Roby944 Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 (edited) Hi there, i have received these pics from a private seller that claims that 2rolex are gen. are a 16618 full gold and a 16710. what do you think? thanks R. Edited September 6, 2007 by TwoTone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alligoat Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 I have my doubts, rehaut on the TT sub is shallow, can't see the crown guards. If legit, this watch is worth over $4500. The GMT pic is also not too good. Can't tell if it has the proper hand stack, which is hour hand on the bottom, GMT next, and minute after that, can't see the cg's from the front, but clasp is short which is correct. Again, if legit, it's worth $3K. Rule #1 is know your seller, i.e., reputation, sales history, are the prices reasonable, no one gives these watches away. Much below the prices I quoted (more than $500) and you are being scammed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsons Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 Well, the "Swiss Made" on the 16613 dial looks to be off center so I would say rep. I would expect a lot more than a crappy blurred photo from a seller probably asking $3K plus for a watch. I would say pass and suggest checking out reputable sellers on TZ. Be careful out there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 Why are his pictures so bad? What is he hiding? Avoid, unless they're a bargain and you can get some kind of Escrow thing going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stilty Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 (edited) Hand stack looks fine to me. And the sub looks gen to me as well. I tend to look at the details of the hands. Gen hands are slightly domed, where reps are flat or bevelled. I'd request the serial numbers and do a check with Rolex. I've done it a few times and it saved my ass. Even if the seller claims they have papers, get it checked out. I checked out the serial on papers and on watch, and Rolex told me the serial did not match the case, nor the dial, so I walked away. That is always an easy start. Rolex can tell you if the serial is legit, or reported stolen, etc. It usually takes a day for them to get back to you. Edited September 6, 2007 by stilty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankt Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 NEVER buy a Rolex from a stranger unless you have the watch in one hand and the caseback in the other!!! ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosnik Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 Roby, follow the Stilty's words!! Be safe, when you buy around GEN Rolex, is one must! Wile, BMW , looking that poor pictures they are GEN. Are They in your country or far away ? Do you know the name , address and numbers of the seller ? Ask for some extra pictures and inner pictures too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bklm1234 Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 the gmt is a gen, the tt is a fake. still no guarantee he will send you the gmt in the picture. be careful. -bk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 Personally unless he was to allow you to check them out with a gen AD before purchase I wouldn't even consider it. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 (edited) The gold Sub looks suspicious, but the GMT Master is genuine without a doubt. Edited September 7, 2007 by By-Tor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
its_urabus Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 welll since you or the seller is posting the same images over on trc, and saying its from PT, i would say the "gold daytona" (http://www.replicacollector.com/members/index.php?showtopic=31763) is a fake and if you have no faith in the poster, have no faith in the watch. sorry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 The GMT is still genuine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
its_urabus Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 i want to believe with all my heart that the gmt is a gen, its dead sexy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victoria Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 Sorry Roby, I have no expert opinion on the watches. It's just that this thread remind me of one I read on RWI the other day. A person posted that he was given shoddy treatment when he asked about the authenticity of a watch he was considering. He either got silence or a snotty remark, I forget, but the upshot is the forum regulars treated his question like newbie dreck. Some time later, he came back, posted a pic of a gen Rolex, and told the members "Hey you didn't help me, but look at the gen I purchased anyway". Well, the regulars blasted the watch, saying it was a fake, look at the rehaut, blah blah -- when it was of course, authentic. He didn't say, but he did intimate this was on RWG (maybe RWG1?). In all my time here, I don't recall a single newbie receiving this dismissive, hierarchical type of behaviour from veterans. I've been on for nearly 3 months. On the contrary, except for really newbie questions like, "Where can I buy the best sub?", everyone tries their best to help out if they can. I'm glad to see this thread is no exception. Whatever you decide, I wish you luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
POTR Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 The gold Sub looks suspicious, but the GMT Master is genuine without a doubt. By-Tor, you've got a great talent for writing reviews, and are developing quite an eye... However, I will disagree with you. The Sub is an obvious fake, the GMT is a nearly-brilliant, and less obvious fake. Yes, the hand stack is correct. ( I know you've seen fakes with the correct handstack.) The bracelet is PERFECT. The Crown is Perfect, but doesn't it look like a TWIN LOCK in the one photo where you can almost see it?) The case looks right, except, let's get to that in a second .... The photos are blurry, the watch is at unusual angles, to minimize the flaws. I am sure, that if this were in your hot little hands, and not partially obscured, you'd immediately notice that while everything about this GMT is nearly perfect, the things that aren't, AREN'T. The Triangle indice at 12. Look past the blur, close one eye, squint, whatever it takes to concentrate on it... It is off. The bottom is centered on the nice looking coronet, but the top left corner is inline with '59-sec' while the top right corner extends well PAST '1-sec', where, if it were centered correctly it would start a little before '59' and finish a little past '1'. Blurring makes that hard to notice, no? Not enough? Ok, look at the CG's in the "nice" shot from the 'top'... Mirror finish, right? Ok, stop drooling on your kb, and redirect your attention to the lugs.... Mirror finish, righ..NOPE. The case isn't finished consistently. The CG's obviously have been extensively reworked and polished, while the rest of the case is still brushed finish. Both niggling little issues on an otherwise nearly perfect FAKE, obscured by blurred photos, undoubtedly in hopes that they would go unnoticed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victoria Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 The Triangle indice at 12. Look past the blur, close one eye, squint, whatever it takes to concentrate on it... It is off. The bottom is centered on the nice looking coronet, but the top left corner is inline with '59-sec' while the top right corner extends well PAST '1-sec', where, if it were centered correctly it would start a little before '59' and finish a little past '1'. Blurring makes that hard to notice, no? Not enough? Ok, look at the CG's in the "nice" shot from the 'top'... Mirror finish, right? Ok, stop drooling on your kb, and redirect your attention to the lugs.... Mirror finish, righ..NOPE. The case isn't finished consistently. The CG's obviously have been extensively reworked and polished, while the rest of the case is still brushed finish. Both niggling little issues on an otherwise nearly perfect FAKE, obscured by blurred photos, undoubtedly in hopes that they would go unnoticed. Holy merde. That snotty fake Sub-wearing AD assistant never stood a chance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bklm1234 Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 Phantom, you have a lot to learn, young padawan. You think the GMT is a fake, tell me which dealer carries it. -bk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
POTR Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 No dealer carries it. The bracelet is real, with a milled flip-lock (no dent), the crown is real, but probably a Twin-lock (can't tell for sure from the blur), the bezel and insert look really good, probably real or good bezel with real insert. The crystal looks good, but can't tell if it is after market, mis-directed service replacement, or gen, but the bit of nastiness around the cyclops could be anything from simple crud, to left over residue from a repositioning (can't tell for sure from the blur), the indice at 12 IS off, the CG ARE Polished to a different finish from the rest of the case, and if you look at the bottom lug on the 'top' oriented pic, the grain of the steel of the case is huge compared to the grain of the steel in the bracelet, and the two are of different hues, both of which mean, different steel. The case could be just about anything "modern", but from the nasty big grain, slightly dull luster and the longer lugs... I'd say it that the case (and maybe the bezel) came from "Paul", and his "Perfect Sub." Most of the rest, probably came from many a butchered Rolex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felipe56 Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 No dealer carries it. The bracelet is real, with a milled flip-lock (no dent), the crown is real, but probably a Twin-lock (can't tell for sure from the blur), the bezel and insert look really good, probably real or good bezel with real insert. The crystal looks good, but can't tell if it is after market, mis-directed service replacement, or gen, but the bit of nastiness around the cyclops could be anything from simple crud, to left over residue from a repositioning (can't tell for sure from the blur), the indice at 12 IS off, the CG ARE Polished to a different finish from the rest of the case, and if you look at the bottom lug on the 'top' oriented pic, the grain of the steel of the case is huge compared to the grain of the steel in the bracelet, and the two are of different hues, both of which mean, different steel. The case could be just about anything "modern", but from the nasty big grain, slightly dull luster and the longer lugs... I'd say it that the case (and maybe the bezel) came from "Paul", and his "Perfect Sub." Most of the rest, probably came from many a butchered Rolex. I must say I am totally in awe of you guys and girls who can actually identify differences between the gen and the rep. For me they all look the same, I have no attention to detail, and to be fair there are many like me! My wife makes a joke about the fact that as I proudly "display" my TT Daytona I cannot actually tell what the time is unless its in a really good light. My point is this: the quality/authenticity of a rep is actually wasted on me because unless I put on my reading glasses I can only tell the time by an educated guess. My main souce of time is my cellphone, its a LG choclate and it has a hugh font. I guess I am writing this because I am jealous. I want to see but I cannot. It is not a matter of eyeglasses,I wish it was! I guess a simple anaology is that many people would love to fly a fighter plane, I can and its what I do. Horses for courses I think! I will still trawl the boards 3 of 4 times a day but I am afraid, as much as I want to, I will never reach your level of understanding. Thats probably why I ask stupid questions from time to time and to be fair you could, and you do, ask alot of stupid questions about what I do. felipe56 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahchard Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 i have tried for a long time... to this day i still can't tell.... sometimes when ppl post pics of reps for sale in shops...i go... WOW!!! nice gens.... sigh... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felipe56 Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 i have tried for a long time... to this day i still can't tell.... sometimes when ppl post pics of reps for sale in shops...i go... WOW!!! nice gens.... sigh... thanks ahchard its nice to know I am not alone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roby944 Posted September 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 First of all thanks to all of you about your comments its always a pleasure to hear from you .... but i will tell you the truth. The GMT is gen The sub is one that i have bought from PT time ago. and is a rep. I see that the 90 % of you have spotted it : -) The pics was done badly, yes infact this was done for minimize the flaws. Yesterday i was reading some posts related to one GMT II, and one guy that was asking us to tell about if his watch if it was a rep or a copy. A lot of members, says that "there is not a question to do, obv its a fake" and its sound to me "you dumb" dont understand that this is fake go and hide under a BIG stone... Then i remember long ago, when even me wasnt able to understand if a Rolly was a rep or gen may be because i was a young guy that cant afford a gen, and never seen one of it and even a bad fake looks like a gen, only because there was written Rolex on it. I feel sad about that guy that was considered like a dumb, because its not like us that can spot a rep in 20 seconds. Fortunately things changed... and yesterday i go and take one of mine GMT II, have spent 10 minutes taking some bad pics, get a Rolex gen box ... and post this thread near the gen GMT a fake gold Sub, Why ? may be i was only a little tired and i want to smile a little ... BUT basically to remember to all of us to be patient with the others... and see that however is not easy to see the difference between a rep and a gen, and do not expect that everybody know it by "GOD" illumination.... I really have to thanks the TRC and the RWG and some of the members that in a couple of years were with me very patient and tolerant all the time and explaining me a lot of thing that was obvious for them but completely new for me. and i'm happy to call them friends... thanks for the posting ... and i'm sorry for the joke ... i hope that nobody will UPSET with me it was only a joke... bye Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillininla Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 That was very clever and cruel at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 By-Tor, you've got a great talent for writing reviews, and are developing quite an eye... However, I will disagree with you. [...] the GMT is a nearly-brilliant, and less obvious fake. Crap. That's 100% genuine watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighDef Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 Hi there, i have received these pics from a private seller that claims that 2rolex are gen. are a 16618 full gold and a 16710. what do you think? thanks R. That TT is 100% GENUINE,,,,,,CN. GMT is a real deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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