droptopman Posted July 27, 2015 Report Share Posted July 27, 2015 Good afternoon, Some of you know I have been shopping for a genuine 1966 GMT with gilt dial for quite a long time. After looking everyday at multiple sources for over a year, I (actually a friend on the forum) found the perfect watch the other day, and I mean perfect. 1966 1675 with original gilt dial and hands. Small GMT hand. Fat font with fade....good case set, great bracelet, everything was perfect. I finally found the perfect birth year grail piece and contacted the seller only to find out that this was a scam. Some of you may have seen this piece on VRM. So back to the search. Being somewhat frustrated, I started looking at new pieces again and find that out of the modern Rolexes, I really like the 116710 BLNR the best in my price range--I prefer the white gold Pepsi but will not pay that much for a watch. Blue is my favorite color and the blue GMT hand and touch of blue on the insert are appealing to me. So I reached out to some friends to get prices and availability. Here is the dilemma: A friend has quoted me an excellent price on a brand new BLNR from an AD. So just when I am ready to commit to this, I check one of the vintage sales sites again this afternoon and a 1966 1675 has appeared that was not there this morning. It is not a grail piece collector item gilt dialed model, but a "everyday" matte service dial and hands, but in good shape overall and is half as much as the hard to source gilt or new BLNR. So when I weigh out the pros and cons it is really hard to decide. Vintage Pros: coolness, thinness, classic, timeless, increase in value, lighter, more comfortable, fits my casual lifestyle, birth year piece Cons: fragile, no warrantee, hard to get parts, can be expensive to service Modern Pros: warrantee, reliability, easy to access, dress or casual Cons: decrease in value, anyone can get one, bigger and heavier Not sure what I am asking, I tend to be too analytical/logical and sometimes need to write things out and bounce them of others. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomhorn Posted July 27, 2015 Report Share Posted July 27, 2015 As long as the price is reasonable, I'd go vintage. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted July 27, 2015 Report Share Posted July 27, 2015 Reading between the lines, you're really looking for a birth year vintage piece. But you want the right watch to hurry up and appear, so you're frustrated. You're considering something else as a "solution" to scratch the itch. Don't ever do that. It's not the piece you're looking for, and you will sell it later, lose money on the deal, and regret it, And you'll be right back to where you are today. I've done this many times, buying something that's "almost good enough" and every time I've sold it, lost money, and regretted it. If something is worth having, it's worth working and waiting for. Every one of my keepers involves at minimum 4 years of watching and waiting. One of them was almost 20 years. In the end, it's nice to have the right one. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pam007 Posted July 27, 2015 Report Share Posted July 27, 2015 2 totally different watches. vintage has a many magical qualities. 1. It's light and flies under the radar 2. It's got history... boy if it could talk... 3. perfect size and comfort for my wrist of 7 inches 4. patina patina patina modern has many magical qualities 1. it's ugly 2. it's fat 3. it's blingy 4. it's heavy If it was me, I would get a rep of the 116710 and see how you like it. It's 90% same as crappy gen, and It's only a couple hundred bucks. Much harder to get get a good rep of a 1675 gilt. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcardoza Posted July 27, 2015 Report Share Posted July 27, 2015 If it's not the exact piece you are looking for, pass and wait. You won't be happy when your grail does show up! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpz5142 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 I think you've already made up your mind on the vintage piece when you said "It's not what I'm looking for..." As someone that's been where you are, getting something that's not quite what I want as a way of scratching that itch always ends up costing me money in the long run. On the otherhand you always end up selling every modern rolex that you've bought since being on this forum, this BLNR is likely to be the same. You like vintage pieces plain and simple, I'd vote on holding off on either watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike on a bike Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 A lot of good advise but the answer maybe neither. I have come to the realization that I have no grail per say: I like I buy and then it is over on to the next the cost is relevant to an extent but when all said and done not really. You can get either or but then you will want another maybe not the one you did not choose in this instance. I envy those who have come to the point where they are happy with what they have, hoping to get there one day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike on a bike Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 By the way if you are going to do it vintage all day long IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
occb2 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 We spoke about this yesterday. It goes back and fourth. I am a modern guy with watches. Now modern to me is the 90's to right before the ceramic. That by far IMO was the best time rROlex prospered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted July 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Awesome responses and right on point. Thank you! Funny thing the seller of the 1675 (well known vintage seller) basically told me the same thing. Wait for the one you are really after. I do know I would be happy with a BLNR but not done. I would still end up going for a vintage gen. If I get the vintage gen I don't see myself buying a modern one. Part of the attraction to the BLNR is the price is so good and from a very trusted source. The attraction to this particular 1675 even though not the grail piece is its from a seller who sells a ton of vintage pieces so my thinking was to buy this one stay on the wait list for the gilt and trade it in where the other appears... I would just build one (franken) but GMT's are next to impossible without spending gen money. Makes no sense to spend 6k on a rep of a 10k watch. The 6538 was different because I would not spend what it takes to get a gen. I think I need meds. Sent from my droptop using telepathy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightwatch Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Imho go for the vintage and keep looking for the grail, nothng beats vintage&gilt:) On the other hand: "The attraction to this particular 1675 even though not the grail piece is its from a seller who sells a ton of vintage pieces so my thinking was to buy this one stay on the wait list for the gilt and trade it in where the other appears..." this seems like a very good idea to me too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 My take on it...Rolex will be manufacturing current catalog references every day/every month/every year for years to come.Vintage pieces aren't being made any longer...As you've discovered, finding that grail vintage piece for you has become quite difficult and will only continue to become more and more elusive; 10 years from now, I bet you'll still be able to get a 116710 BLNR for a decent price...I say keep up the hunt and find that needle in the haystack! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 I think that you have been offered some wonderful advice, everything that I would have said has been covered. Like MOAB and others I have found over the years that buying the "compromise or second choice" is never satisfactory. I have done this with watches and other things, and in every case, I wasn't happy with the purchase and moved it along pretty quickly. You know what you want, and I would keep searching. If you want something in the interim, that's fine but it's not the end result and you will never be satisfied until you get what you really want. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike on a bike Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Problem is you really want it at the time once you get it............................... Much the same is our large group of builders: the hunt is part the fun (sourcing parts) then the satisfaction of building yourself a bit later on the sales section. Then on to the next one taking a hit on cost just like those of us who serial buy/sell. In the end the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted July 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Thank again. I love this community. What a great benefit it is to be able to bounce ideas off my watch friends. How true, much of it is the hunt. I am not sure why I have the itch so bad. Matt is working on three builds for me this week, but none are GMT's...I have a nice franken GMT now, but the case drives me nuts. Just about any other model and I would just do a build. Still weighing out my decision. Being I already have some genuine parts, I am leaning towards buying the 1675 and adding a couple of my parts to it to improve it, then will continue to search for the all original gilt grail piece. Even a service dialed gen is still a gen and should hold or increase in value so when the "one" shows up I can sell or trade this one. I have a good idea of market value on these since I have been looking so often, and this is priced well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogladio Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Thank again. I love this community. What a great benefit it is to be able to bounce ideas off my watch friends. How true, much of it is the hunt. I am not sure why I have the itch so bad. Matt is working on three builds for me this week, but none are GMT's...I have a nice franken GMT now, but the case drives me nuts. Just about any other model and I would just do a build. Still weighing out my decision. Being I already have some genuine parts, I am leaning towards buying the 1675 and adding a couple of my parts to it to improve it, then will continue to search for the all original gilt grail piece. Even a service dialed gen is still a gen and should hold or increase in value so when the "one" shows up I can sell or trade this one. I have a good idea of market value on these since I have been looking so often, and this is priced well. Assume you've seen this "upgrade kit"? http://www.network54.com/Forum/207673/message/1438088190/FS-+1675+gilt+single+swiss+dial EDIT: Sorry droptopman, missed the "1966" and not just "gilt"... Wish you all the best finding what you seek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted July 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Assume you've seen this "upgrade kit"? http://www.network54.com/Forum/207673/message/1438088190/FS-+1675+gilt+single+swiss+dial EDIT: Sorry droptopman, missed the "1966" and not just "gilt"... Wish you all the best finding what you seek Good catch my friend and thanks for the link. This is a nice set for an earlier model. Ultimately I am after something like this 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc33 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Don't limit yourself to a gmt for the birth year watch imo, find any 66 Rolex and make that your birth year watch maybe. As for modern... it's a must for me personally to have one gen modern Rolex in my collection at any given time. I may swap it often or I may not, either way it's important for me to have something new and waterproof for those rainy days or when going for a swim etc. I don't see why you can't do the same, as long as you can afford it. If it's a case of one over the other I'd of course pick vintage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imajedi Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 If you keep the modern one long enough, eventually it will become vintage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
occb2 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 That is beautiful. Problem is that it would sit in my winder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mendota Explorer Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 (edited) There is some fantastic advice in here. I think this applies to myself, as well, so I also want to thank everyone who has responded. It really makes a lot of sense. Have you had a chance to speak with any of the dealers over on TRF about sourcing a LNIB or even a gently used BLNR? My concern for you is that once the appeal of the modern GMT wears off, having bought it BNIB from an AD sets you up for a big depreciation hit no matter what kind of "deal" you are able to get on it. It is still new and from an AD, i.e. sales tax is involved. There are people who dream about the BLNR and this is their grail. You aren't one of those people. It's all right, but you aren't clipping out magazine ads of it, making it your screen saver or background wallpaper, and you aren't stopping into an AD every week to drool over it in the case. Since this watch most definitely is not your grail and you have no intention of keeping it for life and handing it down as an heirloom, you don't have time on your side to make up for the depreciation hit and then propel you forward as this piece itself becomes vintage in the future. 40 years from now it won't matter whether you paid $6K, $7K or $8K for it. It will be vintage and there will be some value there. If you flip it 2, 3, or even 5 years from now you are going to take a hit. At least buying it already used will help soften that blow by giving you a lower starting point, and you also won't have paid any sales tax. Added bonus. You already have a great GMT in your rotation. I'd just stick with that to scratch the GMT itch whenever it arises and continue waiting until the right piece comes along. It will, eventually, and by that time the wait will be well worth it. It will have much more meaning and value to you at that time. Buy the newest rep of the 116710 and see if you like the feel of the watch over the course of a month or so in your rotation. That will help scratch any modern GMT itch you might get from time to time. The current BLNR insert stinks, so I definitely wouldn't get that one yet until Noob updates it, but the latest black insert is really nice. By getting that one you at least get a good feel for what the modern watch feels like on the wrist and how it fits in with your daily wardrobe and lifestyle. As I think about how I would like my own watch box to look for GMT movements, I think I'd go gen 16570 polar, stick with a rep ceramic 116710, and then go gen 1675 and franken 6542. Edited July 28, 2015 by Mendota Explorer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beachcomber Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 I would never buy a new Rolex, everyone has one and they're all the same. Vintage has something new will never have and that something is coolness plain and simple. No reason why parts should be a problem since the movements are pretty much the same and you can always get parts. I own a '76 1680 and have had vintage pieces running in the 10s of thousands but for me this plain old 1680 fits the bill. A '66 is still within reach but if you wait too long it won't be, vintage prices will always increase in value. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc33 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Modern is fun if you buy used at a good price, they have a certain build quality and can be flipped easily without a loss if you"re smart about it. fun pic from today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
436NR Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 I asked a similar question some time ago... Well almost. I was offered to purchase a SE Breitling at a hugely reduced price from an AD. Very tempted! This same community came to me when I asked the question. The answer was simple; is it your grail watch? No. Is it a good investment? No. '66 is my birth year as well, so I understand what it means to you. 66 Mustang… Check! This is a great group of people, and some great advice! But I think you already knew that as well as the answer. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
droptopman Posted July 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Modern is fun if you buy used at a good price, they have a certain build quality and can be flipped easily without a loss if you"re smart about it. fun pic from today Ok homie...what model. I even looked at the Rolex site for that bezel. Sent from my droptop using telepathy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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