panerai153

Look at the dial indices at 3 compare it to the crown, it's definitely off. Looks like the dial is about half a click rotated clockwise. If you had a date window, you could really see the problem. i would ask for another one as well.

this topic has been discussed in quite a lot of detail many times. xxmanxx, I would suggest that you do a search. However to save you a little time, I second what automatico said in spades. DO NOT believe any of the claims made by any of the rep dealers,period. Watches have been delivered with gaskets missing, casebacks barely finger tight, broken or missing O-rings, dry gaskets. The first thing that you need to understand about reps is there is almost no quality control. the watches are assembled by people who are untrained. They posess very limited horologic skills. many were assembling IPads or toasters the week before!! If you buy a genuine Rolex, it is pressure tested to limits beyond the depths on the dial. the rep of that watch was assembled and wrapped up in bubble wrap, shipped to you. No one pressure tests, they might say they do, but I wouldn't count on it. If you plan to swim, snorkel or scuba dive with your watch, I would invest in a genuine that you know was tested, or have your rep "waterproofed", and pressure tested at least to 120% of the depth you intend to dive.The biggest problem with that is most of the smaller "Wet" testers only go up to about 8 atmos, and most are 5-6 max. to get a really good deep test, it would require a "Dry" tester which is cvery expensive, and not found in every watch repair shop. I know that there are lots of members here who disagree. I have heard of several members that regularly scuba with their reps, but I can guarantee they spent some time and effort making sure they were water resistant. A couple of years ago, I pressure tested 10 of my reps. of the 10 tested, 6 passed and 4 failed,including a Rolex SD rep and 2 PAM reps that both had "submersible" on the dial or caseback. the 4th was a Ulysse Nardin black Surf Dive watch! All of my vintage MBW reps passed as well as a couple of newer SD reps and 16610 rep that I was giving to my son.I tested all of them to 5 atmos., which isn't nearly enough for any serious depth. Theyare fine for wearing at the beach. i don't worry about wearing them into the water, but past that, I use genuine for scuba.

That's very revealing. It's amazing that the printing is skewed like that. Probably everyone doing a build should take a really long hard look at their overlays before spending all that time and effort setting them up correctly on a date wheel, installing the movement and dial, only to realize that the DWO is off and can't be fixed. This is obviously what is wrong with mine. I just took six photos to send to another member. Dead straight on photos of the DW at 5,9,11,13,23,and 30. The double digits, especially the 11 and 13 were terrible.When you look at the dial straight on, it looks like the date is set at 1 and 3. At least with the 23 and 30 you can tell what the numbers are.

Unfortunately, this is and endless cyclic argument. it's like arguing religion, no matter what you say, no matter what statistics you quote, you are NOT going to convince the other side that they are wrong and you are correct. I respect the opinion of everyone here, but you folks from Australia and other parts of the world, as well as all of you from here in the states are not going to convince this old man that living in a gun free society is going to suddenly create some super safe utopian society. It would be great if it did, but It isn't going to happen. I have read too much history, and have seen first hand over my almost 7 decades on this spinning orb what happens when citizens give up their arms. It isn't pretty. While I am an advocate of gun owners rights, I do not see any reason for anyone except the military to posess fully automatic weapons. Sort of like having hand grenades, rocket launchers and shoulder fired missles, they don't have a place in anyones personal weapons collection.

Sometimes we get a little too anal for our own good. I'm speaking from experience, because it hits me all the time. I get hung up on one small detail, and it worries me to death. I'm not talking about flaws that you can see from 20 feet away, but little things that no one else would notice unless you pointed them out. One of our problems is we focus on the little "nit picking" things with our reps, but what we don't see are the differences in genuines as well. I would bet that if you picked up 10 genuine subs, just like yours, you would find a fair difference in the pressure needed to turn the bezel.

16233 is a Rolex watch reference number for a datejust. 455b is a common fake end link number. This one is a fake for sure, I bet when you open this one up, it will have a non Tudor movement to boot. Small possibility this seller doesn't know what he has, most of his other watches are other brands. however that doesn't excuse someone not doing their research before they list an item. And then again, possibly the guy is a little bit crooked, and he tries to slip one past unsuspecting buyers every now and then. Pretty apparent from his four negatives that he isn't always truthful in his descriptions. Run don't walk away from this one. Let some greedy buyer who thinks he's getting a real "Steal', buy this one.

You are correct, most gen owners don't know a thing about their watches except what the sales person told them when they bought the watch. That's pretty evident by the number of almost new watches that are traded in for another model and the owner can't produce the box or papers. I bet lots of folks buy a 10k Rolex and throw away the box and papers as soon as they get home. Ususally the second time around, they learn, because someone at the AD told them that they would have gotten more for their trade in if they had all the "Stuff" that came with the watch. Your guy with the 1665 probably bought it because he saw one on someones arm at a cocktail party, or business meeting and was told that owning and old vintage Rolex was the "Thing". Obviously, the fellow didn't have a clue as to what he had or the history behind the watch.

joey, there has to be someone here that has the tools and the expertise to make up some dial blanks with the date window in the correct place. that would be a great service to all of the folks who are modding Rolex vintage watches.

I agree with the vintage genuines, however, you are going to be hard presssed to find anything decent for less than 200 USD. Also old watches bought online may well need a service before use.

Matt. shipping to Canada is slower than shipping to almost anywhere in Europe!! I have shipped many packages to Canada, andi am amazed as to how slow the mail service is. i believe that the bottleneck is Canadian Customs. They are so darn obsessed with extracting every cent of import duty, they microscopically scrutinize every package,. I can send a package to Canada USPS Express mail, which would be overnight to any destination in the USA, probably 3-4 days to anywhere in Europe, and I guarantee it will take 10 -15 days to reach the recipient in Canada. I generally ship Priority Mail, but the cost has gotten so close, it's only a few dollars more to ship Express mail. Tracking is always problematic with the USPS. I sent and Express Mail package to Canada on Wednesday (2nd). The next day it showed MIAMI, FL, USA Thursday, January 3, 2013 4:47 PM PROCESSED THROUGH SORT FACILITY I doubt that I will see anything else until I get and email from the recipient notifying me that the package has arrived. Have patience, it will show up.

I live in the South, owning guns and hunting have been a way of life down here for generations. I Own guns, I don't hunt as much as I used to, just don't hate those critters like I used to, plus I hate getting up before dawn and sitting in a freezing cold duck blind for hours. I do enjoy getting out in the outdoors, in fact sometimes I go out alone and sit in the same blind, but in mid day when it's warmer, and I take a camera and binoculars instead of a shotgun. While I do own one semi automatic "assault rifle", I really don't see any need to have 30 round clips. In fact anyone who practices and gets good with a particular firearm, can change 10 round clips and keep firing almost as fast as the guy shooting the 30 round. Why do I have an assault rifle, and several handguns? Simply this, I live in a fairly isolated area, there have been a few home invasions in our area, all of them turned out bad for the homeowners, none of which were armed.That is the only reason I keep firearms in my house, other than rifles and shotguns that are strictly for hunting. In actuality,if one were looking for a home defense weapon, the best would be a short barrel open choke double barrel or pump shotgun with # 6 shot, From 10-15 feet, you don't have to aim, and the projectiles will not go through half a dozen flimsy walls if you miss. Am I a "gun nut" I really don't think so, I'm just a firearms owner who has guns and supports the rights of others to keep and bear arms. So what is the real problem. I think nanug expressed it very well. There are literally thousands of mentally unstable people walking around in society today, some of them are violent, some of them don't appear to be any different from their peers, but over time folks that are around them will know. One of the big problems is over the years, the federal and state governments have slashed mental health budgets to the bone. Years ago the grand scheme was to move people out of structured mental health facilities, and attempt to assimilate them into society. The problem is that hasn't worked, it's created a terrible problem, with homeless people people that have been abandoned by family and young people who need help, but cannot because the mental health facilities are so crowded and understaffed and under funded that patients spend weeks and months waiting for appointments. Medication is expensive, and most folks who need medications are not eligible for any government help. another problem, and the one that I believe is the more pervasive and ultimately more serious is the total lack of morals and conscience in our population. this has been fostered by the avalanche of extremely violent movies, video games and Television. Gratuitous Sex, violence and gristly killings are the everyday fare that we are inundated with today. Kids are assailed with this all day every day. They think that what they see on TV, what they play on their video games are in fact reality. And in a lot of cases, it does become their reality. killing a hundred people in a video game, or walking out of their house and killing 20 -30 people in a mall, school or on the street has the same reality, and elicits the same emotions. Is their a solution to the problem? Truthfully, I don't know. We have an almost complete breakdown in the family in our part of the country, probably 60-70 percent of the babies born are born into a single parent household. the fathers take off way before the baby is born and single mothers anf grandmothers bring up the children, so right off there is no father figure, and no one to establish rules and boundaries of discipline. Unfortunately, in a lot of cases, the father figure is replaced by a gang leader, who takes young boys in and teaches them the ways of the criminal. So here we have it, Loss of mental health facilities, movies, TV and video games that are filled with blood and gore, and finally the breakdown of the nuclear family. With all that's going on today, we are probably lucky that there aren't more killings.And I can promise you one thing, you can disarm the honest citizens, but the criminal will ALWAYS find a way to get a weapon, and it won't be a stick or a sword!

I can see the difference, i have a genuine Tudor 9411/0 and it has a 125.

I am getting confused with your left and rights, but I have seen this before and always thought..... MBW dial is specd to match gen 127 plexi. As such the cyclops and date window are right justified on this case (as you look at the face they are to the right side, to the CG's ) The eta 2846 calendar wheel is a little left justified as you look at it (to the cannon pinion). A custom/different DWO is the solution. It will never be perfect like say a 1570 under a 127, but it can be a lot better. Best to contact the guys above who are making custom overlays just now? 1570 under NDT dial and gen plexi in MBW case... That's the case with my 1665, it has a genuine 1575,gen spec dial and gen datewheel, no problems at all everything is dead centered. i do see what you are saying though, if this dial is a tad smaller than the genuine dial, it puts the cyclops closer to the right side of the dial. This watch has a genuine 127 plexi, but if you look at the date window through the cyclops dead on straight, the date window itself is not centered in the cyclops, it is definitely left justified, and not just a tiny bit, but noticably so if you are looking at the Date window directly. Anyone have a spare silver DW overlay sitting around? I think that the only way to correct this problem is to get a proper size DW overlay and align it correctly. Thanks everyone for the valuable input. If I can find a silver DW overlay, I have someone who can take the watch apart and align the overlay properly.

Nothing out the box is going to look like the genuine, period! you need to spend some time doing research as Freddy said, and then plan on spending a fair amount of money getting the watch modded to resemble the genuine. I said resemble, because no matter what you do, the reps are not going to be a genuine, unless you use all genuine parts A really good dial, good hands, genuine insert,crown/tube etc will go a long way toward making a representative watch, but parts aren't cheap, so you will have a fair amount in the watch before you get finished. Nice thing about the 6536/8, Tudor 7924, etc is there are no date window, cyclops date wheel alignment problems like you find on the 1680,1665 and 6542 and other date dial watches.

Surprise,surprise, when he turned on the mictowave, flash fried watch!!!

Wearing my "9 day" 1680

Looking at the watch, it looks like filing down the Date Window could be problematic, as it might put the edge of the Date window past the edge of the cyclops. If this is a DW and not and overlay, how could that be realigned? I'm not sure if it is or isn't an overlay. Another thing that is odd, I just scrolled through all the dates, the 30 and 31 are both perfect, a couple of numbers in the 20's are marginally OK, as are a couple of the numbers in the 10's. If this is a DW overlay, would not the numbers opposite the ones that are very right justified, be more to the left?

Thanks, I was mixed up, for some reason I thought I remembered someone saying years ago that the gen dial was smaller, and would just drop right through the case. Must have had a couple of glasses of fermented grape that night!! My dial is the MBW white, and It has a silver datewheel, can't remember if it came on the watch or not. I have had this one for a long time, seems like i got it back in 2006, bought it off a guy that was here briefly, college student from Florida, needed money for Dental school! I believe that the most feasible thing to do would be to enlarge the date window. i t would only need to be filed down 1mm, which would make all the difference in the world. i'm pretty sure the DW that's on the watch is not and overlay, but a silver DW. Now all I need is to find someone who can do the job!! It's really a shame, this is a really nice watch, everything possible short of a genuine dial,hands and movement have been done, which i really don't see as economically feasible on a 1680. If I wanted to spend another 2k on the watch, i would sell this one and use that money to buy a genuine.

One thing that drives me crazy is a datewheel that isn't aligned properly. I know that lots of folks agonize over inserts, crown guards,Crowns, etc, not me so much as a crappy DW alignment. I'm not sure what causes the problem other than there being enough variation is dial size and date window placement that some date wheels just don't line up properly. Case in point is my 9 day watch, and otherwise great 1680. It started out as a stock MBW "old skool" 1680, got the treatment from Ziggy, including a swap to a 2846 movement, genuine crown/tube, insert and tritium pearl, genuine top hat 127 crystal and a genuine 93150 bracelet,springbars, lugholes drilled. The only problem is the date wheel is so far right justified, almost half of the 2 in the numbers from 20-29 are outside the date window. The 1's from 10-19 are so far over, you might mistake the 19th for the 9th. So that's why it's a 9 day watch, it's fine from the 1st thru the 9th, but not so good after that.It has a beautiful silver DW, correct fonts open 6's and 9's, but it just ain't right!! What's the solution? I was told that the MBW dial is bigger than a genuine spec dial, which if everything were kept in proportion, would make the date window further over in relation to the DW. I've been hoping that higho would get his cases out into the market place, as it is supposed to be a genuine spec case. possibly a smaller dial would solve the problem, but you can't use one in this case. I don't think that a dial of this size with the date window over further to the right would look good either. What do you think? Any suggestions? Here is the 9 day watch!

They all have problems, what you have to do is decide which problem causes less concern for you and go with that one. If you put any rep DSSD next to a genuine, you can pick every one of them apart. Pick the one with the least number and least obvious flaws ( hopefully both on the same watch!!) Another thing to remember, when you look at photos taken under optimal conditions and lighting, and then blown up to at least 10X normal size, all flaws stand out, but in regular light, and normal size, some of the flaws will not even be noticable.

Thats a nice one, despite the grainy photos. Definitely need a gen crown. For some reason the puretime crowns are too big.CG trim, new crown, you're good to go.

This guy is a real scammer,nothing too bad could be wished on someone like this. I'm afraid i agree with Rolexman, you waited way too long to get this to anyones attention.Another thing, I don't know how long you've been around, but everyone needs to be aware when they are transacting business with other members. This is a community, a rather large community.Like every community, there aere super nice, super honest folks who wouldn't dream of taking advantage of another member. On the other end of the spectrum, are the folks who come here with the express intention of scamming other members. These are the worst of the worst. The community runs the gambit from the super honest to the complete crook, with every thing else in between. My advice, and it's too late for you, because the horse is out the barn and 10 miles down the road, is do your due diligence. ask a seller or trader for references. The honest seller will be happy to furnish references, or direct you to other forums where they are listed under "the good guys" section. Dishonest sellers will stall, try to make a "Better deal", anything to get your mind off finding out that he is dishonest.All of these are cliche's, but you need to "buy the seller, not the watch","If a deal sounds too go to be true, it probably is".Another thing to remember, unless you are buying a "one of a kind" object, or something is very rare, you can afford to walk away from a deal that looks suspicious, because sooner or later, another one of what you are trying to find will turn up, and more than likely from and honest seller.

I have used Rice, Heck we grow it, so we have plenty!!! it's good but messy, can't use it if the case is open,unless you put the watch inside a baggy, and that sort of defeats the purpose. A few years ago, i came across some moisture absorbant cannisters, filled with some sort of gel beads. They looked like round medicine capsules, inside a metal container with perforations all around. The nice thing about these was you could put them in an oven on very low heat, and they would dry back out so they are re usable. I certainly agree with everyone above, Drying it out is a first line of defense sort of thing, you have to find the problem. as Matt said, it needs to be uncased, cleaned and the movement inspected for rust or retained moisture, then it needs to be put back together properly and sealed, then pressure tested. Unfortunately, I believe that there are some reps that are impossible to make water resistant, tolerances aren't close enough, or they have too many water entry possibilities, like some chronographs for instance, two pushers, crown, caseback and crystal. Most can be sealed to the point that you can wash your hands, wear in rain,etc.And then there are those which are able to be sealed and made water resistant almost to factory specs of the genuine. Lots of the Rolex Subs, SD's, etc are easily water resistant to 5-8 atmos., which is adequate for most anything outside of extreme depths.

Higho, when are yours going to be ready? my 1680 is sitting in my watchbox waiting for a new case!! I'm not going to do anything else to it until i have a decent case thart solves the dial size problems.

phong is jewelryandwatch you can google that and get his website. Oh Heck, here's the link http://www.jewelryandwatch.com/index.html you have to register on his website to see the prices, but i believe the bracelet was 300.00 USD, but I'm not sure.