eddhead Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 I'm afraid you are wrong there Neil. Klink's has an agenda on this one. It's no secret that he has put his support behind one dealer in particular. Klink would love nothing more than to see a high ranking member like Pug publicly call out Josh and Andrew. Pug was baited and taunted and embarrassed publicly by an [censored]. End of story. That was my impression as well, and I thought it was reprehensible. For some reason I cannot seem to locate the thread today however... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted January 27, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 That was my impression as well, and I thought it was reprehensible. For some reason I cannot seem to locate the thread today however... They were edited and moved to the loony bin once they'd served their purpose, apart from the one that was so out of line it was deleted by other moderators. This was one of the problems. Once the vitriol had been unleashed, Klink just went back and edited his own posts to make you look like your posts were unprovoked. On rare occasions, he'd even accidentally edit your posts. There is definitely an agenda going on and I hope the other RWI moderators realise this and sort it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 Problem is Tim is ill and nobody is in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted stanley Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 Hmmm, Sorry to hear about this, just caught a drift of this over on RWI and then popped over to read what had happened. I have been thinking this is more of a general call to tighten up the terminology than to point fingers at anybody or anybodies. I know that I stumbled on these forms by accident after looking at some super scam website and found that the general honesty was what kept me here. It was still buyer beware of course but you knew what you were buying. Anyway, sorry to here that you were fingered for not fingering anyone. So to speak. Regardless the fact that this is a 24 page post is obviously getting peoples attention and I think that things will tighten up. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 That what we are hoping! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted January 27, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 I have been thinking this is more of a general call to tighten up the terminology than to point fingers at anybody or anybodies. This was my impression as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddhead Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 They were edited and moved to the loony bin once they'd served their purpose, apart from the one that was so out of line it was deleted by other moderators. This was one of the problems. Once the vitriol had been unleashed, Klink just went back and edited his own posts to make you look like your posts were unprovoked. On rare occasions, he'd even accidentally edit your posts. There is definitely an agenda going on and I hope the other RWI moderators realise this and sort it out. The tone of his posts on this thread is kind of odd. He seems to be taking this very personally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted January 27, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 The tone of his posts on this thread is kind of odd. He seems to be taking this very personally Ok, it's a little clearer now. He thinks it's a conspiracy and that I've done this without mentioning the dealers by name just so TTK looks good. No, really. He thinks I'm doing this for TTK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTone Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 FYI~ The Pugwash - Klink issue has been moved HERE... TT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 (edited) I just took apart my B&R01-92 and this is what I found: I took this up with Andrew last night and this was his reply: "If you read the others watches with Swiss ETA 2892... All those with SWISS will be noted as Swiss ETA 2892 This BR is only stated as ETA 2892.. In China, all the makers call them ETA 2892 but no indication of Swiss. This is the replica industry standards. If it is Swiss ETA 2892, think about it.. The movement alone will already cost USD200. You can check the bph.. It is confirmed 28,800bph. Joshua and I bought the movements in bulk and had them checked. This is the Asia ETA 2892 which the Replica Industry in China calls them. There is also Asia ETA 2824 which Joshua and I just got them and installed in the Omega POs" So if this is the Asian ETA 2892 then what is the one that looks like the 2892 in the Omega??? Andrew - Joshua - any comments? This one's been bugging me since I saw it and now I know why. Wasn't this particular one a dealer commissioned and exclusive piece? Did the factory lie to the dealers in question about the movement and supply a cheaper movement than requested? Edited January 28, 2007 by Chronus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savage_here Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 OK, so I've been reading this thread from the beginning. Really I think I'm just posting to be part of what seems to be the longest thread in the history of the world. Seriously, Pug and I have had our differences in the past (although I can't really seem to recall what we were sparring about, and it doesn't really matter), but I agree with his views in this thread. And, I wanted to show my support in light of the current opposition and naysayers. I had a thought. Maybe we could make a list of all those who don't really care if they are lied to or not. That way when people who do care get deceived, there will be a secondary market for those watches. That way everyone is happy. Whatta ya think? Savage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 I had a thought. Maybe we could make a list of all those who don't really care if they are lied to or not. That way when people who do care get deceived, there will be a secondary market for those watches. That way everyone is happy. Whatta ya think? Savage I think, point them out to me, I can sell them some used watches with synthetic sapphire glass, ETA2892 movements for $200 each - hey I need the money Hey maybe I will even custom make a ralex with ETA 2892 movement and dump the 2824/2836s in them for a $100 premium Would any of this be tolerated in the member trade section ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddhead Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 This one's been bugging me since I saw it and now I know why. Wasn't this particular one a dealer commissioned and exclusive piece? Did the factory lie to the dealers in question about the movement and supply a cheaper movement than requested? Maybe.. but than again, how would you explain Andrew's explanaton on the difference between a Swiss ETA 2892 and an ETA 2892. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torques Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 Without reading the whole thread, can you tell me if Joshua or Andrew have made any comments about this subject? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 Maybe.. but than again, how would you explain Andrew's explanaton on the difference between a Swiss ETA 2892 and an ETA 2892. So at least one of them is knowingly selling these purporting to be ETA.... hmmmmm not good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredrik m Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 Andrews site has bean updated! http://www.ttwristwatch.com/index.php?main...products_id=985 What will happen to use that have already bought the watch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibi Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 Andrews site has bean updated! http://www.ttwristwatch.com/index.php?main...products_id=985 What will happen to use that have already bought the watch? Cool! I mean, supercool, as in super lume ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 Andrews site has bean updated! http://www.ttwristwatch.com/index.php?main...products_id=985 What will happen to use that have already bought the watch? Well it still uses ETA in there ... at least this discussion has yielded something? We'll see what happens with the synthetic sapphire and light AR issues. Admittedly before a purchase, I ask questions such as, "Does this watch have genuine sapphire crystal?" "Does this have 100% genuine Swiss ETA 28xx movement?" etc etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olga Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 This one's been bugging me since I saw it and now I know why. Wasn't this particular one a dealer commissioned and exclusive piece? Did the factory lie to the dealers in question about the movement and supply a cheaper movement than requested? I am a little confused by this post as the movement pictured is not a Seagull st18. I have no idea what movement is pictured. Anyone have any idea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devedander Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 Andrews site has bean updated! http://www.ttwristwatch.com/index.php?main...products_id=985 What will happen to use that have already bought the watch? What was updated? It looks the same to me... I am a little confused by this post as the movement pictured is not a Seagull st18. I have no idea what movement is pictured. Anyone have any idea? That's the problem... I don't think anyone does... it's some weird movement out of no where that is 21jewels and 28k beat... and that's about all we know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spatten1 Posted January 28, 2007 Report Share Posted January 28, 2007 I think the change is "asia" was added before ETA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted January 29, 2007 Report Share Posted January 29, 2007 I went away for a couple of days. Return to see the loop is up to 25 pages. And my own conclusion is the following: As someone else said, it is not the forum's responsibility to try and save all rep buyers from dealers' falsehoods or bad descriptions outside this forum. But, to the extent that any dealer posts something within the forum market sections which is blatantly false and it is pointed out by a number of folks, the description should be amended by the dealer or the item removed. Obviously, whatever dealers post on their sites is their business. If you don't like it, don't buy from them. I also have a more general concern irrespective of the descriptions issue. As the aesthetics of reps get better, ETA movements begin to evaporate, and rep makers actually specify unique movements to put the date wheel or sub-dial in the right place (which may or may not be well put together), the quality of the reps is going to only get more varied. There are going to be some real busts as evidenced in that B&R. With that in mind it becomes all the more important that we vigilantly continue to post reviews on the new watches. As for whether the dealers in question ever respond, I don't really care. It certainly will make me ask additional questions before buying though. Finally, I do applaud Neil trying to make the record straight. I don't forget that he was the first to suggest and adhere to complete descriptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTone Posted January 29, 2007 Report Share Posted January 29, 2007 As someone else said, it is not the forum's responsibility to try and save all rep buyers from dealers' falsehoods or bad descriptions outside this forum. But, to the extent that any dealer posts something within the forum market sections which is blatantly false and it is pointed out by a number of folks, the description should be amended by the dealer or the item removed. Obviously, whatever dealers post on their sites is their business. If you don't like it, don't buy from them. @Kruzer I hear what your saying... But... The questioned Dealers have Status on this Forum, which in and of itself offers our membership some sort of endorsement... Because we ALLOW them to sell here... Remember, one of the things that this site offers is information/protection from being scammed... We currently have 12 Dealers, and a waiting list longer... It is my opinion that it's a privilege to have a Dealer Forum here... So with that said... Would it be Ok for us to allow the site operator of bestswiss.com to have a Dealer Forum here as long as his prices/policies/advertising is in line [on this site]? The fact is this site ends up pointing members to the Dealers site... There HAS to be consistency in the integrity of the offerings here by our Dealers and there sites... No other way around it... justmy2centsforwhatitsworth TT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted January 29, 2007 Report Share Posted January 29, 2007 TT- You have a good point. And if you guys are really willing to deal with it I applaud you. But we all remember that less than 18 months ago we were dependent on photobuckets and no description (except for Paul ). From a personal perspective I am also struggling with the interesting fact that the dealer(s) in question are folks with whom I have had numerous transactions with. Of those transaction two had minor problems which were quickly rectified. And by the way, all my watches go out to Ziggy shortly after receipt so I know what is going on inside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V Posted January 29, 2007 Report Share Posted January 29, 2007 TT- You have a good point. And if you guys are really willing to deal with it I applaud you. But we all remember that less than 18 months ago we were dependent on photobuckets and no description (except for Paul ). From a personal perspective I am also struggling with the interesting fact that the dealer(s) in question are folks with whom I have had numerous transactions with. Of those transaction two had minor problems which were quickly rectified. And by the way, all my watches go out to The Zigmeister shortly after receipt so I know what is going on inside. Same feelings here Warren.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts