TeeJay

I'd say go into an AD, and try them both on. But not at the same time. If you do, the 45mm will appear huge in comparison to the 42mm. However, if you look at the 45mm on its own, I don't think you'll find the size an issue. With regard your other points, I've never had problems with Asian movements (other than ones I caused myself, by trying to regulate them) or with issues of water-resistance, so I don't think you'll have a problem. The Planet Ocean is a really nice watch, and one definitely worth owning Best of luck

Wow! That is Eff You Sea Kay Eye En Gee AWESOME !!!!!!!

Without knowing the replica business, I placed an order at ireplica-com. This was the worst step I could make. The shipping was slow (8 weeks) and finally I got something what is far behing my expectations. now I have this watch, but I do not like it. The chrono functions are not working and the back of the watch is different from the gen. Please have look. What can I do? Can I buy a new movment or I should purchase a new watch from a trusted supplier?

Welcome to the jungle (we've got fun and games....) sorry to hear that your first purchase didn't quite go to plan. If you're happy with the majority of the watch, then a new movement and caseback might well make it a very nice project watch. Of course, you could always just buy a whole new watch and be done with

If you really don't like the watch, I'd be happy to give it a good home

Still wearing the 029a on the 24mm OP dive strap. Haven't had the opportunity to wear one of the other straps, but it's more than stood up to the plate

Not to make waves, and, old skool's straps may well have been inspired by tootal's designs, but, personally, I think old skool's straps look nicer. I admit, the stitching obscures some of the lettering, but I think having the keepers with the printing on, is 'the icing on the cake'.

Inspired by, definitely, but enough personal input/innovation to be worthy of praise in their own right, and I don't think that says anything 'about the sort of person' old skool is, but more about tootal, for taking umbrage over a re-interpretation of an artistic idea, when, as he mentioned, immitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Awesome straps all round guys, lets take personalities out of the equasion, and appreciate the straps for the crafted art they are

PS

I really like old skool's strap with the 'football stitching' and off-set holes and tongue

Peace out.

GPF stands for Giovanni Panerai Figlio and Mod Dep for Modification Department although I am not at all sure for the 'modification'?

Could the buckle itself, have been the 'modification', ie it was fitted in replacement of a different style buckle?

I rather like my mother in law

A very interesting read Personally, I'm not over keen on them as I don't like how they stand straight out from the buckle (I much prefer the curve of the Pre-V buckles) However, I am curious about the buckle's place in history, as wether I like them or not, historic value is historic value, and more than worthy of any attached price tags

Was there a reason for their creation, such as for millitary use only, or was it simply a design the good folks at OP decided to go with on certain models?

How about something a bit 'pop arty'?

Panerai Dial through Running Water.

Considerable thought has gone into what I'm wearing today, as I'll be wearing it solidly for the next week. We're going on vacation, my 127 is in for servicing, and I didn't want to take a load of watches with me, so I had to make a choice...

Water resistance was a must, but then, all my reps are waterproof anyway, so it came down to the option of aesthetics.

I could've worn the One Eight Something, as that would keep dead on balls accurate time all week with no need to fuss about with re-setting the time, but, it's too big to go under a shirt cuff (if we were to go to a nice restaurant, for example)

The PVDd 111g would go under a cuff, but doesn't always go with everything, and, changing the straps, would mean fussing about with PVD buckles... Too much hassle, if it was a case of going out in a hurry and wanting a change... So I settled on my 029a as it's so versatile in both appearance and size. Due to the heat, I've fitted it with the 24mm OP dive strap with deployant clasp rather than buckle. This will be my 'daily beater' for the duration. Sadly, while removing the deployant clasp from my 26mm OP dive strap, the back end of the clasp decided to chew into the strap, and it now has a series of little marks on the tongue... Has it made that strap unwearable? Not quite sure... Depends how easily I can source a new OEM 26mm OP strap. I do have a spare rep strap, but the whole thing 'looks' different, and I do prefer the OEM strap... Oh well, moving on... So, I have the 029a on the dive strap via a set of River's spring bars. For times when a strap change might be necessary, I'm also taking a burgundy croc BOB strap (one of my favorites) for 'formal wear' (with polished Pre-V buckle screwed in in preperation), and a putty Toscana strap (with sewn in buckle) should I want something a little more casual, but with no fear of getting wet or sweating into the strap No need for me to muck about with any of the buckles, all I'll need to do is simply replace the straps and I'll be good to go And, at the end of things, I wound up going with a GMT watch as well, which seems to be the choice of the weekend

Sorry for the OCD ramblings, I'll try and snap some shots before I go, and certainly while away as well

I voted for $4 a month, as that is what a membership to a well-known tattoo/bodypiercing community costs.

I agree, off-shore hosting is undoubtably more expensive, but, do the other rep forums use off-shore hosting? If not, and if they don't experience any hassles because of it, it could be argued that off-shore hosting isn't really a necessity, but more of a 'belt and braces' approach, and the easiest way to cut costs.

TeeJay as a point here.

The original poster "title" was probably miss interpreted.

The point is that we all dream of a watchmaker next door that is willing to work on our reps...

If I had one, I would be delighted to walk to him and let him work on my reps instead of having them fly all over the globe.

This would not stop me to send a watch to Ziggy though.

Two different situations in my opinion.

Thanks for understanding my point

@Tee-jay

"To compare Ziggy to Monet is fine.

But.

Monet is not the only fine painter in the world."

People come ..........people go.........they are simply human, whatever their deeds and needs.

Sorry, I don't understand what you're trying to say, precicely. I agree with your point, people come and go, and are simply human, but I don't understand how that relates to the discussion about alternative watchsmiths.

Yes there are probably many unsung hero's in the modding world.

I have seen some super reps that have been no where near Ziggy someone must have done them!

If you close your mind to the fact that maybe someone else can offer the same level of quality as Ziggy you will never find them.

Ziggy has said in his post that he is not looking for new customers and will only work on reps from the selected few.

So for the vast majority Ziggy is not available so the choices seem to be live with the watch out of the box or find an alternative to Ziggy to mod it.

In a perfect world everyone could just send their stock rep and pay to have it moded by Ziggy as they want but unfortunately this is not a perfect world

If you don't try new sources you will never know

Precicely the point I was trying to make

jcmiro, I think it was a mistake to invoke the name "Ziggy" in your original post. The mere mention of that name invokes strong passions, and comments which detract from the main question: Are members interested in learning about a new source for replica watch repair and modification?

I think that the answer to that question is an unqualified YES! (Even Ziggy himself has frequently stated that there is plenty of room on the boards for others to offer these services.)

I think I read that there are 11,000 members on this board, 5,000 of whom visit on a daily basis. It stands to reason that the demand for watch servicing far outstrips Ziggy's capacity, even when he's working at a full clip.

You may want to start another topic, which does not mention Ziggy's name. Then, you will have a better chance of conducting a discussion about your watchmaker, and answering the many questions that must be answered in order to properly qualify that individual.

An excellent suggestion. The one thing I would say, is that if the OP was to start off a new topic discussing watchsmiths, and not mentioned the Zed Word, it wouldn't be long (I'd bet before the end of the first page) that someone would post something along the lines of:

"Why do you want another watchsmith?? Just send it to Ziggy!!"

and then the discussion would be back to the state it is here.

Ziggy has stated himself, that he cannot and will not, work on everyone's watches, but those which he chooses to work with. That is not a criticism of him on my part, simply a statement of fact. For those he cannot or will not work on, as mentioned above, people might still need a watchsmith, rather than just living with the watch 'out of the box', therefore, if others can mention well skilled watchsmiths, then that gives options to others. Unless anyone tries different smiths, no one will ever know.

Right now, my 127 is in pieces. Yes, that's right, pieces. I have one watchsmith servicing the movement, and will be sending the dial and hands to another for re-luming. Now, how open the first watchsmith would be to working on multiple reps, I do not know, so I wouldn't post him as a suggestion as an 'alternative watchsmith'. If others were to know of watchsmiths who would be happy working on multiple reps (and the increase in business which the forum would likely channel their way) then listing them can only be helpfull to everyone. I'll be sure to let people know what happens with the 127

WOOOW....

TeeJay, you can be my counselor in court any day!

I can't promise that you won't get 'sent down', but thanks for the vote of confidence

Personally, I think it is an incredibly reasonable suggestion, and one which does not diminish Ziggy or his unquestionable skills.

This discussion has been raised before, and normally resulted in the OP getting flamed to Hell and back, for daring to suggest that they might need/want to send their watch to someone other than Ziggy. Personally, I don't consider that an acceptable status quo. Here're the facts:

-Ziggy is an incredibly skilled artisan. No one is denying this.

-Ziggy has said himself on several occasions, that he only works with people he is happy to work with. While this is his right as an artisan, it does leave people who are not on his trusted list, pretty much 'out in the cold' when it comes to getting work done.

-Ziggy has, on several occasions, said that he is only doing this as a hobby, not as a business, and only does the work he wants to do. Same as above. This is his right, but, it does leave people with projects he does not want to work with 'out in the cold'.

-Ziggy can, and does, 'take breaks' from watchwork. This means that anyone wanting anything done to their watch, is pretty much up 5h1t creek, and having to either wait for him to resume taking comissions, or seek an alternative smith. The problem being, there is no 'alternate smith'...

To compare Ziggy to Monet is fine.

But.

Monet is not the only fine painter in the world.

Personally, I like Seurat and Hopper.

At the end of the day, what is needed for this community, are several reliable watchsmiths, who can carry out, and are prepared to work with folks on projects, so that people have choice, rather than having to rely on one watchsmith.

There is more than one watch dealer here. No one would consider Silix to be an afront to Joshua's credibility as a dealer, or Joshua to be an insult to Narikaa's. Why is this standard not being applied to watchsmithing as well?

At the end of the day, for whatever reason, people need choices and options in this area. Admiration of Ziggy's skills is one thing, but doing so when it is actually restrictive to the needs of people, is something else entirely.

I admit, there have been few other reliable smiths who have lasted the course, but, that's not to say that every smith in the future will be unreliable or unskilled...

No one can substitute Ziggy or the contributions he makes to this community. No one is suggesting that. What is being suggested, is that given Ziggy's preferences for work, it is only reasonable that there be other watchsmiths who folks could go to, should Ziggy be unable or unwilling, for whatever reason, to work on their watch. Regardless of if Ziggy is willing or able to work on someone's watch, they still need it worked on by someone, and right now, there is no 'someone' to give that option.

Actually tackling this is impossible, we can all take guesses but even if we are right we will never know.

As to your other concern, yes the idea of this thread is to harvest thoughts on how we can change the system to try and avoid this happening on a regular basis.

Ken

I can'T ThinK of many people bitter or twisted enough to want to get the forum closed down by restricting it's cashflow. Whoever it is, obviously has quite the chip on their shoulder.

Well..... The costs are what they are. As CBR mentioned, shutting down the non-supporting members would definitely cut back on bandwidth and make things cheaper. It would also make things much quieter. If the forum were to go solely subscription-only, that wouldn't bother me, I feel the information, assistance and community is worth it. But. There are many who would disagree and simply move on...

I wish I was in a position to contribute, but at the moment, my hands are financially tied, I was living dangerously when I kicked up the auction price like I did, I was just lucky someone decided to up my bid... Believe me, if I could contribute some extra for the fees, I would

Yes, I think that is what I am going to go with. I found one in the "For Sale" section I am going to pickup.

Followed by a PAM111H in the future.

Thanks a lot guys!!!

I was going to suggest a PAM 187, but was too late

However...

Can anyone answer this for me, what is the main difference between the Asian SFSO and the Swiss SFSO, just the movement?

As far as I know, just the movement.

A Vacheron Constantin Overseas I bought last year was an Asian model, but the case, in every detail, was the same as the Swiss version sold by Joshua, so I'd guess it would be the same with the SOSF

Over the weekend: 127 on rubber dive strap, modded to take deployant clasp rather than the buckle:

Tomorrow: One Eight Something on rubber dive strap (with buckle):

thoughts?

Do it.

When all is said and done and the dust finally settles, my small loss may have saved others $531,250 (1250@$425). The odds are in our favor and I feel this will make everyone open their eyes and make us less open to the "people should expect to accept defective product" mindset.

Here's hoping people will take note, and be prepared to act on it

A fascinating read, thanks for taking the time to make it so

Well said TJ. It's an insult to us everytime a dealer send out a watch with such obvious problems, what.....where we not supposed to notice? But then again, what do they care, they don't pay for the shipping back to them.

Indeed it is an insult to us. Equally so, the mindset mentioned (and raised in other threads) that people should be greatfull to receive such junk, and simply keep buying, in the hopes that once they've spent X amount, the dealer decides that they, as a client, are now 'worthy' enough to receive 'the good stuff'. I find it insulting that there are dealers who appear to be working on that principle, and equally insulting and, to be frank, downright scary, that such behaviour is glossed over by the suggestions to 'build a relationship with the dealer...' If someone goes to a restaurant, pays for a slap up meal, then spends the rest of the evening with gut-ache and rushing for the bathroom every five minutes, they're hardly likely to go back to see if they get served better food next time, and I think that's the philosophy which should be applied here.

If a dealer is a drop-shipper, then fair enough, they have no controll of what gets parcelled up, other than the hopes that the despatcher fills the order correctly, and in that circumstance, as long as they accept a return (which should be at their cost, because the error is by their 'company') then not an issue. But. Should a dealer be claiming to make personal inspections and QC, then the items should be as good as possible, given the nature of the game. Okay, so they order 500 watches from the factory, and of those, maybe 10% are unnacceptably flawed (mechanically) in that instance, that 10% should simply be scrapped or returned to the factory itself, certainly not sent out to paying clients. At the end of the day, the markup which is being put on these watches, sales of the 90% will more than cover the cost of outright junking the 10% of faulties...

Personally, I feel the time has come that these 'trusted dealers' started re-earning the right to be called thus. Proving that they are trustworthy, not just in name, but in nature.

Here are more of my thoughts. Yes, I screwed up by ordering 5 watches in a clip, dumb move I now know. In my defense, he was highly talked about and the only dealer I know with Pre-V PAMs. My losses are others gain, we now know about DSN's QC problems and they are out in the open. There are now well over 5,000 views of posts regarding DSN problems, 2108 of this thread alone. Let's say 25% of those were potential unsatisfied customers, then we saved 1250 people from going through what we have. AT the end of the day, we did OK in my book.

That's a really positive way to look at it, and it's good that you can look at it from that perspective, it's just a shame that you've been put in the situation where you've had to...

At the end of the day, both movements will tell the time, one will just cost less than the other

Personally, I can't see the point in spending extra just to have a Swiss movement, other than 'bragging rights', as the performance of Asian movements is perfectly adequate for the intended use

Latest Update

It seems that Customs has seized my return, I'm waiting for the Post Office to confirm, but that's what I've been told. I've informed DSN about the situation and he's responded. He's offered to split the loss with me, that would put me out about $700US. Not a great outcome, but I could have been out the total.

What burns me it that it would have never come to this if the watches would have been correct. The watches were returned for mechanical defects like DOA mvt, stripped screws, off centered crowns, and a lever I couldn't open. It's not like I didn't like the dial font or something, they were just unusable.

DSN and some member have said I just set too high standards for a replice, maybe their right. I'd like to apologize for taking up so much space here to vent, but I thought anyone considering buying a DSN should know what's going on with his QC lately.

I really don't see myself buying reps from dealers anytime soon, my 2 experiences (DSN and Josh) didn't go well. But funny enough, my 4 deals buying from members were perfect transactions. I guess I'll stick to Frankens and custom pieces for now, I hope I still have a place here. I guess it's time for me to learn how to work on watchs, maybe Kruzer will start a school or at least give me some pointers.

They're not right at all. We've all seen the quality of reps available, and there's no reason why that standard of reps should not be delivered to all customers, all the time. Okay, things like dial printings, fair enough, they're reps, not gens, so a little acceptance of the standard has to be given there, but, any fool can see if the watch they are packing is actually running or not, or if the screws are stripped. Or, more likely, any canny 'business man' can tell if the watch is not running, and simply hope that the client will fall for excuses of "Must've died in transit..." or "Sorry, send it back and will replace it for you..."

I think this kind of attitude from dealers and some members, shows a very dangerous mindset developing: Namely, that people should expect to accept defective product, simply because we are 'buying reps, not gens'. While I would agree that folks should not expect 100% perfect replication, the basic mechanics of the watch itself, ie movement running, screws solidly in place, etc, should be consistent for all buyers on all transactions. We all work hard for our money, and I think it's time that some dealers realized that people expect reasonable product for their money, and don't deserve to be fobbed off with DOA Junk, and then meaningless platitudes to stop the client simply requesting a refund.

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Whoops, wrong guy...