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I make jewelry, and I found that if you have two different materials ( brass is hard, the epoxy soft), it is difficult to sand them both flat together. Even on a perfectly smooth surface. The soft epoxy will want to move/tear while the hard brass will achieve the finish you will soon see a concave hole in the epoxy. Better to solder the holes with quality silver solder or copper colored solder.

Soft solder is very soft and porous, difficult to sand smooth. So I recommend silver solder, ( just sharing in case others try). Silver solder will give a higher quality finish to help achieve which ever texture/finish needed. There is a copper colored solder you can buy, but it won't be a perfect color match to brass. I can't find a link to copper colored solder but beading makers and jewelers get it online. But here is good quality silver solder I get from hardware store. But you will need a perfectly clean dial for solder to flow, and the challenge of quality silver solder is that the required temperature is high. You can't use an electric solderer. So that might be why some are recommending to fix the holes with epoxy. You could melt the brass dial if you are new with hard soldering with torches. But it's easy with practice. http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1382484&KPID=1133536&cid=CAPLA:G:Shopping_-_Solder1_-_New&pla=pla_1133536&k_clickid=978fed33-3a9f-4cb0-9019-5cbcfdef9478

Can't wait to see how the gold leaf under the decal dial turns out. You have given me so much inspiration, and confidence to continue working on my dial project. Thanks for documenting your projects. Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk The gold leaf tends to wrinkle easily while applying. Also if the sheet breaks you may end up with an overlapped area. That may make the surface non smooth and those variations might be enhaced by the decal. Just my 2 cents. Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

Ready for a gold dial [emoji632]

wow thats exactly the info I was looking for. The factories actually copied the gen rolex design? Impressive! No wonder the endlinks looked like they were really nicely fitted. Thank you! Is this the shape they copied?

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Is this still about dealing with Phong? Phong is by far the best case we can get for our hobby. I know TC is cheaper. I know TC is great. But that is one watch. I can tell you holding a TC case and a phong case together is completely a difference in the quality. TC had caught up on a lot. Bevel edges. The new bezel, I can't wait to see. But if we start looking at 5513 and 1680 and daytona. We don't have much choice and I don't want them. Cartel cases are few and far between. At least the ones that meant anything. The newer ones are far off. Now I don't understand the anti Phong. Phong is a bit of an old pain a lot of the time but I can't think of one time he has not come through in repair. One time he was flying out that evening and got a case sent to me next day. He has made mistakes, but who hasn't. Heck I ordered a TC case and it took two months to get and when I got it the lugs were a joke. One was half the size of the other and the top had the same issue. I brought it up to him and it took another two months to come back with a case almost as bad. Phong is a lot. He has the machinery and he has the knowledge. His son is amazing. That is who I have been using. My last 16800, 1680, 5513 X2, and my new daytona are all coming from him. He has not let me down and he is a gentleman to talk with. Never leaves you wondering then bam the case is there. He lets you know every step of the way. Is it pricey. Yes. If I buy a $25,000 C and C machine. Spend or have an employee spend hours to soften the case, I am not selling it for $500. I do believe that the prices are high but if your like me and everything else besides the case is going to be Rolex, I sure in heck want a case that will water seal and work as a real one will. I Have been luck to find a real 16700 case and a 16800 and a 16610 case on ebay. Yea they were crazy prices. I think the least costly one was the 16800 one and it was $1700. Not far from what phong charges. But it they were available every day then Phong would be out of business. Also to ease mines. I have a buddy here in Orange county that took his Sub to get serviced by a Rolex Watchmaker. The store no longer is a rolex dealer but the watch maker is still a rolex watch maker. He serviced his sub with a Phong case. No issue. I told him he was nuts and that he was going to get it taken and everything. $650 dollars later. He has a beautiful 16610 polished and everything. So Just saying. They are good at what they do and I will continue to use them. If you would like to spend $350 on a Cartel if you can still find one of the old Cartels go for it. Its a great case. That is the best thing of this hobby. We can all do what we want how we want. Take a Invicta case and mold it to a sub case. If it looks good. It looks good. But to blast a dealer we have here and someone who helps a lot of us. Its just wrong. IMO.

Little Red and Blue today

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Hi Rick Yes the newer cartel case, CG's squared off on the inside and softened on the outer edges. Apart from that lug holes drilled 1.3mm, aging polishing aging polishing.......Cartel bezel slightly lowered with gen insert which snapped straight in. I've found that if you make the tension spring as flat as possible then it holds it firm, do not bend it otherwise there isn't enough edge to catch the bezel firm. You could always buy a proper tension spring and just lower the bezels height by sanding it down. Cheers DH Same as gen at roughly 117grams

yes, see andrew at www.trustytime01.com and look under rolex daytona. also, there is a trusted dealer section here in the forum.

Why do you not remove the xtal while you are working on the case? I think you need a better fitting set of hands & some enhanced patination on the case (so it matches the faded insert), but, otherwise, nice work.

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I will say that I have brought a lot of cases from both Phong and his son Jensen. I'm not talking 2 or 3. I have been very happy on them all but one. But out being retired if someone is willing to point me in the direction of how I can get my hands on the machinery to make cases. I am more than happy to learn how to make them. I did did attempt to have them make me a 16710 case. Phong wants me to buy 10 and supply my real 16710 case that he would return to me. His is son was a lot more reasonable. He wanted me to send him my real one and in return I would get my real one back and I would get a discount on the 5 I had to order. If i knew how to do it I would make them myself. Would love to learn. He wanted my watch and 1/2 of the $. To me that pissed me off. I was paying and giving him what he needed to make a case. All he heads are the contacts. Nothing out of his pocket. Then he wants to charge 1450 a case. I brought my real case complete with crystal and bezel and back for $1800. That aside. They by far make the best copy for a 16800 16610 5513 1680. Ok they might need a little more case work to be perfect but every thing real Rolex fits like it was made for it and it seals. I'm on a cruise right now and took my 16800 driving. I hit 100 feet easy on the dive and watch is holding like a charm. I also do have to say that a TC case is an amazing 16610 case for the money. I have comparison pics over at RWI. Having them both in front of me, bare, nothing on them yet you can see the quality of the phong case. Machine markings, sharpness. But for the $500 -$700 difference you can make it nicer than a phong. By by far the best copy 16610 case I have ever seen in this world is a TC case worked up. I sold it out of laziness because i didn't want to change the phong case. As as far as using a TC case for a 16800. It won't work. You can make a old 16610. But the rehaut is completely different on the 16800 and the 16610. Crystal are the same but the depth isn't. So the date looks larger on a 16800. Plus you can't stick a 3035 in a TC case. Being on a cruise I can't upload pics of a 16610 and 16800 rehaut. But it is very noticeable how different they are. TC makes an amazing case for the money. But when all is said and done at the end of the day a phong case is the way I go. I have stop dealing with dad and I just deal with Jensen. But after the whole 16710 I think I am going to be looking for a new case maker or just start doing them myself or just buy real. I have seen them on eBay for $1800- $2500 and they are real. Why would I pay $1450 for a fake? Especially when I only need 2.

That is my favorite watch of all time you have there and it looks awesome on the new strap.

002-009 genuine dial = several thousend dollar when somebody is willing to remove this dial from the watch, which costs 14.000 - 25.000 who is giving such advices ??? R