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There are a few guys on RWI who do case work so you might read up on RWI and see who's who. I learned how to do much of the case work on my own but it ain't easy and if you make a mistake, the case may be ruined or ugly as a wet rat. In reality, you have three options: 1...Learn to do it yourself. 2...Find $omeone to do what you want done. 3...Buy the best example you can find at your price and live with it. I used to be an 'option 1 guy' but burned out/wised up and am now an 'option 3 guy'. I will qualify that statement by saying my expectations are probably lower than many/most RWG members because I came to the conclusion a long time ago that 95% of people you know or come in contact with cannot tell a $200 replica from a $3000 replica. The people you know will say "NIce replica" after you tell them what it is and maybe ask a few questions about it. They will assume any watch you are wearing is a replica thereafter. The people you do not know might comment on the watch and if you tell them it is a replica, most of them will mentally or verbally label you as a scam artist of the lowest order. If you tell them "It is genuine" they will figure it is a replica anyway and go on about their business. A few may ask "How can you tell?" and others might ask "Where can I get one?" I just say "Dunno, I got it from a friend"...after all, I see this 'friend' in the mirror every day so I am not lying. https://forum.replica-watch.info/forums/vintage-watches.232/

Some batt swaps are much worse than others. To change the batt on my old 'front loader' Ebel: 1...Remove five little bitty 18K (soft!) screws holding the bezel on the case. 2...Remove the bezel/crystal in one piece, keeping track of O ring gasket between bez/case. 3...Remove the minute hand, there is no SS hand. Removing the H hand is optional. Q...Optional? A...The H wheel and H hand will come off with the dial if you leave the H hand on. 4...Remove the dial. 5...Push the detent button on the TOP side of the movement and remove the stem/crown. 6...Remove the mvt, turn it over, change the batt. 7...Assemble in reverse order. When all original, the local 'Authorized AD' wanted $140USD. Plus tax. Pic of watch and movement swap story... Wristies - thread consolidation? - Page 244 - General Discussion - RWG Post is 15 down from top. The batt change procedure was basically the same before the original movement was swapped out.

They might have to short out all their batteries to keep warm. This winter, Switzerland may have to ban the use of electric vehicles (EVs) if its current energy crisis worsens, as part of a new four-step plan to avoid power outages according to the Telegraph. If Switzerland runs out of energy this winter, electric cars won’t be allowed to be used for “non-essential” trips. Due to its dependence on imports, Switzerland fears an energy crisis this winter. About 60% of Switzerland’s energy comes from hydroelectric power, according to the Telegraph. Another 30% is generated from nuclear power plants, which the government has already decided to phase out. Traditional fossil fuels and wind farms make up the remainder of Switzerland’s energy sources, according to Euro Weekly News. Shops may need to reduce their hours, streaming services may need to be limited, and buildings may only be heated to 20 degrees Celsius, or 68 degrees Fahrenheit. Other bans, according to the Telegraph, may include concerts, theater performances, and sporting events, all to prevent a blackout. Looks like Rock 'n Roll groups will have to go acoustic without amps. Additional measures like escalators and holiday lights getting turned off, leaf blowers getting silenced, and cryptocurrency mining getting banned are also included in the plan. "NO batt-batt cars for YOU!" Meanwhile, my 300HP 4X4 SUV is out in the driveway, all gassed up and ready to go on 'non-essential' trips.

"According to the linked thread on building w/ V23, there could be a movement height difference..." From the Ranfft website: Valjoux 23 13''', Dm= 29.5mm, Do= 30.0mm H= 5.82mm F= 0.5mm T= 1.6mm 17 jewels f = 18000 A/h 1916-1974 since 1938 with two pushers Valjoux 72 13''', Dm= 29.5mm, Do= 30.0mm H= 6.95mm F= 1.62mm T= 2.72mm 17 jewels f = 18000 A/h 1938-1974 early samples: Breguet hairspring

"...a vain attempt to stem the flow of increasingly accurate (& difficult to ID as 'fake') Rolex clones coming out of Asia." I agree. No doubt this is a problem for them. I bet if truth be known, RWC really does not care very much because they would most likely have no sympathy for someone buying a rolex brand watch from anyone other than one of their ADs. Where they might be bothered is knowing that when a buyer pays the genuine rolex price and gets a replica or Frankenstein, they may be soured on the rolex brand from then on. Selling 'certified' used rolex watches at ADs will help the AD make $$ during a decreased supply of new watches and cut down on 'rep is real' deals. Buyers know what they are getting when they pay $400 for a $10K watch from an internet site selling 'swiss made replicas', but when someone gets the green weenie in a 'rep is real' deal, it can turn buyers against the brand.

Minnie Mouse! Make that Thinnie Mouse! It is 29.6mm thick and weighs 339 grams with a very short bracelet. A friend bought thus thing at a pawn shop 'needing a battery'. He brought to me for a new battery, I looked it over and it needed a coil, circuit board, negative battery contact, battery insulator, case back gasket, and a battery (Harley Ronda GMT mvt with adjustable 24H hand). Someone tried to change the batt and ran a screwdriver through the coil, then took the top cover plate off, ruined the circuit board somehow, folded up the batt contact, lost the batt insulator, and stuck it back together. Invicta AD maybe. I asked if he wanted it fixed and he said: "How much?" I said: "Fifteen dollars, cash or trade." (I am famous for overpriced repairs) He said: "It's yours." I fixed it.

"Some of the equipment to make these high quality elaborate replicas can be as expensive as those used. by genuine production factories themselves!" My (educated) guess is some of the replica cases/bracelets/dials etc. are made in the same facilities that make cases/bracelets/dials etc. for genuine brands and the machines are programmed to make extremely accurate replicas during late hours etc. Example...Swatch and many other swiss brands have cases/dials/bracelets etc. made in China, I remember about ten years ago when eBay was flooded with steel 'Tissot' quartz chronographs, new with B/P for about one third of the genuine watch price. The quick and easy way to tell the replica from a genuine watch was the price. I had one, ETA movement and all, it even had a 'Tissot' owner's manual and 'History Book' with it. Here is a genuine example in case anyone sees one for sale... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJwoiiu0kYE There was more than one grade of these replica chronos, mine must have been from the top of the heap. China, Taiwan, Vietnam and a few other countries have factories that can make any of the watch cases etc. as accurate to genuine as the guy paying for them wants them to be. Take the USA for example: No doubt a first class job shop could duplicate a rolex case to 100% perfection. Q...Why has it not been done on a large scale, that we know of? A...Because labor here is many times higher than China/Taiwan etc. so it is not worthwhile. It is also more risky because RUSA would chase them down one way or another as soon as word got out. No one can keep a good secret. RWC does not have much clout in China/Taiwan/Vnam. This brings me back to the genuine rolex replacement '444' cases...a detailed Yuki 5512-5513 case (for example) from a few years ago with a '444' serial number would more than likely pass for genuine. I saw a few at a watch show with genuine movements, case tubes/crowns/dials/hands and no doubt they would pass as genuine. Q...How do I know they were not genuine? A...I knew the guy who had them. I used a Yuki case for an example because other than a few small details, they are the spittin' image of a '444' case.

"This was my first self done dial and after spoiling three (wrong tools and lume mix) this one showed me the way of mixing UV resin and therefore control volume and shape with torch." I had a dial refinished as a California dial about 15 years ago and they charged $180 back then because of the lume hassles. Regular dials were $78 at the time. "I had sent you a Christmas gift." Got it. Thanks! The refinished Cal Dial...

"Mine has also the same case as yours but with screw down crown." Your watches are super nice! I really like the California dial. The 2782 in my BB has the calendar spacer and all calendar works removed as it originally came with quick set date. These watches might be small by today's standards but they are great everyday watches for that reason. "Wish I could source more of these 5015 cases!" For a while after I got mine, I would see one for sale now and then, but none were claimed to be genuine. Twenty years later they have become rare! and genuine!, even when sporting an ETA movement with a rlx sticker on the rotor. The 'BB' on eBay was the first one I have seen in a few years. No way I would pay $1331USD for one though. Ha! From the Ranfft website: 21600 A/h: 2750 / 2770, 2776: no date 2752 / 2772: date 2753 / 2773: date, precision regulator 2758 / 2778: day, date 2759 / 2779: day, date, precision regulator 2761 / 2781: quick set date, high 2762 / 2782: quick set date 2763 / 2783: quick set date 2763-F6 / 2783-F6: quick set date, digital 2768 / 2788: day, quick set date 2769 / 2789: quick set day and date 2769-1 / 2789-1: quick set day and date, double-language 28800 A/h: 2751 / 2771: no date 2754 / 2774: date 2760 / 2780: day, date 2764 / 2784: quick set date - / 2790 : quick set day and date - / 2790-1: quick set day and date, double-language - / 2791: quick set date, high

I do not blame you at all. It is the one and only reason why I staggered into replicas and Frankensteins. Now Bulova, one of my favorite brands, is refusing to sell parts. I do not know if it is Citizen policy or Bulova USA policy, and do not know if the Citizen brand sells parts in the USA or not. I have quite a few vintage Bulova watches and parts for them are still relatively easy to find on the 'net or from old school watch shops/traders, but their modern watch parts policy is now: 'NPFY'. I say to modern Bulova...No partee 4 mee = No Bulawatchee 4 mee = No Monee 4 you. FU2. As for rlx... I am slowly getting all rlx watches running or at least in one piece, then I will sell them all. Next...sell all the cases, dials, bracelets etc. Last...sell all movement parts to someone in the repair trade or a supply house. Have not decided about 2 or 3 F-steins with genuine movements, probably part them out. I understand why various brands will not sell parts to just anyone, but my guess is the real reason behind it all is to force owners to send their watches to 'factory authorized repair facilities' for high $$, slow, and sometimes shoddy service. A monopoly in other words. Omega...gave up on them in 1997. Bought a few low $$ bargains since then. Vintage Val etc powered chronos...Adios at the same time. Now have one vintage two register chrono and a few Val/ETA 7750 watches, do not wear them. Bulova Accutrons...same fate, same point in time but have accumulated a few bargains since then. I am Not an 'Accutron Accumulator' by any means.

Family photo... The one on the left is in the earlier post. The dials on the other two have a yellowish 'aged' tint. 'Super Oyster' crown... It does not look as bad as the close-up and is not a screw down type. The watch posted previously has been worn a few weeks total, the last time in late 2012. The other two have not been worn at all. I set aside two ETA 2789 to go in them, now needing c/o no doubt. That depends on if I can find them, did not run across them when looking for the watches.

"Do your other two have the same dial and hands as the one you pictured here?" Yes, they are all alike except the other two have BB type crowns. I'll see if I can find them later and post a pic. "Ever consider parting with one?" Not yet, the movements are pretty rough and do not run. If I decide to sell one, I'll contact you. "I took a look at what else he is selling and he has this one listed for 1900.00." That thing is ugly as a mud fence. How do they get by with it? No complaints probably. I have enough watchjunk to stick a half dozen F-steins together but I would end up eating turnips three times a day in a Ukrainian jail if I tried to sell one on fleabay.

"So what's your theory on the same SN?" Since all three of my 'BB' watches have the same reference and serial numbers, I would guess most or all of the replicas made by the same outfit that made mine will have the same numbers. Probably/maybe. I have seen a few replicas with engine turned bezels but do not know what the numbers were. Afaik these watches are all about 20 years old and I have not seen any new watches like this offered for sale in a long time. My other two are still nos from the same order as the one in my pics. The truth is these cases are very well made and many probably ended up with fresh ETAs or as Frankensteins. The dials on the examples I have seen have the SCOC blurb and originals usually have 'Officially Certified Chronometer', 'Chronometer', or no brag line at all on the dials. All the BB cases I have seen had 'snap in' crystals and were not clamped on the case by a removable bezel like later models, mine included. I had a nice genuine BB a while back needing some autowind parts and I traded it for a super fine Hamilton 992B and some other watch stuff. The aw assemblies on these things are junk imho. Back when BBs were Hot, I ran into one Frankenstein BB with a genuine case, dial, etc. and it had the original 'hubcap' over the back of the movement with a genuine BB rotor. The catch was it had a Bulova automatic movement hidden under the hubcap with a looong winding rotor axle sticking through the hubcap with the BB rotor mounted on it. It took a lot of time and botching skill for someone to do all of that. It's a good story but I can't tell it because there is a famous/infamous watch guy involved and dumbo me got in the middle of it, trying to help.

How Rare? So Rare that I only have three (3) of them. Three what? Three like this... RARE GENTS 1947 ROLEX OYSTER PERPETUAL BUBBLE BACK VINTAGE ETA MOVEMNT, WITH BOX | eBay Edit: 11-22-22 Someone might get/is going to get skinned. It is still up 11-19-22 for $1085USD at 1225PM EST with 32 bids. Item # 204155178414 SOLD! $1331.76!!! 38 bids on 11-20-22 Say what? Here is one, you'll have to take my word on the other two because I don't want to dig them out. Mine has a genuine 530 crown instead of a replica BB type (I installed a new case tube and swapped the rep crown out)... Same reference number... Same serial number. What are the chances of that? Pretty good...all of mine have the same number. They had rough ETA 27xx mvts in them when I bought the watches on Yahoo! auctions about 20 years ago. I put a fresh c/o ETA 2782 in this one... It is a good runner but it has been put up for so long it probably needs another c/o. These guys spotted it too... Is this what we've come to? - Rolex Forums - Rolex Watch Forum Maybe one of them will contact eBay.

A Disney Snap! watch. This was for a Kid but the Kid turned it down. Now it's mine, all mine. I drilled lug holes in the case and put a leather strap on it. The time is nine - two plus a notch, four.

"So, as Rolex continues to tighten their grip on parts & watches, making it more & more difficult for buyers to buy while pumping up prices beyond the reach of even the mere wealthy, I could see how rep makers could end up pulling the rug right out from under them." Regarding 'No Parts For You!' Since RWC cut parts off to parts supply houses and shut down almost all non AD parts accounts, I have seen a whole lot of high quality aftmkt movement parts become available. The majority of rlx watches I work on have 1530 base movements and just about all train wheels, springs, jewels, reversers, setting parts etc. are available for them now. You can't get aftmkt plates, bridges, or escapement parts (yet) but they are rarely needed. I was really surprised when reversers became available, but they are pricey and I don't need them anyway because I still have a few from back when I could get parts. On top of that, I rarely wear a rolex watch, real or imagined. I wore the 'shortcut 1655' more than I have worn a rolex watch since the 1970s and 1980s...back when tutones were in style. I took the 'SC 1655' apart a few days after Halloween so it's Frankenstein watch history now. Lately, I've been going First Class wearing a Disney Snap! watch with a clear plastic case after drilling lug holes in the case and putting a leather strap on it. It was for a friend's Kid but the Kid turned it down. Kids are Snobby nowadays. The Snap! is about 13 posts down. Wristies - thread consolidation? - Page 244 - General Discussion - RWG

"On a related subject -- have you had any experience working the new Asian 4130 clone movements? If so, what is your impression of them?" I have never seen one except in pictures but from what I have read they are pretty good movements. It seems the overall execution is very good but they took a few shortcuts and quality control is not up to par as usual. The flat hairspring escapement shortcut is Ok except it is a giveaway to being a replica at a glance along with a few other things, but this would not bother me at all. If the movement factories took a bit more care with cleanliness/assembly and offered repair parts through a reliable source, they would be an all-around success imho. I doubt RWC would look at it this way though. Ha! Otoh...if someone wants a 'Daytona!' I do not blame them for buying a replica with all the RWC and AD craziness...No Parts! to 'outsiders' etc, and their 'Esteemed Dealers' turning into outright robber barons often demanding suckers customers to buy 1 or 2 other high $$ items to 'qualify' for a hard to get model. Because of all this, it is easy to see why the rolex replica business is booming. As to the hand fix, it is fine as long as it works and looks good from the top side. I've pulled the tubes out of quite a few second hands when removing H, M, and SS hands all at once with a hand puller so I know how it goes. The opposite to shrinking hand tubes...I make hand hole sizing 'broaches' out of needles from a common assortment by reducing the diameter first on a Dremel with a diamond wheel, then file three flats on them by running them over a diamond knife sharpening hone until the size is what is needed. It's mostly trial and error but it is low $$ and easy to do. I make handles for them out of 1/4 inch wooden dowel stock from Ho' Depot etc.

Thanks for the link! "Chronograph hands, even gens (especially, after repeated r&rs), are notorious for having this problem (loose hands on their tubes) & I broke 1 of them while attempting to tighten the joint with my staking tool." I tighten hand tubes using 'WW' lathe collets. 1...Find the appropriate collet (one that the hand tube slips into with little friction). 2...Put the collet in the lathe and very lightly tighten the drawbar to squeeze the tube down. 3...Remove the hand from the collet and try it on the watch, repeat if needed. A small squeeze goes a long way so go lightly. If you do not have a WW lathe and collets, ask around to find a watch repair or watch hobby guy who has one. Since you are not running the lathe, most of them should let you squeeze hand tubes down in their lathe. My WW lathe is an old C&E Marshall Watch-Craft model that I bought for $75 years ago and the collets were donations from watch friends. The lathe is so old the power cord is a cloth covered two strand twisted wire. Sometimes you can run into an old WW lathe at a yard sale or flea market for very little $$. It's the collets they rob you on.

"I just finished overhauling my 2000-ish vintage Daytona after 20 years of trouble-free service." F333 Please let us know what movement, case etc. you started out with, or maybe post a link to an earlier post about it. I can't remember it, as usual...assuming I am on the right forum. Ha!

They lied and got caught. Panerai In-House Movements – A PAM Of Worms – Vintage Panerai and other iconic timepieces under the loupe at Perezcope

Mk1 dial images... Rolex 70's Genuine Submariner Date 1680 Mark I Tritium Matte Dial Excellent Patina ORIGINAL MK 1 Lemrich (chrono-shop.net) Fs: 1680 Mk1 lemrich dial - perfect conditions - complete with set of hands | WatchCharts DW case with 1570/75 and Lemrich Mk1 dial, Dial is original with the Lemrich trademark stamped on the back. 'ROLEX' script... 660/'SCOC'... T<25 etc... Example of the Lemrich trademark (from eBay)... Also... High quality fake vintage Rolex dials - Rolex Passion Report

Here is a Lemrich 1680 Mk1 dial but the pic is fuzzy. Fifth post down. Rolex Wristies thread - Page 139 - The Rolex Area - RWG I can post a better pic if it would help.

"how would you rate these hands?" Compared to the 'affordable' hands I have seen available now, they are very good...much like what is on my 'shortcut 1655' now. The main difference being your minute hand is a little bit narrow compared to mine. 'WatchLume' had very good hands for $55 a set but no longer have them.

I am still trying to find a set of '1655' hands to fit a rlx 1575 mvt with 24 hour GMT hand for my 'shortcut 1655' project watch. I need oem spec hands and have one pretty good aftmkt set on the shortcut watch but want to use them on another project. As I posted before, I got a figure of $380 delivered from MQ for his aftmkt '1655' hands and that was too much $$ for me so I bought a set from WSO to see how they 'stack up'. I had already bought a set from WSO for an ETA 28xx GMT but they are the wrong color and the hole sizes are off too much for the 'sc 1655' They are good quality. WSO hands for rlx 1575/GMT info: 1...They are the wrong color...oem are black/white and the WSO rlx cal 15xx hands are black/silvertone. 2...The WSO rlx '1655' hands were a little bit better than the ETA 28xx hands because the lume slots were not quite as long but the colors are still a problem, they are also good quality. The lume slots are a bit too wide but there is no fix for that. The best part is they cost $38.36 delivered...10% of the MQ price. What's next? They will have to be stripped, re-painted, and re-lumed. I'll post pics if and when they are re-finished but it may be a while because I have not stopped looking for reasonably priced aftmkt '1655' hands that are closer to oem. WSO hands for rlx 15xx (pictured in plastic bags)... The 24H hand is Ok and only needs the lume aged or changed. The H and M hands appear to be all black, but from the beginning of the lume slots to the tips, they are silvertone. No pic of the SS hand but it is a 'dot' hand and I'll use a 'no dot' hand. The 'shortcut' 1655 as it is now... To be honest...I am on the verge of giving up on another '1655' project. Q...Why? A...Because a correct rlx 1575 GMT mvt with genuine GMT parts alone is worth about as much as the same movement in a J&Wcom case/dial. Q...Why? A...The 'shortcut 1655' watch is worth maybe $2500/$2700 and a 'correct' rlx GMT 1575 movement in a J&Wcom case is not worth much more. Q...Why? A1...Because a replica is a replica no matter what mvt is in it. The 'value' is killed by it being a replica. A2...No matter how good it looks, that one word kills it (unless you are a crook). A3...Truth is, the 'shortcut 1655' is good enough for me. After all, I'm wearing a quartz '5513'. Ha!

"if you swapped the rep dial/handset/crown for gens (a relatively simple, albeit costly, operation), I doubt anyone -- well, save for the most neurotic watch savant -- would even have cause to time the movement of the sweep seconds hand." I didn't even notice it until I read up on the movement. I was happy not needing to wear or wind it. Ignorance is bliss. When I hear the word 'oysterquartz' it conjures up images of high $$ dead coils, step motors, and circuit boards. I took three (3) in trade over the years and was lucky enough to get rid of them before they croaked. I had less than $2250 in all three of mine added together...two tutone and one SS, all in fine cosmetic condition. I traded a 14K quartz Concord dress watch on a strap even for the best tutone. The guy I traded with had basically nothing in it after he took it in on trade for a high $$ gold watch. I later traded the OQ for a 6694 and $600. Still have the 6694...the $600 is long gone. OQs are high priced hammer bait today. Imho. From "ROLEX FORUMS' Complete overhaul $2,250.00 - Electronic module - x 1 - Motor module - x 1 Refinish Bracelet Replace Clasp $185.00 - Clasp 16/100 17000b st - x 1 Refinish Case Replace Crown $46.00 - Crown with gasket 604 st - x 1 Replace Crystal $133.40