who really has it in their soul. Those are the people who will treat you like a brother and would never dream of misrepresenting or scamming. Heck, they usually go way beyond the call of duty in helping you out. It's interesting to me that it is quite often dificult for men to really bond with each other and have any more than superficial conversations. The common interest, the shared hobby, is the casual and safe door opener that sometimes leads to really great friendships. I envy women in this one respect. They seem to bond so easily with their girlfriends. Nonsense!!! I bond quite easily with my male companions! In fact I just got done going to the bathroom with 5 of them and later we are going to hang out and talk about our new underwear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanerich Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 It's interesting that some people are saying "I hope he has a good explanation." Is there really any conceivable explanation that justifies sending someone a damaged and nonworking watch on purpose after representing it as new? This is not like a dealer not doing QC. He knew exactly what he was sending. I don't think he's a scammer exactly. Sherlock Kanerich deduces that our young friend busted his MBW trying to mod it (he been really into frankenrolexes lately) and coveted another one really badly. But MBW's don't grow on trees so he went back and screwed Arthur out of his, figuring he'd work it out later. I'm not saying it's a flattering explanation, just the most plausible one. One does have to wonder about this sort of behavior from someone who by his own repeated assertions is intelligent and educated and engaged in learning a medical profession that will compensate him handsomely and require him to act responsibly and ethically regarding each and every one of his patients. The way someone handles the little things tells you a lot about how they handle the big things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devedander Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 I agree... at this point all that I can see comming are rationlizations, apologies and or lies... I guess I could accept an explanation like "I was hit by a truck and suffered brain damage and cannot distinguish a damaged product from a good one anymore" but that's about it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supermanx Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 WOW what a POS... Oh yeah I f'ed up the lugs, but figured you wouldn't care. Chronomat always seemed like an ass, but damn that is too far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Category 5 Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 Doe this mean it's "buyer beware" when trading or dealing in the members section? It's been a while since I got a rep, but dealing with Joshua, EL, Andrew, Neil, or any of the trusted dealers and I have been pretty confident that I would get the watch i expected, or it would be made right. I don't wish this on anyone, but if it happened to me I might be scared away from trades period. Unfortunately, that is really the only safe way to exchange reps, or get rid of them for new purchases. We need to figure out a way to make these kind of transactions safer....kind of like ebays feedback system. Chronomat...give him back his money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasigi Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 It's interesting that some people are saying "I hope he has a good explanation." Is there really any conceivable explanation that justifies sending someone a damaged and nonworking watch on purpose after representing it as new? This is not like a dealer not doing QC. He knew exactly what he was sending. Quoted for truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 (edited) I think even in this case, and I REALLY hate to say it, when the member comes forth to offer his explanation, it is probably not going to be a sincere one anyway. If he has the time to offer Arthur 2 PM's, what is stopping him to stop by over here and offer an explanation. We may get the pitch that it is none of our business, and should be just be between him and Arthur. But in this instance, this is not the first time that something has gone wrong with this particular member. And whenever things go wrong, this member has always acted very defensive, like the world is out to get him, or that he looks like Ashton Kutcher! It is none of that, this is a community, and I think we take pride on taking care of one another, and to prevent others from being taken. And this needs an explanation, I just don't know how there can be a "good" explanation out of it. It's sad, really. Edited October 27, 2006 by Woody Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linder Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 My brother-in-law and I are driving down to Orlando this weekend. Send me a PM if you need us to take a detour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 (edited) I just read this entire thread and a little surprised, and a little unsurprised. When Chronomat123 showed up on these forums it wasn't without controversy. I had some talks with him back then, and he seemed to understand how things work around here. Since then he seemed to positively contribute, and I was delighted to find out that he was a fellow contributor to By-Tors Breitling guide. Lately however his behavior became erratic. Do you remember the post about brushing the case on his Navitimer? He explained the process to me in detail as to how he had done it, then said it was now his favorite watch. A few weeks later it was up for sale, but he now stated that a jeweler had brushed the case. I nearly jumped at it when he broke the rules at RWI and posted the watch for $130, but the post was nuked. He then bumped the price here to $170. Whenever you questioned this guys ethics his response was "[censored] you, do you know how many gens I have?". Sadly, I know for a fact that this guy knows the etiquette of selling here (complete disclosure and honesty), yet he chose to ignore it. Unlike By-Tor, I think this fellow has already had his second chance, and I think he should be banned. P.S. - I knew who we were talking about half way through Arthur's first post (no I didn't see his other thread). What does that tell you? Edited October 27, 2006 by andreww Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcrooz Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 IThe way someone handles the little things tells you a lot about how they handle the big things. That is very very true in all walks of life. I feel the this poster has been scammed. Chro... thought he could get away with completely and utterly ripping some one off - there's no other explanation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 Through all of this there is a point that everyone seems to have missed, for an extended time he held both watches...............could he have been parting out the best from the red sub for the white letter? If so that is a new level of dishonesty that simply cannot be excused, although I am at total loss as to why he drilled the lug holes. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linder Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 I missed that point entirely. Didn't he send back the watch with the other watch's bezel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 I missed that point entirely. Didn't he send back the watch with the other watch's bezel? That's what Arthur said. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linder Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 Without trying to stir the pot, I think this has taken a turn for the worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 This member told Arthur that he is shipping a brand new Red 1680, and Arthur got a bezel that is missing a pearl, and the bezel is not brand new, and then the lug holes issues, and the clock is still ticking for the member, as I am sure he is taking various exams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted October 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 Well folks here is the latest. Hopefully we have resolved the problem. Only time will tell.Eric called me this afternoon, and apologized for his behavior. Basically I told him that in order for him to establish a good relationship in any buiness dealing, there had to be communication. Had he responded to my first email,PM or phone call, none of this would have ever happened. I related to him some of the stories about scammers who have come on the forums with a lot of good feedback initially, but were just setting people up for the kill. Because so many of us have been scammed, we are all cautious. Any time someone starts to duck and run, a lot of red flags get hoisted. Since no one knows him personally, when he starts acting like a scammer, then our reaction is he is a scammer until proven otherwise. He was very contrite, as he had read all the posts, and was probably impresed with the number of folks who weighed in with opinions that he did not do the right thing. He could offer no explanation as to why he didn't mail the watch in a timely manner, except to say that he was very busy with school. I can understand that because when I was in training,I didn't have time for anything else. Of course back then, we were the Hospital's slaves. No mattter, I told him that it only takes 5 minutes to sit down and send a quick PM, reassuring the buyer that everything is OK, your watch has been shipped, or I have been very busy and I'll ship it in a day or two. To be honest, I hope that he learns from this experience. He does seem like a bright, articulate yourng man. I t would be a shame for him to let the vagrancies of youth get him into trouble that will come back to haunt him later. I believe that the lesson to be learned here is "If you screw with a member of this community, treat them poorly and ignore their pleas for an explanation and resolution of the problem, the community as a whole is going to come down on you pretty hard". I think that what Eric may or may not realize, is that because of this incident, which could have been resolved very easily by a timely response to my requests, he has cast a shadow of doubt over himself which will take many,many impeccable transactions to erase. As to the watch. I'm going to send it to Ziggy as was planned from the beginning. I have a genuine crystal and Ziggy was going to replace the crown/tube with a genuine. Now he will have a little more work to do to get it running. Eric swore to me that the watch was running fine when he put it in the express mail package. That may in fact be true.There have been quite a few posts on the forums about buyers receiving Brand new watches that were DOA. Eric is going to reimburse me for the cost of repairs, so Ziggy will be dealing with me, and not him. He claims that the bezel insert is a genuine, and not the one that was on the White letter sub. That is possible, because the original deal for the white sub included a genuine Insert and a OEM crystal. I have that one as well as a genuine 127 that I got a couple of weeks back. We'll get the lug holes sorted out, I believe I can polish them with fine grit sandpaper and then use a buffing wheel or stone to get the scratches out. He told me that he didn't drill the lug holes all the way through. I bet he did what someone else suggested, he got some cheap drill bits from a hardware store and realized the cheap steel bits weren't going to cut that hard steel. I hope that this puts and end to this sorry mess. I play around with watches becauseI love them and I find them interesting and relaxing.It's also a nice way to meet interesting and knowledgable people who share my passion. Deals like this really make me wonder"Are we having fun yet" Thanks to all Arthur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x86uops Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 I like happy ending. Arthur, do send us some pics when the mods are done. I hope you continue to enjoy this hobby and the watch. I also wish you best of health. Cheers and have a great weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devedander Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 I can't say I would call this a happy ending... still seems like you need to be made right in my book, but if it works for you... I know regardless I will not be in line to provide an opportunity for one of his much needed impeccable transactions... mistakes and poor service I can understand and even forgive... this was just an out and out showing of bad character... something which I believe is much harder to reverse. Between this and reading the $600 rolex mods thread I am unhappy... I can tel this hobbie has many genuinely good hearted people involved but it sure doesn't take much to taint a good thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedy1 Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 That sucks! But yes, the lugs holes are totally fixable............albeit with a lot of time and wet/dry sandpaper+flat surface. I have to fix worse than that from me screwing up past watches of my own. Good to hear things are begining to work out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 He claims that the bezel insert is a genuine, and not the one that was on the White letter sub. That is possible, because the original deal for the white sub included a genuine Insert and a OEM crystal. Going back to your initial pic... Having a second look at the insert, it very well may be genuine. The fonts on it certainly look genuine; MBW's insert fonts/markers are all quite thick and bold. At any rate... I am glad to hear that the situation is being addressed. Hope it all works out in the end. P.S. I have a non-genuine acrylic pearl I can send you to fill that hole... If you're interested, just send me an email Arthur! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted October 27, 2006 Report Share Posted October 27, 2006 Nice gesture Randy, and I hope it will all work out in the end for you Arthur. I know that I may still be in the minority now, but I would like to hear from "Eric" as to why this has happened in the first place. And it can just be a few sentence, I just think that the community deserve an actual explanation from the offender. If mods think I am out of line, feel free to PM me, and that matter shall be closed. But to me, it's like, "ooops, you caught me, I better do you right" kind of a thing. Did Eric just anticipate on sending Arthur the watch and that will be the end all be all kind of thing? I am "befuddled" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offshore Posted October 28, 2006 Report Share Posted October 28, 2006 So you are all aware, this matter is under review in admin, and we are awaiting some outcomes prior to arriving at a decision. Offshore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briank996 Posted October 28, 2006 Report Share Posted October 28, 2006 Definatley a gen insert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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